Gun owner arrested for his child's stupidity

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  • Inigoes

    Head'n for the hills
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 21, 2008
    49,365
    SoMD / West PA
    It would to a point.

    That would drop the accessible firearm charge, and possibly the reckless endangerment charges.

    The nightstand guns in the kids room were the main evidence to charge the parent, and dig deeper. If that evidence were removed, the parent probably would not have been charged.

    He would still lose his FFLs most likely over the illegal firearm transfer.
     

    slsc98

    Ultimate Member
    May 24, 2012
    6,746
    Escaped MD-stan to WNC Smokies
    I K-N-O-W Dave Fairfax, I have completed two transfers through him and I have met and spent time with his family and particularly his boys. Never so much as a hint of anything racist or the least bit violent out of those two boys, ever in my presence. Rather, they were always the epitome of safe manual at arms and totally respectful of firearms ... not even any hint of so much as horseplay.

    NO WAY I see those boys ever stating they intended harm to anyone else; more than likely a social media discussion about current tragedy in FL in which they probably responded to anti- arguments by countering “more gun control” is not the answer, “we could easily circumvent any “more gun control” measures (and therefore; so could any lunatic and surpass the # of victims elsewhere)

    Reading the comments of ‘jomari’ on baynet sounds like a neighbor disgruntled over a FFL neighbor’s kids wearing MAGA (or heaven forbid, NRA) tee shirts around the neighborhood taking credit for finding a perfect way to f^ck with said FFL and couldn’t be more pleased what they started turned into a snowball rolling down hill turning into a freight train.

    I can’t speak to assinuations of “handguns in the kids’ nightstands” so, I am anxious to see where THE TRUTH actually plays out with respect to that; probably be years from now and NEVER any retraction or absolution, let alone any attempt at correcting inaccuracies in the media spin going on right now. I can say that, as early as 7 years of age I had a 2-gun rifle rack hanging on the wall in my bedroom, with a .22 riddle and .410 shotgun on it.

    What I didn’t have (and still won’t touch with a 10-foot pole) is access to social media (which, to my mind, is THE REAL storyline underlying these “investigations”) but, I will have to wait and see where the truth plays out and falls with respect to social media postings.

    I CAN speak to Dave’s conduct as an FFL — NO CORNERS CUT intentionally but again, I am anxious to know THE TRUTH underlying the “illegal firearm transfer” charge, with the same skepticism regarding the record ever being set straight, once everything gets before a judge. Having worked with the ATF and as just about any FFL can attest, it is nearly impossible for them to not find an undotted ‘i’ or uncrossed ‘t’ if they’re intent on doing so. And, based on my own 30-years in law enforcement, listening to the presser I can see where “the meeting” involving MSP and ATF following the school resource deputy’s “subsequent investigation” (involving her likely recoiling in horror after viewing social media pictures of the boys target-shooting) turned into a classic “pig pile.” Again, I hope and pray I am not wrong but, I somehow seriously doubt that I am ...

    But, as is evident from the comments of the neighbor ‘jomari’ on baynet.com, take notice if you’re looking for a PERFECT way to turn “see something say something” into dropping a nuclear bomb on any gun-owner you know, with kids —for the foreseeable future this will be better than anonymously accusing someone you have a beef with of being a child molester.

    I am really, REALLY anxious to see where THE FACTS and THE TRUTH materialize amidst all this ... but, it won’t matter; pretty evident Dave’s life is destroyed for the time being. This WILL be a test of his faith but, based on my dealings with him, he will pass.
     

    Inigoes

    Head'n for the hills
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 21, 2008
    49,365
    SoMD / West PA
    I can’t speak to assinuations of “handguns in the kids’ nightstands” so, I am anxious to see where THE TRUTH actually plays out with respect to that; probably be years from now and NEVER any retraction or absolution, let alone any attempt at correcting inaccuracies in the media spin going on right now. I can say that, as early as 7 years of age I had a 2-gun rifle rack hanging on the wall in my bedroom, with a .22 riddle and .410 shotgun on it.

    When it comes to handguns, think of minor children as "prohibited persons" in Maryland's eyes. The only thing that prohibits the minors from possessing a handgun on their own (unsupervised), is their age.

    Once law enforcement finds a handgun in possession of a prohibited person, they will dig deeper, especially in Saint Marys.
     

    lx1x

    Peanut Gallery
    Apr 19, 2009
    26,992
    Maryland
    Saw the news on fb last night.

    Things that I'm curious.. who were the kids talking to. And what's heard.. ie. Only heard portion of the discussion (they talking about other kids bringing gun in school) vs they actually are the ones going to bring said gun in school.
     

    lx1x

    Peanut Gallery
    Apr 19, 2009
    26,992
    Maryland
    What technically counts as having your guns "locked up and inaccessible to children"? Does it have to be a safe, or is a locked drawer with keys hidden OK?
    Don't quote me..

    It's the easy access.. where they can grab the gun..

    safes are the best solution but.. locked drawer/storage is fine.. so kids cant physically grab/hold the gun.
     

    iggy

    Banned
    BANNED!!!
    Feb 26, 2013
    2,168
    I K-N-O-W Dave Fairfax, I have completed two transfers through him and I have met and spent time with his family and particularly his boys. Never so much as a hint of anything racist or the least bit violent out of those two boys, ever in my presence. Rather, they were always the epitome of safe manual at arms and totally respectful of firearms ... not even any hint of so much as horseplay.

    NO WAY I see those boys ever stating they intended harm to anyone else; more than likely a social media discussion about current tragedy in FL in which they probably responded to anti- arguments by countering “more gun control” is not the answer, “we could easily circumvent any “more gun control” measures (and therefore; so could any lunatic and surpass the # of victims elsewhere)

    Reading the comments of ‘jomari’ on baynet sounds like a neighbor disgruntled over a FFL neighbor’s kids wearing MAGA (or heaven forbid, NRA) tee shirts around the neighborhood taking credit for finding a perfect way to f^ck with said FFL and couldn’t be more pleased what they started turned into a snowball rolling down hill turning into a freight train.

    I can’t speak to assinuations of “handguns in the kids’ nightstands” so, I am anxious to see where THE TRUTH actually plays out with respect to that; probably be years from now and NEVER any retraction or absolution, let alone any attempt at correcting inaccuracies in the media spin going on right now. I can say that, as early as 7 years of age I had a 2-gun rifle rack hanging on the wall in my bedroom, with a .22 riddle and .410 shotgun on it.

    What I didn’t have (and still won’t touch with a 10-foot pole) is access to social media (which, to my mind, is THE REAL storyline underlying these “investigations”) but, I will have to wait and see where the truth plays out and falls with respect to social media postings.

    I CAN speak to Dave’s conduct as an FFL — NO CORNERS CUT intentionally but again, I am anxious to know THE TRUTH underlying the “illegal firearm transfer” charge, with the same skepticism regarding the record ever being set straight, once everything gets before a judge. Having worked with the ATF and as just about any FFL can attest, it is nearly impossible for them to not find an undotted ‘i’ or uncrossed ‘t’ if they’re intent on doing so. And, based on my own 30-years in law enforcement, listening to the presser I can see where “the meeting” involving MSP and ATF following the school resource deputy’s “subsequent investigation” (involving her likely recoiling in horror after viewing social media pictures of the boys target-shooting) turned into a classic “pig pile.” Again, I hope and pray I am not wrong but, I somehow seriously doubt that I am ...

    But, as is evident from the comments of the neighbor ‘jomari’ on baynet.com, take notice if you’re looking for a PERFECT way to turn “see something say something” into dropping a nuclear bomb on any gun-owner you know, with kids —for the foreseeable future this will be better than anonymously accusing someone you have a beef with of being a child molester.

    I am really, REALLY anxious to see where THE FACTS and THE TRUTH materialize amidst all this ... but, it won’t matter; pretty evident Dave’s life is destroyed for the time being. This WILL be a test of his faith but, based on my dealings with him, he will pass.

    39 unsecured firearms is not being a conscientious FFL. the rules clearly state that the firearms have to be locked up when they are stored.
    We can debate the validity of the actual complaint, but if Dave hadn't given access to his kids, their "threats" wouldn't have been taken seriously.

    what I don't understand is that, according to the article, the police came and talked to the family about the allegations and then came back later with a warrant. Why wouldn't a competent parent leave those firearms unsecured knowing their kids were facing those allegations? Why would he leave them out and about knowing he was under scrutiny?
     

    Inigoes

    Head'n for the hills
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 21, 2008
    49,365
    SoMD / West PA
    39 unsecured firearms is not being a conscientious FFL. the rules clearly state that the firearms have to be locked up when they are stored.
    We can debate the validity of the actual complaint, but if Dave hadn't given access to his kids, their "threats" wouldn't have been taken seriously.

    what I don't understand is that, according to the article, the police came and talked to the family about the allegations and then came back later with a warrant. Why wouldn't a competent parent leave those firearms unsecured knowing their kids were facing those allegations? Why would he leave them out and about knowing he was under scrutiny?

    The video answers your questions.

    There were 2 warrants. First one was for any unsecured firearms during the initial chat.

    The second warrant, was based on the finding from the first visit: the BATFE wanted all of the FFL related firearms confiscated.
     

    iggy

    Banned
    BANNED!!!
    Feb 26, 2013
    2,168
    The video answers your questions.

    There were 2 warrants. First one was for any unsecured firearms during the initial chat.

    The second warrant, was based on the finding from the first visit: the BATFE wanted all of the FFL related firearms confiscated.

    according to the story there were three visits. The first at midnight was just a visit. They came back later with a warrant and found the unsecured firearms. They came back a third time with a second warrant and retrieved the secured firearms.
    am I miss reading it?
     

    zoostation

    , ,
    Moderator
    Jan 28, 2007
    22,857
    Abingdon
    The way that law's written they're going to lose the access by a minor charge unless they can prove the kid actually gained possession of the gun, and they should already know that. The way the law is written, whether one agrees with it or not, is the child has to actually gain access to the firearm. Not just potentially be able to gain access. The way it's worded is should have known the child "would" gain access. I've seen similar cases before, all were either nolle pros'd by the state's attorney or lost at trial.

    I'm not a lawyer, yada yada yada.

    Edited to add I just read the part about the nightstand guns in the kids rooms. Sorry posting off a phone and I don't always get a chance to read as much as I should before I write. In my opinion that may cause a problem on the unsupervised access charge for him. Maybe. I still think it's a far reach for them to make a reckless endangerment charge stick though. Just my opinions
     

    vgplayer

    Ultimate Member
    Jan 17, 2013
    1,069
    King George, VA
    I'm very curious to get the details about the conversions that prompted the concerned citizen to report it and the investigation that followed. I was speaking with a coworker about school security the other day and I'm sure that could easily be misunderstood by a third party that wasn't there for the entire conversation as some sort of plan.
     

    iggy

    Banned
    BANNED!!!
    Feb 26, 2013
    2,168
    I'm very curious to get the details about the conversions that prompted the concerned citizen to report it and the investigation that followed. I was speaking with a coworker about school security the other day and I'm sure that could easily be misunderstood by a third party that wasn't there for the entire conversation as some sort of plan.
    sounds like at least one kid was already on the safety officers radar, and they interviewed everyone who might have heard what was said.
    of course that is the LEO side of the story as reported by a local outlet
    Cameron credited Corporal Angela Delozier with her help during the investigation. Delozier is the school resource officer at Leonardtown High School. She has raised concerns in the past about the suspects’ social media posts, including pictures of them with firearms. Delozier had addressed her concerns with parents at the time.

    Smith couldn’t comment on whether either suspect had disciplinary problems in school in the past.

    Delozier also interviewed every student who was on the bus to learn what they may have heard and the school provided investigators with video from the bus security camera.
    http://www.thebaynet.com/articles/0218/vigilant-student-thwarts-potential-mass-shooting.html
     

    vgplayer

    Ultimate Member
    Jan 17, 2013
    1,069
    King George, VA
    17fdd9fe-aaab-4f8d-b51e-ce3eb953babe.jpg

    Based on the presence of the passports, particularly the red one, this appears to be from the fathers night stand. Article only mentions handguns being found in the children's night stands' but shows a picture that I don't feel doesn't demonstrate that. Not trying to defend anything but I am very hesitant with the media, even local.
     

    Inigoes

    Head'n for the hills
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 21, 2008
    49,365
    SoMD / West PA
    Yes

    However, if Dave Fairfax was stationed overseas, a dependent is eligible to receive the Maroon (aka red) passport. It eliminates the need for any visa, if one is required.

    Just to get a sign off is a PITA for a Maroon passport. It must have been a bigger PITA for a visa requirement. The lesser of 2 PITAs...
     

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