Just an exercise to show the issues with MD's carry laws.

marylandmark said:

1. legal
2. legal
3. legal
4. legal
5. legal
6. legal
7. illegal, no guns on USPS property
8. legal - can't carry on Fed or State property but good to go on county property
9. legal
10. legal and can consume, just can't become intoxicated although there is no legal standard for intoxication and they can't test you unless you give them the okay to do so
11. legal
12. legal as long as you don't get out of your car, illegal if you get out
13. illigal only due to being held state property

http://mdsp.maryland.gov/Organizati...singDivision/Firearms/WearandCarryPermit.aspx

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rrankin said:

except in Howard county on 8. Illegal in County buildings

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moojersey said:

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Jack McCauley said:

I caution you, this post will get a bit off the topic. But when I get started, I often continue on the path until the end. So bare with me.

Your Maryland Designated Collector status does nothing to validate any transport of firearms. The only purpose, under Maryland law, for the Designated Collector status is to allow an individual to purchase more than one firearm in a thirty day period. The exemptions for transport are not bolstered or corroborated by the designation.

A few years back, I had a conversation with a lobbyist and former State employee in Annapolis regarding the original intent of the Designated Collector status. He wrote the Firearms Safety Act in the 90's. He told me the DC was an intentional loophole that was created to provide a cushion for any impending lawsuit against the one gun a month purchase. He said that many lawmakers were concerned at the time that the one gun a month was unconstitutional (but they would pass it anyway) as long as an exemption existed.

For a very long period of time the AGC Legislative Vice President fought the State Police on their requirements for those persons who were applying to become a designated collector. The State, at the time, was requiring proof that the individual owned a collection of firearms. This argument went to the Lt Colonel, who after consultation with Legal Counsel, ruled that the State Police could not require an applicant to provide such proof and that anyone could be approved as a Designated Collector by simply applying. There is no mechanism under Maryland law to deny any applicant, even if they are a prohibited person. This ruling was ignored by Licensing Division personnel for over two years and they continued to require documentation. Because the Licensing Division is typically ignored by headquarters command staff, this failure to obey a lawful order simply continued. No one was aware that personnel ignored their orders. Both the AGC Legislative Vice President and the former MSI President brought this to my attention when I became the commander. So I looked into it. After reviewing the well documented communication history on this process (saved by the AGC Vice President), I immediately placed a person in charge of reviewing and approving all applications without the required proof of evidence they already owned firearms. I then created and issued a new Special Order.

This was one of many wakeup calls I had that began within days of taking over this command. I was shocked the State Police had ignored these issues even despite the proper challenges and reviews having been made. This division was run unlike any other division I had seen within the Department. Every value the department had was ignored within this division. This was not the State Police I had known and loved for over 20 years. I was shocked at nearly everything these employees were forced to endure while being ignored by those who preached how much of a family we were. This division was truly a nightmare and was not representative of an otherwise professional and historically respected police department. But it was never the fault of the employees (well most of the employees.)

The Licensing Division and their problems are still being ignored today. Most of this is not the fault of the personnel assigned. We all know there are a few within the division that are running the place from the bottom up. But for the most part, they are just people trying to do their jobs. They do not have the authority to overrule or ignore the Standard Operating Procedures. And the people that need to correct these failed processes continue to ignore the issues.

As the commander of this division, I had an intern that evaluated every process within the Licensing Division. She generated a very well written report. (one that is likely still available via a PIA request) At 21 years of age and just out of college, she was able to identify and record every major mistake within the division and offer a solution to fix the process. The fixes were not really difficult. I suspect her report is being used to balance the broken leg of a 40 year old desk inside of some office.

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Pinecone said:

That is not how preemption works.

When a state preempts local ordinances, they preempt ALL of them, existing or future. The ordinances do not come off the books, but they are unenforceable.

This is why there are issues with some suppliers shipping ammo to MoCo and Annapolis. They both banned the sale of ammunition. The state then passed the preemption law, so those local ordinances cannot be enforced, but since they are on the books, some suppliers will not ship, thinking it is against the local ordinances.

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Minuteman said:

Interesting to learn the history of the (back room deal) regarding the Designated Collector exemption (or loophole as it was put). Similar thing happened with regard to removing the language about requiring a bullet be fired, but despite the legislature debate and agreement to leave it out, its now required. So, my point being is that just because something is agreed upon, doesn't mean that in a court of law it can't go another way.

Hence, if a letter from the MDSP saying that an applicant is Designated Collector, doesn't legitimatize or make them bonafide; then what more 'proof' is there? FFL's are licensed dealers, not collectors per se.

Lastly, assuming the OP is referring to concealed carrying a handgun with a wear and carry permit in the locations he's invited this discussion over. What if it were a long gun? Aren't all the transport laws regarding handguns, and isn't it legal for a law-abiding citizen; without a wear and carry permit, legal to drive around an unload long gun, or even (technically, but don't try it) walk around in public with it as long as they were not threatening? Years ago, I had to part up the street from a gun shop that is now closed. I told them about a problem I was having with their upper that I had slapped on an AR lower, and they said bring it in. I explained my rifle was up the street and I had no case, was this ok? They said sure, people walk in with uncased guns all the time; so I did. Just as I walked with my AR in hand, past a popular restaurant that was a few doors down from the shop, a large group of people were exiting the restaurant. Several of them very clearly saw me carrying the rifle in a very non-threatening manner (like I've carried it for hundreds if not thousands of hours in the Army), and no one seemed to care in the slightest. The guys in the shop fixed my issue, and I walked back to my care (down the street) with my AR in the open. Wasn't until I started hanging out with some of you with BGOS (Battered Gun Owners Syndrome) that I really thought much about it.

BGOS - people who have lived in a repressive state or community where gun laws are either contrary to 'common sense' or deliberately vague, nonsensical, or contrary to other laws; that they are afraid to do what is common, and legal unless they are overwhelmingly convinced that it is ok.

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bobwilley said:

I know this is an older post, but seems to be a good one.

To clarify a few points.
I have a combination lockbox under my drivers seat.
I have a Business Limitation on the back of my MD Handgun Permit.
So if I am not sure I will be conducting business (buying books, collectibles, products),
then I store my gun in the lockbox. I also keep a deposit slip (with $40 in the envelope), and also a money envelope with a larger sum of money for those times where I am called on to buy products, as this can come from a phone call while out, or if I go to a store and find resellable items (I am an online seller).

What if I go to the courthouse (like when I setup my mom's estate or check on things),
I know you cannot carry IN the courthouse, but...
Since I am partially handicapped, I cannot store the weapon (or remove) in the Lockbox while sitting in the drivers seat,
it requires I open the door, stand up, put in the combination open, store/remove, as needed.
Does the action of having to expose the weapon IN PUBLIC (outside the courthouse) cause any issues with someone seeing me.

Same goes if I go to a store and realize I am going to conduct business, so I need to get my weapon out, and put in IWB.

Another scenario, it says you cannot carry in rest areas in MD.
What if I am going someone, say going up Route 301 on Eastern Shore and need to take a pee break, can I pull into the parking lot, get out of vehicle, open lockbox, store weapon,
and then proceed to Rest Area building to relieve myself??

I know these are kinda particular situations, but you get the idea.
It is the "Transition" part that I can't find any direction for.

Thanks in advance.
Bob

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montoya32 said:

So what are the legal duties of a CCW holder? Disarm, return home and leave weapon?

Also, explain your answer to #10.

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swinokur said:

I was under the impression any consumption of alcohol while carrying is illegal in MD.

The law SS 5-314 says "under the influence". How would that be determined?

http://mgaleg.maryland.gov/webmga/f...on=5-314&ext=html&session=2018RS&tab=subject5
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