Rem 700 22 250 project

I have a Walmart special rem 700 22 250 that I have been toying with the idea of making a summer project out of. It has the cheap synthetic stock with a sporter weight barrel and has so so accuracy.

I originally just wanted to change the stock and do a Timney trigger but I have been looking into having it rebarreled to something a little heavier. I know the cheaper alternative is to find a take off heavy varmit barrel but I’m open to a custom barrel if anybody has any suggestions. Also is it worth getting the action blue printed while I’m at it? I’m not trying to spend a fortune on it but I also don’t want to cut any corners to save a few bucks if it’s going to be detrimental to the accuracy.
I want to stick with the 22 250 because I love the versatility of the cartridge. That being said I will probably stick to the heavier bullets so from what I have read a 1-8 or 1-9 twist is a good compromise?

I would love to be able to do all the work myself but I realize that some processes are above my skill set. I will be looking for a reputable gunsmith to handle the stuff I can’t. Thanks

firemn260 said:

I have a Walmart special rem 700 22 250 that I have been toying with the idea of making a summer project out of. It has the cheap synthetic stock with a sporter weight barrel and has so so accuracy.

I originally just wanted to change the stock and do a Timney trigger but I have been looking into having it rebarreled to something a little heavier...

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Getting rid of a flexible stock in favor of something more rigid will give you immediate improvement in handling influenced precision.

The factory trigger, when properly adjusted, will not prevent you from achieving good results if everything else is in order. If everything else is NOT in order, your new trigger will not fix it.

...I know the cheaper alternative is to find a take off heavy varmit barrel but I’m open to a custom barrel if anybody has any suggestions...

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Re-using take off barrels is seldom a good answer. The firing of the rifle will work harden the chamber walls and make re-reaming the chamber almost impossible without boring out the existing chamber and setting the barrel back substantially. Trying to cut a used chamber a few thousandths deeper will typically kill your reamer.

There are several ways to approach this. On a budget, you can send the barreled action to E.R.Shaw and have them install a new barrel. They have a "hunting accuracy" expectation if no other work is done. Trouble is, the barrel is only one component of a system and if other components are lacking, simply screwing on a new barrel may not help at all.

Also is it worth getting the action blue printed while I’m at it?

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Typically: Yes.

I’m not trying to spend a fortune on it but I also don’t want to cut any corners to save a few bucks if it’s going to be detrimental to the accuracy.

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Here is the situation:

Many times, the original barrel shoots fine, but there are issues with the action. Bolt face not square, lug contact uneven, action face and/or barrel threads not square to the bolt bore...

Many times, the action is OK, but the barrel is bad. Flaws can include long, rough throats, machine tool marks, non-concentric chambers, threads not square to the barrel bore...

Because we don't know what the problems are until we get into it, about the only way you'll ever get a guarantee on performance is to allow the gunsmith to straighten up the bolt and action as he installs a new barrel.

For your usage, you might contact a local gunsmith like Ed Harren and see what he can do for you. You can also legally send your barreled action or firearm directly to and from an FFL and many/most barrel manufacturers provide this gunsmithing service.

You can also get a premium barrel and have Ed or WAR Rifles do a full blown precision package for you and the average Remington 700 has great potential. With a premium barrel and first class 'smith, 1/4" to 3/8" 100 yard groups are routine from a reworked M700.

As another option, should you be mechanically inclined, you can buy a short-chambered barrel, finish reamer, headspace gauge, barrel vise and action wrench and do it yourself. I installed an E.R. Shaw barrel in this manner and used a PTG reamer to finish it and it shoots great. I used it for a student rifle and carried it to matches myself.

I want to stick with the 22 250 because I love the versatility of the cartridge. That being said I will probably stick to the heavier bullets so from what I have read a 1-8 or 1-9 twist is a good compromise?

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I really enjoy my own .22-250s and have had at least one continuously since the early 70s.

The faster twist will definitely give you more versatility with heavier bullets. Mine has a 1:14 and won'd work with anything past the 55 BTHP or 60 FB. You may not have best results with lighter bullets and may need to avoid the 40-45 grainers. I'd probably go to 1:9 myself and play with the 69s and 75/77s.

Long distance .22s are a bit of a conundrum to me. We can use heavy bullets in the .22-250 and it shoots like a laser when compared to the fabulous .223, but what do we do with it once it gets there? The bullets are so light, it will be extremely hard to be competitive on steel targets. This is due to being so difficult to spot, with hits not always being counted and misses being lost in the background. Even a .243/6mmRem class cartridge, impacts are lost...hits get lost and misses don't provide data for corrections. F-class and other paper sports are a great venue for a light, fast bullet, but once we get below 6mm, we start to lose our competitive edge as the lighter bullets drift more. Bullets designed for long range seldom expand properly on game and so we reach a point of diminishing returns, in which we can place bullets further than they are effective or humane.

Thank you for taking the time to spell that all out for me.

A friend of mine does have a finish reamer and head space gauges for the 22 250 and I forgot that His brother in law is a marine armorer at quantico so I do have that option as long as he can find some spare time to do some work for me.

I really like the HS stocks but I really have to decide weather I want to keep it a practical walking hunting rifle or a full on bench gun.

I have never really been a tight group junkie but ever since I got into reloading I have broken in to a realm of accuracy that I have not been previously used to. The rifle shoots well enough as is that I can kill what ever it is that I’m aiming at, and that’s always been good enough for me. Lately though I have found that squeezing the most accuracy out of any gun I’m shooting is a satisfying thrill. As Lary Potterfield from midway says” only a accurate rifle is interesting”

As I said thank you for your input and I will keep you up to date on what direction I go with it.

firemn260 said:

Thank you for taking the time to spell that all out for me.

A friend of mine does have a finish reamer and head space gauges for the 22 250 and I forgot that His brother in law is a marine armorer at quantico so I do have that option as long as he can find some spare time to do some work for me.

I really like the HS stocks but I really have to decide weather I want to keep it a practical walking hunting rifle or a full on bench gun.

I have never really been a tight group junkie but ever since I got into reloading I have broken in to a realm of accuracy that I have not been previously used to. The rifle shoots well enough as is that I can kill what ever it is that I’m aiming at, and that’s always been good enough for me. Lately though I have found that squeezing the most accuracy out of any gun I’m shooting is a satisfying thrill. As Lary Potterfield from midway says” only a accurate rifle is interesting”

As I said thank you for your input and I will keep you up to date on what direction I go with it.

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Curious OP, what sort of groupings are you seeing out of your rifle in its current configuration, now that you've gotten into reloading?

Also, you make a great point given your mention of hunting with your rifle. My varmint weight .22-250's will definitely outshoot my sporter weight. But as hunting precision goes, not by all that much, when considered in practical rather than percentage terms. And a trip or two with my varmint weight rifle always reminds me that it is definitely not something that lends itself well to being lugged around.

firemn260 said:

...I really like the HS stocks but I really have to decide weather I want to keep it a practical walking hunting rifle or a full on bench gun.

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HS stocks are available in a wide variety of models, including a relatively lightweight version for the Rem 700 VS and an even more compact/lighter model for the LTR.....

As Lary Potterfield from midway says” only a accurate rifle is interesting”

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Aaarrghhh...Larry F'N Potterfield...ugh...

Please know that quote "Only accurate rifles are interesting." was by Colonel Townsend Whelen, probably said while Mr. Potterfield was still just a gleam in his daddy's eye.

I think the only original quote attributed to Mr. Potterfield was "Here, hold my beer and watch me make a ton of money off these guys copying stuff offshore.", but I'm not positive about that.

E.Shell said:

HS stocks are available in a wide variety of models, including a relatively lightweight version for the Rem 700 VS and an even more compact/lighter model for the LTR.....Aaarrghhh...Larry F'N Potterfield...ugh...

Please know that quote "Only accurate rifles are interesting." was by Colonel Townsend Whelen, probably said while Mr. Potterfield was still just a gleam in his daddy's eye.

I think the only original quote attributed to Mr. Potterfield was "Here, hold my beer and watch me make a ton of money off these guys copying stuff offshore.", but I'm not positive about that.

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Sorry I struck a nerve I was unaware that wasn’t his original quote. I don’t buy anything from midway if it makes a difference, to over priced imo.
Here your helping me out and all and I bring up a sore subject lol

Uncle Duke said:

Curious OP, what sort of groupings are you seeing out of your rifle in its current configuration, now that you've gotten into reloading?

Also, you make a great point given your mention of hunting with your rifle. My varmint weight .22-250's will definitely outshoot my sporter weight. But as hunting precision goes, not by all that much, when considered in practical rather than percentage terms. And a trip or two with my varmint weight rifle always reminds me that it is definitely not something that lends itself well to being lugged around.

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I haven’t had a chance to work on loads for the 22 250 yet. I have been busy working up rounds for my 6.8., which I am more than impressed with how that’s going by the way.

With factory ammo primarily vmax bullets I was getting 1 1/2” with a few 1 moa groups here and there but not consistent. Foxes out to 300 yards is no problem but I would say that head shooting a ground hog at that distance would be pushing it. It seems once the barrel would start to heat up it will throw a flyer here and there too. I’m also sure the barrel is not free floated in the Tupperware stock it’s in. I bought the gun used so I’m not quite sure of round count or what was shot through it. Reason I called it a Walmart special is because it’s the type of base model that they normaly carry. ADL I’m guessing is what it is.

Lugging around a little more weight really isn’t a big deal to me if it means I have a bit more precision at my disposal. I guess there are trade offs.
I haul around a H&R ultra slugger during deer season and even though it’s like slinging a siege mortar over my shoulder it shoots like a laser.

firemn260 said:

I haven’t had a chance to work on loads for the 22 250 yet. I have been busy working up rounds for my 6.8., which I am more than impressed with how that’s going by the way.

With factory ammo primarily vmax bullets I was getting 1 1/2” with a few 1 moa groups here and there but not consistent. Foxes out to 300 yards is no problem but I would say that head shooting a ground hog at that distance would be pushing it. It seems once the barrel would start to heat up it will throw a flyer here and there too. I’m also sure the barrel is not free floated in the Tupperware stock it’s in. I bought the gun used so I’m not quite sure of round count or what was shot through it. Reason I called it a Walmart special is because it’s the type of base model that they normaly carry. ADL I’m guessing is what it is.

Lugging around a little more weight really isn’t a big deal to me if it means I have a bit more precision at my disposal. I guess there are trade offs.
I haul around a H&R ultra slugger during deer season and even though it’s like slinging a siege mortar over my shoulder it shoots like a laser.

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Let us know what you wind up doing. While a new stock may well prove to be very much worthwhile in and of itself, unless you’re looking for a project, you might want to consider trying a few handloads before you start making wholesale changes. I say that only because I’d be willing to bet that you can get that rifle from 1.5 MOA to inside of MOA in relatively short order. That’s why I asked what I did, as that cartridge is definitely capable of better. I guess what I’m suggesting here is that you might not have to do much more than some good load development to wind up with a lightweight rifle that’s plenty precise enough to meet your requirements. Or maybe not, and you’re looking for tight tight. But I figured I’d put the thought out there. Good Luck!

firemn260 said:

Sorry I struck a nerve I was unaware that wasn’t his original quote. I don’t buy anything from midway if it makes a difference, to over priced imo.
Here your helping me out and all and I bring up a sore subject lol

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I'm not here to pick sides E.Shell is a very knowledgeable person and
"hands on" will help / advise anyone, there are others on here also,
like I've said before "they might not come across the right way" but
they are more than willing to help, there is a wealth of info here. I
would be the first one to throw my hand up in the air, I surely don't
know everything, everyday is a learning experience, how you take it
or use it, is all on you. Businesses are in for it to make money, marketing
plans is a big part of it.....

Let us know how it works out...
we all learn from our mistakes..

-Rock

firemn260 said:

Sorry I struck a nerve I was unaware that wasn’t his original quote. I don’t buy anything from midway if it makes a difference, to over priced imo.
Here your helping me out and all and I bring up a sore subject lol

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LOL, no worries, just calling 'em the way I see 'em.

Rockzilla said:

I'm not here to pick sides E.Shell is a very knowledgeable person and
"hands on" will help / advise anyone, there are others on here also,
like I've said before "they might not come across the right way" but
they are more than willing to help, there is a wealth of info here. I
would be the first one to throw my hand up in the air, I surely don't
know everything, everyday is a learning experience, how you take it
or use it, is all on you. Businesses are in for it to make money, marketing
plans is a big part of it.....

Let us know how it works out...
we all learn from our mistakes..

-Rock

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Thank you. I probably did seem to come on a little strong and didn't mean to.

Uncle Duke said:

...While a new stock may well prove to be very much worthwhile in and of itself, unless you’re looking for a project, you might want to consider trying a few handloads before you start making wholesale changes. I say that only because I’d be willing to bet that you can get that rifle from 1.5 MOA to inside of MOA in relatively short order...

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You're probably right about load selection and handloading making a noticeable difference. Not sure what current factory ammo availability is, but Federal 40 Blitz and 55 BTHPs always shot well in my rifles. For most calibers, I'd look at something sporting a 'Ballistic Tip' style bullet.

I'd also bet money (*void where prohibited by law) that the tupperware stock is so hard to shoot well that you can keep making the same mistakes and still cut your group size in half just going to an HS Precision stock, let alone something actually 'hard', like a Manners or McMillan. Were this my own rifle, I'd stick it in another stock before doing any other mechanical tinkering at all.

The reason the plastic stocks are so difficult to shoot well is that they have enough elasticity to store an inordinate amount of energy from unconsciously stressing the rifle on the rest. As an example, if one sits the rifle on pedestal rest and rear bag and it is slightly misaligned, it is easy to simply use your cheek or firing hand to push the rifle into the target. The trouble is, when the shot is fired, the elastic energy stored in the stock via you pushing on it is released during recoil. That shot will not go to the same point of impact as a bullet from the same setup that is not pushed into alignment, or if it was pushed the other way to get there.

When you go to a less flexible stock, like an HS or similar, it has less elasticity and it stores less random energy when you push on it inconsistently. For the same misalignment on the rest or bipod/bag, a less flexible stock will store and release less energy during recoil, and thus displace poorly executed shots to a lesser degree.

When you go to a McMillan or Manners stock, they are almost impossible to bend and when you push on it, the whole rig moves and the stock stores very little energy. Smaller amounts of stored energy equates to smaller distances that sloppy handling tosses your shots.

The same principle of releasing stored energy during recoil can also be observed when we change recoil magnitude and nothing else. A.22 rimfire has very little recoil reaction and thus is quite forgiving of an inconsistent hold (or a soft stock). When we go to a larger caliber, like the .22-250, handling more readily telegraphs to the target and it has to be held more carefully. Go up to a .308 and even more consistent control is needed. Go to a .300 WinMag and ANY difference in handling, such as cheek pressure or shoulder pressure variations, will show quite clearly on target. You can lean on your .22 LR and get away with it, but the same handling errors with a .300 and it will literally jump away from the pressure points, with corresponding bullet displacement.

E.Shell said:

LOL, no worries, just calling 'em the way I see 'em.Thank you. I probably did seem to come on a little strong and didn't mean to.

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would rather have it no other way ......
one of my problems is I am very "frank" on things and
have a hard time "sugar coating things" maybe a old age
thing, just unable to "write" a 200-300 word report when
it can be said in 100 words or less. With that said I read
all your posts for the information and hands on experience
not here to "get" brownie points, another set of eyes may
see it from a different approach.


-Rock

A stock swap would be the first thing I did. There are tons of used HS precision stocks for sale. They are good quality for the cost. But if you upgrade don't back yourself into a corner. If you think your gonna eventually rebarrel to a varmint barrel then get that now. Also you will want to get bdl bottom metal. It can also be found used to save some money.

From there it's a matter of money. You can install a trigger yourself a whole lot cheaper then a new barrel. But a new barrel opens some many more possiblities....

I you go there, Ed Harren has rebuilt two of my rifles and both are tack drivers.

There are really two arguments to be made here, and the deciding factor is your own opinion.

Go all-out and do it right the first time. This would be the path of the professional gunsmith (Ed "Doc" Harren gets my vote here). Specify the things you want, take the smith's advice on things you are unsure of. This costs more, happens (relatively) fast, and the results are almost always premium. This is the path if you are interested in results on target and have no "tinkering" tendencies.

Tinker through the process of changing parts as you see fit, playing with load data or ammo selection, and learning as you go. This is the path of nutjobs like me that can't help tinkering with everything. I like to think that this tendency has made me a better shooter and loader. Results are NOT guaranteed by any means. Costs may be variable. You may end up buying twice, or even three times. The payoff is the learning experience.

I agree with what Ed Shell has said. I would reiterate that if this is to be a range toy you would do well to consider that small bullets DO NOT mark targets (or dirt) with even a modicum of authority. An option for those without the budget to build several rifles: they should seriously consider having barrels spun up in two different chamberings that share a bolt face dimension. I have two switch-barrel guns. One is a fixed bolt face dimension (the bolt body/head is all one part) and the other has interchangeable bolt heads so I am nearly unlimited. One of my "switches" is a 22-250AI/6BR Norma. The AI tube is currently a 9 twist. I haven't burned it yet so I can't tell you how long it lasts. The 8 that was in it burned in well under 1000rounds. I use it for fireforming operations as both are reamed the same. I will not have another fast twist 22-250AI (I gave up on 22-250 as I hate trimming cases) tube as the barrel life is far to short for the performance gain. I still have a 14 twist in one of my other rigs that has over 2k down the tube and is still well under MOA while driving 40s to about 4400. The 6 BR Norma gives me everything I need for paper to a grand in calm conditions and steel to 800+ if I have favorable backdrops. For PRS or similar events, I would suggest at LEAST a 264 bullet.

I submit that if you choose to run the gun to Ed or another top smith, have the action done up and have a quality recoil lug pinned to it. When you tell the smith you want a switch barrel rig, they will understand. Do a 14 or a 12 twist 22-250 (or, my favorite, the .22-250AI) for groundhogs, called fox/coyote, and the odd crow. Get a second tube spun up in the medium caliber of your choice. I would advocate for a .260, 7-08, or .308 (or the Ackley versions, even better!) subject to your intended use and your tolerance for handloading. This gives you the option to use the same receiver/stock/optic for multiple applications. Unless you are stupid lucky the optic will require rezero. A good friend of mine does exactly this. He hunts from early spring through late summer/early fall with a 22 CHeetah Mark I (wildcat, and one you don't want unless you love case forming) and then pulls the pipe, swaps to a 7-08AI, rezeroes, and shoots his deer. Late winter, he reverses the process. I submit that a thousand plus dollar stock, receiver with lots of machine time in it, and optic that may cost a small fortune is thus optimized.

Let us know what you go with, either way.

Ed,

Thank you for the stock tutorial, very worth wild. Very informative and right on target (sorry) for that .308 I had you check out for me a few years ago. Even on sand bags, thumb pressure on the forend (Brown Precision FG Stock) really effected the groups

I've ground-hogged in MD and PA with both a .22-250 and a .22-250 Ackley. When it came time to re-barrel I was made aware of the 22BR. Far superior inherent precision in a much more efficient cartridge with a design that will give significantly longer barrel life. My .22-250 AI, with a beautiful Hart fluted barrel, lasted two dogtowns in Wyoming before there were no lands left in the first 6" of barrel.

Both my former .22-250 700's are now 22BR's with free-floated barrels. This is a reloader's cartridge though, as you won't be buying this ammo at Walmart. I do wish I'd gone with at least one with a faster twist as my 22BR's are both 14T, and won't shoot much heavier than a 55-58gr. bullet. The stock is important, but not nearly as important as the cartridge and barrel.



Oh yeah - I like wood.

KRC makes an excellent point. the 22BR is much more efficient and the barrels last a lot longer. I have a couple 6BR Norma barrels and I can vouch for the ease of loading for the BR case. For blasting and high volume stuff, I shoot smaller cases. The .22-250AIs still hold a special place for me, though, as I have found them to be extremely easy to work loads up for and the results are spectacular on live targets.

Got to match the tool to the job, though.