FANTASTIC Forbes article on 2A

r3t1awr3yd · Dec 28, 2012

Absolutely GREAT read addressing all of the pithy issues brought up recently by anti-gunners.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/lawrenc...certain-virtues-of-a-heavily-armed-citizenry/

midcountyg · Dec 28, 2012

Good read

Privateer · Dec 28, 2012

Well reasoned and logical essay.

2AHokie · Dec 28, 2012

It was a fantastic article.

But I can say from first-hand experience that making these points to someone who is anti-gun or pro-gun-control accomplishes nothing. They don't or won't understand the undeniable truth behind the words. If you go down this route, they will shift the focus of the conversation to "but the government has planes and tanks so your <insert some evil gun type here> is no match for that. Are you saying you should be able to have a rocket launcher? There is already a line drawn with prohibited items on one side and I just want to move that line over a little farther to encompass semi-automatics and/or high capacity magazines and/or <insert some item they perceive to be be "unneeded">. But you can still have *other* guns so I'm being reasonable and compromising so why won't you compromise your rights too?"

I can rebut every one of these ridiculous fallacies in my sleep at this point, but it's mentally exhausting to deal with these people. And I believe they do need to be challenged on their BS as frequently as possible. That article, while 100% correct, probably won't get any of the hoplophobes out there to think about their opinions critically, but it's nice to see the media let a few well-written articles slip in with the constant barrage of "guns are evil" propaganda that passes for news these days.

steveh326 · Dec 28, 2012

Excellent article, but I have discovered that reason is a useless tool for zealots on either side of any issue. People at the extremes of an issue obey only emotion, not reason, and are rarely swayed from their opinions.

sykesville · Dec 28, 2012

Thanks for posting!

Havredegraceshooter · Dec 28, 2012

It may not be the best to convert antis. But the article really nails the heart of the matter to me.

SirMrManGuy · Dec 28, 2012

2AHokie said:
It was a fantastic article.

But I can say from first-hand experience that making these points to someone who is anti-gun or pro-gun-control accomplishes nothing. They don't or won't understand the undeniable truth behind the words. If you go down this route, they will shift the focus of the conversation to "but the government has planes and tanks so your <insert some evil gun type here> is no match for that. Are you saying you should be able to have a rocket launcher? There is already a line drawn with prohibited items on one side and I just want to move that line over a little farther to encompass semi-automatics and/or high capacity magazines and/or <insert some item they perceive to be be "unneeded">. But you can still have *other* guns so I'm being reasonable and compromising so why won't you compromise your rights too?"

I can rebut every one of these ridiculous fallacies in my sleep at this point, but it's mentally exhausting to deal with these people. And I believe they do need to be challenged on their BS as frequently as possible. That article, while 100% correct, probably won't get any of the hoplophobes out there to think about their opinions critically, but it's nice to see the media let a few well-written articles slip in with the constant barrage of "guns are evil" propaganda that passes for news these days.

I've been trying to find a way to frame the argument against the fact that "guns are a collective right" but it is very difficult for someone so entrenched in their ways to understand. They have put their full and complete trust in the government instead of trusting but keeping a watchful and questioning eye.

Overall, our government is a construct of the people, and while people are generally good, they do err, act in misguided ways and sometimes in rare cases are actually evil. They system was designed to split power to prevent any one person or group from having absolute control, and designed to tend towards moderate solutions. It is our job to ensure that our rights are preserved through participation, voting, protest and when all else fails, through the removal and reconstruction of the government whether through peaceful or violent means.

sleev-les · Dec 28, 2012

Good article. I've shared this with some friends.

EL1227 · Dec 28, 2012

2AHokie said:
It was a fantastic article.

But I can say from first-hand experience that making these points to someone who is anti-gun or pro-gun-control accomplishes nothing. They don't or won't understand the undeniable truth behind the words. If you go down this route, they will shift the focus of the conversation to "but the government has planes and tanks so your <insert some evil gun type here> is no match for that. Are you saying you should be able to have a rocket launcher? There is already a line drawn with prohibited items on one side and I just want to move that line over a little farther to encompass semi-automatics and/or high capacity magazines and/or <insert some item they perceive to be be "unneeded">. But you can still have *other* guns so I'm being reasonable and compromising so why won't you compromise your rights too?"

I can rebut every one of these ridiculous fallacies in my sleep at this point, but it's mentally exhausting to deal with these people. And I believe they do need to be challenged on their BS as frequently as possible. That article, while 100% correct, probably won't get any of the hoplophobes out there to think about their opinions critically, but it's nice to see the media let a few well-written articles slip in with the constant barrage of "guns are evil" propaganda that passes for news these days.

You will never convince brainwashed sheeple on either side of the argument to believe in or defend the true meaning of 2A, but you can leave them with two quotes from our forefathers; some who passed on as freemen, others sapped penniless in support, or others died as slaves because they did not heed the warnings.

"Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.” - Samuel Adams

"What is it that gentlemen wish? What would they have? Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!" - Patrick Henry, March 23, 1775

Samuel · Dec 28, 2012

Times a coming soon when we'll all have to make that decision right there and then: give up life (and take lives) for liberty, or sacrifice principles for more time and hope things get better on their own or by the blood of others.

Those quotes won't just be the rhetorical propaganda from ancient history.

SirMrManGuy · Dec 28, 2012

edleary1227 said:
"What is it that gentlemen wish? What would they have? Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!" - Patrick Henry, March 23, 1775

What these folks forget is that the crowd followed with "To Arms, To arms!" The revolution, while it started on paper by the words of these fine men, was finalized through armed revolt.

That said, I don't believe that we have reached a point where this is needed. While we may disagree with the decisions of the current government, peaceful means have not yet been exhausted. I get quite excited reading the progress of SAF in the courts, as it is a reminder that we still have viable means to address the issues surrounding our rights.

hogarth · Dec 28, 2012

2AHokie said:
It was a fantastic article.

But I can say from first-hand experience that making these points to someone who is anti-gun or pro-gun-control accomplishes nothing. They don't or won't understand the undeniable truth behind the words. If you go down this route, they will shift the focus of the conversation to "but the government has planes and tanks so your <insert some evil gun type here> is no match for that. Are you saying you should be able to have a rocket launcher? There is already a line drawn with prohibited items on one side and I just want to move that line over a little farther to encompass semi-automatics and/or high capacity magazines and/or <insert some item they perceive to be be "unneeded">. But you can still have *other* guns so I'm being reasonable and compromising so why won't you compromise your rights too?"

I can rebut every one of these ridiculous fallacies in my sleep at this point, but it's mentally exhausting to deal with these people. And I believe they do need to be challenged on their BS as frequently as possible. That article, while 100% correct, probably won't get any of the hoplophobes out there to think about their opinions critically, but it's nice to see the media let a few well-written articles slip in with the constant barrage of "guns are evil" propaganda that passes for news these days.

I have had those issues with people who say that I would need a rocket launcher to stand up to tanks and such....then I mention Iraq and Afghanistan. Our enemies did pretty well against us without tanks or air power.

Hyp81 · Dec 28, 2012

Absolutely amazing read! Thanks for this!

ArmyMan013 · Dec 29, 2012

Fantastic article but we all know that facts don't matter to the libs!

Blacksmith101 · Dec 29, 2012

Great article. This is good for those fence sitters who have never really thought about the second amendment. Those are the people we need to get on our side. Don't waste your breath trying to convert a dyed in the wool anti when there are lots of thinking people who just need to be convinced with calm logical explanations.

Go out and recruit an undecided, all they have ever heard is the anti's lies and gun supporters sound bites (When you pry it from my cold dead fingers). Go and talk to people when you are armed with facts and logic and the reasonable ones will either lean our way or given a chance become gun owners and supporters also.

An article like this is a good starting point for serious discussions of the true meaning of the 2nd and why the knee jerk proposals won't work.

Blacksmith101

CapoGreg · Dec 29, 2012

THIS...not Wayne LaPierre's sensationalist rants

WeaponsCollector · Dec 29, 2012

Great article, makes these think of these quotes...

"The Second Amendment is a doomsday provision, one
designed for those exceptionally rare circumstances
where all other rights have failed -- where the
government refuses to stand for reelection and
silences those who protest; where courts have lost the
courage to oppose, or can find no one to enforce their
decrees. However improbable these contingencies may
seem today, facing them unprepared is a mistake a free
people get to make only once."
- Justice Alex Kozinski, US 9th Circuit Court, 2003

"Today we need a nation of minute men; citizens
who are not only prepared to take up arms,
but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom
as a basic purpose of their daily life and who are willing
to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom.
The cause of liberty, the cause of American, cannot succeed
with any lesser effort."
- President John F. Kennedy, January 29, 1961

oldman12 · Dec 30, 2012

A brilliant article. These politicians need to be held accountable for their actions against the Constitution and the people of the United States. Lets see what these idiots do when there brought up on treason. There has to be a way. Where's all the MDS lawer members?

JSF · Dec 30, 2012

Blacksmith101 said:
Great article. This is good for those fence sitters who have never really thought about the second amendment. Those are the people we need to get on our side. Don't waste your breath trying to convert a dyed in the wool anti when there are lots of thinking people who just need to be convinced with calm logical explanations.

Go out and recruit an undecided, all they have ever heard is the anti's lies and gun supporters sound bites (When you pry it from my cold dead fingers). Go and talk to people when you are armed with facts and logic and the reasonable ones will either lean our way or given a chance become gun owners and supporters also.

An article like this is a good starting point for serious discussions of the true meaning of the 2nd and why the knee jerk proposals won't work.

Blacksmith101

Well said.

I'm a noob, but the concern of our rights drew me into this forum. But, I stayed for the hunting information. For the past week (or so), I've been reading much across this forum (you guys and gals are prolific!)

I don't need to own a firearm for my rights (and my progeny) to be irrevocably eviscerated.

Thanks for helpful information.

FANTASTIC Forbes article on 2A

The #1 community for Gun Owners of the Northeast

Member Benefits:

Meh.

Ultimate Member

Always Watching

Active Member

Ultimate Member

Ultimate Member

Member

Active Member

Gata Needs His Gat

R.I.P.

Banned

Active Member

Ultimate Member

Ultimate Member

Member

Grumpy Old Man

Extra mediocre

EXTREME GUN OWNER

Ultimate Member

Member

Users who are viewing this thread

Log in

Forum statistics