So what if Hogan wins a Second term?

CrazySanMan · May 11, 2018

Jim12 said:
Silly analogy. There's no "cumulative voting," or "vote savings bank" (except maybe for Dems) and there's no cumulative payoff in the end. The Dems still outnumber the rest of us almost 2:1.

If Maryland republicans continually reject the MDGOP candidate and write in a strong historical conservative, like Thomas Jefferson or George Mason, it won't take many elections for the MDGOP to get the point and offer candidates who are more conservative.

Or you can keep taking bites from the same turd sandwich and maybe once in a while get lucky and have a peanut or piece of corn in your bite.

44man · May 11, 2018

Jim12 said:
You'd rather vote for somebody who can't ever win, thereby losing to somebody who says they'll take your guns and will do it, just so you can say you were "pure" with your vote.

I'd like to live in a mansion on a mountain top, but I'm not going to let myself be homeless because I can't achieve my utopian dream.

Hogan asked for anti gun confiscation bills and got them and signed them

He’s an anti

He will continue to be an anti

He will ask for and receive more anti gun bills if re-elected, period. What would stop him? Fear of not getting elected governor again? He will be auditioning for a higher office from the governors mansion while crushing us under his heel because he can and will have to to get elected to a higher office

Many folks here don’t want to fight for their rights.

They just want to roll over

inkd · May 11, 2018

ToolAA said:
At the end of the day I think that our reasons for voting for/against or not voting for Hogan (or any candidate) should be difficult and contemplated deeply. If more voters approached voting in this manner we might have a more responsible electorate.

I wont criticize you for what I believe is one of our most fundamental rights. The right to vote.

Regarding your last question, I think that most Evangelicals did see Trumps true colors. I’m not an evangelical person but I could easily see from his history that he was not my ideal candidate. I think I even posted as such. At the end of the day my reason for supporting him was that I was voting for a conservative appointment to SCOTUS. That was my personal calculus then and I will apply a similar calculus in the 2018 MD gubernatorial election.

God help us either way.

Trump wasn't my ideal choice either. My thoughts on the Supreme Court were my main reason for voting for him as well.

I hoped he would be a good president and try to fulfill as many campaign promises as he could. He didn't run on a platform of being pro 2A so I was hoping for the best in those regards.

So far he has not given me any reason to not want to vote for him again, which is about the best I can say about any politician.

Hogan didn't run on a pro 2A platform either. In fact, he said straight away that he would not try to overturn any of the previous firearms laws.

I voted for him in the same hopes as I voted for Trump. That he may not be exactly a friend to the 2A but that he wouldn't infringe any further. Now, I see that I was wrong in those hopes and because of that, he has lost my vote.

My reasons go beyond the firearms aspect of HB 1302. He stripped due process away from a small faction of people. That is a scary, scary thing to me and it should be to anyone on this board.

I am staggered that anyone would still cast a vote for him after that.

44man · May 11, 2018

Boondock Saint said:
It's stunning to me that so many ostensibly pro-2A will eagerly cast a vote for a guy who has signed multiple gun control bills.

This forum is still called Maryland Shooters, right?

I am telling folks Hogan’s a cult leader. He has some power over supposed gun folks and causes them to vote for him even though he’s anti gun

Squaregrouper · May 11, 2018

fred55 said:
I will not vote for an incumbent that has demonstrated a disregard for the Constitution and Bill of Rights. They have failed their Oath of Office. There are too many incumbents that fall into this category. They need to be replaced with folks that understand, and support, that Oath of Office. (period, drop the mike) Perhaps it's time for the Libertarian or Constitutional parties to replace the failing Democratic and Republican. It won't happen overnight though - just like your waiting for the Repub's in this state to grow some backbone, if ever. Fred55

My thoughts exactly.
We need a viable third party, yet most who are fed up with the GOP keep telling us to vote GOP. I'm done with it and will vote for who I feel is best for the job- regardless of their chance of winning. If everyone did this, the two party rule would end in America.

CrazySanMan · May 11, 2018

squaregrouper said:
My thoughts exactly.
We need a viable third party, yet most who are fed up with the GOP keep telling us to vote GOP. I'm done with it and will vote for who I feel is best for the job- regardless of their chance of winning. If everyone did this, the two party rule would end in America.

If you got just 5,000 republicans in MD to all write in the same conservative name instead of voting for Hogan, it would absolutely get noticed. Do the same thing for any DINO MGA members you don't like. Heck, write in John Galt for all the candidates.

In the last governor's race, Hogan beat Brown by 77,000 votes. Anyone on this forum who thinks that if they don't vote for Hogan he will lose is fooling themselves. Hogan doesn't care if you vote for him or not, and he probably prefers that you don't because he doesn't want to be associated with any of us. However, there were only 4,500 write in votes in the 2014 governor race. That is why if all the MDS members get together and write in the exact same name it will get noticed.

danb · May 11, 2018

44man said:
Hogan asked for anti gun confiscation bills and got them and signed them

He’s an anti

So did Wayne LaPierre, Chris Cox, and Donald Trump. On NRA TV Chris Cox supported red flag bills and said states should get money to implement them.

Good luck trying to convince a bunch of Maryland Republicans to out-gun the NRA. Hogan carved out a position to the right of Trump on the red flag and bump stock bill.

People can argue that the NRA sold people out, I would not disagree. But thats the past. At this point, go along, or get left behind. There is no going back.

fred55 · May 11, 2018

There is no "law" that specifies red flag bills need to violate the Bill of Rights, and an individual's right of due process. fred55

jrumann59 · May 11, 2018

Schipperke said:

So which one is Quinn????

East2West · May 11, 2018

danb said:
So did Wayne LaPierre, Chris Cox, and Donald Trump. On NRA TV Chris Cox supported red flag bills and said states should get money to implement them.

Good luck trying to convince a bunch of Maryland Republicans to out-gun the NRA. Hogan carved out a position to the right of Trump on the red flag and bump stock bill.

People can argue that the NRA sold people out, I would not disagree. But thats the past. At this point, go along, or get left behind. There is no going back.

The difference is Hogan has signed 2 anti bills into law. Trump has done nothing more than talk about it to this point. So yeah... to the right of.

Boondock Saint · May 11, 2018

Vote Hogan - Water Based Lubricant and Cheek Kisses for All

esqappellate · May 11, 2018

danb said:
^^ this. The problem here is we cannot prove a negative. Dems did not advance bills because they did not want a popular gov to veto them. Instead, they played games to strip his power, and negotiated on the remainder. With Anthony Brown (or Madaleno or Baker) as gov, the original version of the 1302 and bump stock and HPRB bills would have passed. As would a ban on rifles for 18-20 year olds, and a magazine ban like the one the Baltimore Delegation proposed. People have short memories, we beat that at the committee level.

People can complain, but MSI was very successful lobbying to strip out the worst parts of these bills. Sometimes the choice is to lose badly or lose less badly.

Good chance the GA loses some Dem seats and the veto-proof filibuster. People want Hogan in the gov office when that happens.

Shawn of the Dead Quinn is a protest toilet flush vote that puts Madaleno or Baker in the gov office, and marginalizes the rest of us.

MSI is non-partisan by charter and we don't and can't endorse candidates, but this post by Danb ^^ is quite accurate in what MSI and others were able to accomplish and how that happened. All I can say is please don't make my life harder in Annapolis by sitting out the election and allowing others to elect hard core antis. Votes matter. Participation matters. Even when we don't get what we want, we can get *some* of what we want, some of the time (or stated differently we can defeat some of the stuff we hate). Some legislators aren't always there, but sometimes they are and they can help. There is always a spectrum. We have a two party system in the United States. Almost *always* that means picking the lesser of two evils. I don't like it either, but it is the reality.

danb · May 11, 2018

East2West said:
The difference is Hogan has signed 2 anti bills into law. Trump has done nothing more than talk about it to this point. So yeah... to the right of.

Lol. Put the crack pipe down. Trump proposed bump stock ban through the ATF and said we are going to get all the guns and go to court later.

Trumps words have a funny way of turning into action n
most of the time.

SCV/SAR Patriot · May 11, 2018

And Hogan gives little puppies butterfly kisses on the lips so there's that to consider too.

Jim12 · May 11, 2018

Not_an_outlaw said:
Then you would have something to appeal. By assisting in lowering the burden of these laws, working with the other side, it's hard to make the argument that the bill in unconstitutional when you help write it.

The federal courts that you need to appeal to have judges that were largely appointed by THEM and agree with THEM. Our idea of "unconstitutional" is different from theirs. See FSA2013 litigation.

We need new FEDERAL judges, which requires Donald Trump and successors somebody like him to stay in office until the current crop of liberal life appointments retire, and for non-Establishment Republicans to maintain control of the Senate.

MAGA

Schipperke · May 11, 2018

danb said:
Lol. Put the crack pipe down. Trump proposed bump stock ban through the ATF and said we are going to get all the guns and go to court later.

Trumps words have a funny way of turning into action n
most of the time.

Yep, and lets not mention Rubio publicly bending to magazine limit laws. When Trump or Rubio give up those points publically, there is little if any room to walk it back. Hogan was on record in approval of Red Flag weeks before they passed it, and people are shocked he signed it. Heed the word "spectrum" and "two party system" of the MSI President, that is what we get to vote on.

Anyone in this thread with an every other Tuesday night ritual of watching HPRB hearings, want to start watching Jen, Liz, Vinny et al making the calls? Just that move by Hogan should tip the scale, and hold your nose and vote. All the argument put forward by those who prevail at that board now would be on deaf ears without Hogan's appointments.

Jim12 · May 11, 2018

CrazySanMan said:
If Maryland republicans continually reject the MDGOP candidate and write in a strong historical conservative, like Thomas Jefferson or George Mason, it won't take many elections for the MDGOP to get the point and offer candidates who are more conservative.

Or you can keep taking bites from the same turd sandwich and maybe once in a while get lucky and have a peanut or piece of corn in your bite.

And Maryland's overwhelmingly liberal majority will laugh at us all the way to the voting booth, as they make a clean sweep of every statewide election up and down the ballot.

Maryland will be removing statues of Thomas Jefferson and George Mason next, as soon as they're done with the Lee and Taney statues. They have George Washington in their sights. Have you heard that at George Washington University there's a movement to remove its mascot, the "Colonials," because they associate it with oppression and colonialism? They don't understand the nation's history. How to do you even carry on a rational discussion with people who are so misinformed and indoctrinated?

Boondock Saint · May 11, 2018

Jim12 said:
And Maryland's overwhelmingly liberal majority will laugh at us all the way to the voting booth, as they make a clean sweep of every statewide election up and down the ballot.

Maryland will be removing statues of Thomas Jefferson and George Mason next, as soon as they're done with the Lee and Taney statues. They have George Washington in their sights. Have you heard that at George Washington University there's a movement to remove its mascot, the "Colonials," because they associate it with oppression and colonialism? They don't understand the nation's history. How do you even carry on a rational discussion with people who are so misinformed and indoctrinated?

I've wondered that more often in recent days.

Not_an_outlaw · May 11, 2018

Jim12 said:
The federal courts that you need to appeal to have judges that were largely appointed by THEM and agree with THEM. Our idea of "unconstitutional" is different from theirs. See FSA2013 litigation.

We need new FEDERAL judges, which requires Donald Trump and successors somebody like him to stay in office until the current crop of liberal life appointments retire, and for non-Establishment Republicans to maintain control of the Senate.

MAGA

Yes agree. You are sure to fail locally, but the big picture is that if you had a crappy law, you'd have a better chance at getting it to court. And nationally, the federal court is changing, like the rest of free America. It's just that Maryland isn't changing.

Jim12 · May 11, 2018

Not_an_outlaw said:
Yes agree. You are sure to fail locally, but the big picture is that if you had a crappy law, you'd have a better chance at getting it to court. And nationally, the federal court is changing, like the rest of free America. It's just that Maryland isn't changing.

The federal courts have the FINAL say about what laws meet Constitutional muster and which ones don't.

The Left figured that out long ago, and have spent decades packing the courts and legal profession.

Conservatives, duh, have slowly woke, thanks in part to the great, late, outspoken and well loved Antonin Scalia, and more recently to Donald J. Trump.

The Supreme Court could blow away FSA2013, HB3102, and all the rest of them with the stroke of a pen (ok, five out of nine pens) with right Court makeup and the right cases before it. DJT needs to nominate and a Republican Senate needs to confirm at least one, preferably three more (or more).

The Republicans MUST hold the Senate, and we MUST keep the Left's conspiracy, now piloted by Rod Rosenstein and Mueller who remain in control, from damaging DJT's ability to make lots more judicial appointments.

So what if Hogan wins a Second term?

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