PERMIT APPLICATION RETURNED

Samuel · Apr 12, 2012

The 4th MUST hear the case. Only SCOTUS can deny cert.

MRA · Apr 12, 2012

It seems to me that when the stay is lifted that some state some butt's are on the line because you can only send it to a higher pay and grade so far. Is the sender of the letter (Lt. ????) possibly in trouble?

CrueChief · Apr 12, 2012

petergriffin said:
http://www.box.com/s/92306766413790660714

The letter attached by the original poster says the state has appealed and the 4th circuit court will hear the case. The appeal is filed, that is factual, but did the 4th circuit court agree to hear the case. Just because an appeal has been filed doesn't automaticaly mean the 4th will hear the case. If the
4th circuit court has not agreed to hear the case as of the date of the letter that was issued, the state is blatently lying and therefor had no right to return a lawful citizens application for handgun permit. Please...someone research whether the 4th circuit has agreed to hear the appeal and match the dates with this letter. I see a possible technicallity in their premature response.

the 4th HAS to hear the case

esqappellate · Apr 12, 2012

abeaty said:
That makes sense, but returning the application unprocessed is the same as a denial since the applicant still doesn't have a permit. This is especially true since the letter referenced G & S.

Why not cash the check and hold the application as they have done for all the others? Doing what they have done makes a case for having adjudicated the application, no?

It is exactly the same as a denial and, if it were me, I would treat it as such. As to why not cash the check, not cashing and returning the application delays the need to consider the application at all. The applicant may not ever refile and in the meantime their administrative time lines for applications (the ones they actually accept/process) are easier to meet The state is just making it harder to the extent they think they can get away with it. Bad judgment call, IMHO, but these guys are not being smart.

petergriffin · Apr 12, 2012

CrueChief said:
the 4th HAS to hear the case

Damn, I thought the upper court had the option of denying the appeal.

5.7 · Apr 12, 2012

abeaty said:
OK - but why treat the ones before the stay differently than the ones after the stay. Is the temporary stay not retroactive to the date of the decision?

Perception maybe? I don't know. I am not a lawyer, but law is like anything else in life, it is about perception and interpretation of meaning.

Maybe they *think* by turning down those submitted after the temp stay was effected, they are within their legal rights and by processing and sitting on those between the initial ruling and temp stay they are showing good faith towards the initial ruling? And then there is the 97% useless statistic they don't want to hurt since this new tactic was just dreamed up based on the lack of HB579?

Again, all speculation on my part, but after listening to the full session of the senate last monday, and seeing some of this state in action in other areas, nothing would surprise me. After all, it is your money and my money they waste on this, it doesn't come out of their pocket......

esqappellate · Apr 12, 2012

CrueChief said:
the 4th HAS to hear the case

right

Ruzo · Apr 12, 2012

At least you got an answer. Sorry to say it wasn't the one you were hoping for. I sent mine in March 10th they got it March 13th and, cashed my check. But, I still haven't heard any thing. Again, it sucks you couldn't be bestowed your God given rights, but keep trying Bro, we'll get there.

esqappellate · Apr 12, 2012

Handgun Permit Review Board
410-339-5010
300 E. Joppa Road, Suite 1000
Towson, MD 21286

http://www.dpscs.state.md.us/agencies/hprb.shtml

MD Code, Public Safety, § 5-312

Formerly cited as MD CODE Art. 27, § 36E

West's Annotated Code of Maryland Currentness
Public Safety (Refs & Annos)
Full text of all sections at this level Title 5. Firearms
Full text of all sections at this level Subtitle 3. Handgun Permits (Refs & Annos)
Current selection§ 5-312. Action by Board

Request for review authorized

(a)(1) A person who is denied a permit or renewal of a permit or whose permit is revoked or limited may request the Board to review the decision of the Secretary by filing a written request with the Board within 10 days after receipt of written notice of the Secretary's final action.

(2) A person whose application for a permit or renewal of a permit is not acted on by the Secretary within 90 days after submitting the application to the Secretary may request a hearing before the Board by filing a written request with the Board.

Form of review

(b) Within 90 days after receiving a request to review a decision of the Secretary, the Board shall:

(1) review the record developed by the Secretary; or

(2) conduct a hearing.

Evidence

(c) The Board may receive and consider additional evidence submitted by a party in conducting a review of the decision of the Secretary.

Decision by Board

(d)(1) Based on the Board's consideration of the record and any additional evidence, the Board shall sustain, reverse, or modify the decision of the Secretary.

(2) If the action by the Board results in the denial of a permit or renewal of a permit or the revocation or limitation of a permit, the Board shall submit in writing to the applicant or the holder of the permit the reasons for the action taken by the Board.

Administrative procedures

(e)(1) Any hearing and any subsequent proceedings of judicial review shall be conducted in accordance with Title 10, Subtitle 2 of the State Government Article.

(2) Notwithstanding paragraph (1) of this subsection, a court may not order the issuance or renewal of a permit or alter a limitation on a permit pending a final determination of the proceeding.

COMAR

http://www.dsd.state.md.us/comar/SubtitleSearch.aspx?search=12.09.01.*

http://www.dsd.state.md.us/comar/getfile.aspx?file=12.09.01.00.htm

Zaicran · Apr 12, 2012

Inigoes said:
I have a sneaky suspicion that the establishment is playing hardball after not getting Frosh's last minute amendment to HB579 approved.

I would be livid over this. Actually..I'm mad for him...

:mad54:

esqappellate · Apr 12, 2012

mkbuckingham said:
I would be livid over this. Actually..I'm mad for him...

yeah, me too.

BUFF7MM · Apr 12, 2012

I'll be curious to see how many others, upon returning home from work today, have a letter waiting for them in today's mail. :innocent0

Smagel · Apr 12, 2012

Well, we were expecting further hijinks and here they are.

I say, expect more.

teratos · Apr 12, 2012

Smagel said:
Well, we were expecting further hijinks and here they are.

I say, expect more.

For years to come.

Kman · Apr 12, 2012

MD's pat answer to most issues...ignore it or tax it.

matt.ruszala · Apr 12, 2012

I guess the MSP will keep the 97% rating.

They would not even process my application. I wanted to loose my money and they wouldn't take it. They will keep their good rating for approvals if they won't process the application. I feel that self defense is good and substantial so they should process the application.

Feel free to check the attachment. It pissed me off for sure.

Smagel · Apr 12, 2012

You're not alone.

See this, if you haven't already.

http://www.mdshooters.com/showthread.php?t=80511

lx1x · Apr 12, 2012

you are the third person (from my count). it sucks! i be mad too.

CPT Ethanolic · Apr 12, 2012

Wow... so we're seeing MD's response to people trying to assert their rights.

wildlife-monkeys-hear-no-evil-see-no-evil-speak-no-evil.jpg

jfox · Apr 12, 2012

esqappellate said:
Handgun Permit Review Board
410-339-5010
300 E. Joppa Road, Suite 1000
Towson, MD 21286

http://www.dpscs.state.md.us/agencies/hprb.shtml

MD Code, Public Safety, § 5-312

Formerly cited as MD CODE Art. 27, § 36E

West's Annotated Code of Maryland Currentness
Public Safety (Refs & Annos)
Full text of all sections at this level Title 5. Firearms
Full text of all sections at this level Subtitle 3. Handgun Permits (Refs & Annos)
Current selection§ 5-312. Action by Board

Form of review

(b) Within 90 days after receiving a request to review a decision of the Secretary, the Board shall:

(1) review the record developed by the Secretary; or

(2) conduct a hearing.

http://www.dsd.state.md.us/comar/SubtitleSearch.aspx?search=12.09.01.*

http://www.dsd.state.md.us/comar/getfile.aspx?file=12.09.01.00.htm

So the board clearly can just rubber-stamp the decision of MSP, without any right of the applicant or counsel to present a case before the board. Further, they get to take up to 90 days to choose between their (2) favorite rubber stamps:

1) "DENIED"
2) "Not Approved"

But, since they then have to give their reasoning in writing, one can then engage counsel to sue the state for violation of rights and I would have thought attorney fees and damages.

PERMIT APPLICATION RETURNED

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