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Old March 15th, 2019, 10:28 AM #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by budman93 View Post
According to amendments in the other thread it now only applies to guns completed with computer controlled devices.
Read the definition of computer. It includes the human brain.
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Old March 15th, 2019, 12:04 PM #32
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Originally Posted by Rab1515 View Post
Read the definition of computer. It includes the human brain.
(C) (1) “COMPUTER–AIDED FABRICATION DEVICE” MEANS A
26 COMPUTER–CONTROLLED DEVICE OR MACHINE CAPABLE OF OPERATING:
27 (I) ON PHYSICAL MATERIAL OR MEDIA TO MANUFACTURE OR
28 FABRICATE AN OBJECT;
4 HOUSE BILL 740
1 (II) USING SPECIFICATIONS CONTAINED IN COMPUTER
2 CONTROL LANGUAGE, A COMPUTER PROGRAM, COMPUTER SOFTWARE, OR A
3 COMPUTER DATABASE; AND
4 (III) WITHOUT THE DIRECT AND CONTINUOUS CONTROL OF A
5 PERSON.


So, your brain is not being directly and continuously controlled by a person. Makes sense. Good grief.
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Old March 15th, 2019, 12:35 PM #33
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Originally Posted by fabsroman View Post
(C) (1) “COMPUTER–AIDED FABRICATION DEVICE” MEANS A
26 COMPUTER–CONTROLLED DEVICE OR MACHINE CAPABLE OF OPERATING:
27 (I) ON PHYSICAL MATERIAL OR MEDIA TO MANUFACTURE OR
28 FABRICATE AN OBJECT;
4 HOUSE BILL 740
1 (II) USING SPECIFICATIONS CONTAINED IN COMPUTER
2 CONTROL LANGUAGE, A COMPUTER PROGRAM, COMPUTER SOFTWARE, OR A
3 COMPUTER DATABASE; AND
4 (III) WITHOUT THE DIRECT AND CONTINUOUS CONTROL OF A
5 PERSON.


So, your brain is not being directly and continuously controlled by a person. Makes sense. Good grief.
This distinction is rather thin. The section you quoted attempts to define the term "COMPUTER-AIDED FABRICATION DEVICE" but then the section immediately following (2) says it includes "A COMPUTER CONTROLLED: II CUTTING MACHINE...IV MILLING MACHINE", which seems to extend the blanket onto ANY cutting or milling machine controlled by something which fits their definition of a computer, defined later as "(i) an electronic, magnetic, optical, organic, or other data processing device or system that performs logical, arithmetic, memory, or storage functions.", which would indeed include the human brain.

Yes it's semantics, but this is potentially going to be a law, so I don't think the angst is unwarranted, especially considering the attitude of those pushing it.
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Old March 15th, 2019, 01:14 PM #34
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Originally Posted by Malleovic View Post
This distinction is rather thin. The section you quoted attempts to define the term "COMPUTER-AIDED FABRICATION DEVICE" but then the section immediately following (2) says it includes "A COMPUTER CONTROLLED: II CUTTING MACHINE...IV MILLING MACHINE", which seems to extend the blanket onto ANY cutting or milling machine controlled by something which fits their definition of a computer, defined later as "(i) an electronic, magnetic, optical, organic, or other data processing device or system that performs logical, arithmetic, memory, or storage functions.", which would indeed include the human brain.

Yes it's semantics, but this is potentially going to be a law, so I don't think the angst is unwarranted, especially considering the attitude of those pushing it.
You obviously do not understand what the AND means between 3 AND 4.

It means that a Computer Fabrication Device must do everything WITHOUT THE DIRECT AND CONTINUOUS CONTROL OF A PERSON.

So, telling me that your brain is an organic computer, even if that meets the definition, still does not make it a Computer Fabrication Device because it is always operating WITH the direct and continuous control of a person.

So, a person using a drill press, a router, etc. without the aid of a computer running those items with no input from a person, would still be legal.

Continuous is a little tough, but I have no idea how I would finish out an 80 without continuous input on the machines I am using to finish it.
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Old March 15th, 2019, 01:24 PM #35
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Originally Posted by fabsroman View Post
...

...Continuous is a little tough, but I have no idea how I would finish out an 80 without continuous input on the machines I am using to finish it.
Even with a 3D printer, it requires continuous monitoring and input to ensure:

A: The part doesn't pop off the build platform
B: You don't get an error like a layer shift
C: You don't burn your house down from a thermal runaway on a cheap printer.

The law is too vague and open to too much interpretation by an overly imaginative future prosecutor.
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Old March 15th, 2019, 01:28 PM #36
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Originally Posted by mrbob1000 View Post
Even with a 3D printer, it requires continuous monitoring and input to ensure:

A: The part doesn't pop off the build platform
B: You don't get an error like a layer shift
C: You don't burn your house down from a thermal runaway on a cheap printer.

The law is too vague and open to too much interpretation by an overly imaginative future prosecutor.
The Ghost Gunner CNC does not need attending.
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Old March 15th, 2019, 01:29 PM #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fabsroman View Post
You obviously do not understand what the AND means between 3 AND 4.

It means that a Computer Fabrication Device must do everything WITHOUT THE DIRECT AND CONTINUOUS CONTROL OF A PERSON.

So, telling me that your brain is an organic computer, even if that meets the definition, still does not make it a Computer Fabrication Device because it is always operating WITH the direct and continuous control of a person.

So, a person using a drill press, a router, etc. without the aid of a computer running those items with no input from a person, would still be legal.

Continuous is a little tough, but I have no idea how I would finish out an 80 without continuous input on the machines I am using to finish it.
I assume you mean between (II) and (III) under item (1) (line 25)? Unless we're reading different versions.

I understand what you're saying, but the language of the bill does not sufficiently indicate to me that item (2) in that section could not be used to cast the net farther than you are choosing to entertain. Item (1) stands alongside it, rather than explicitly restricting it.
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Old March 15th, 2019, 01:51 PM #38
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Originally Posted by teratos View Post
The Ghost Gunner CNC does not need attending.
Get them to add a shut off in the program at each machining step which requires a manual restart and then it does. We program stop points for recalibration in to the CNC machines at work. Despite it being CNC a guy sits with it all day.
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Old March 15th, 2019, 01:54 PM #39
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Originally Posted by mrbob1000 View Post

The law is too vague and open to too much interpretation by an overly imaginative future prosecutor.
Those are pre-requisites for every gun law those morons pass.
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Old March 15th, 2019, 03:19 PM #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rab1515 View Post
Read the definition of computer. It includes the human brain.
I don't think organic in the definition of computer is an issue currently since the bill prohibits manufacture with a "computer-aided fabrication device" which by their definition is a "device or machine capable of operating ... without the direct and continuous control of a person."

So a drill/dremel etc controlled by my brain is not a "computer-aided fabrication device"

Its still a steaming pile but nothing there makes a hand finished 80% illegal as of yet.
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