Green Ops Defensive Pistol I Clinic AAR

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  • Chasbo00

    Active Member
    Jun 30, 2012
    303
    Northern VA
    I think I'm now officially a training junkie:
    https://hebrewhammerblog.com/2018/12/11/green-ops-defensive-pistol-i-clinic-aar-g34-edition/

    I always learn new stuff even when taking the same class twice.

    Nice review.

    I noted with interest your comment about a recent change concerning allowable ammo at the NRA Indoor Range:

    "The class was held at the NRA HQ range. It’s modern, it’s indoors, and run very professionally. I shoot there fairly regularly, so it’s a pretty comfortable spot for me now; most of the RSOs know me by sight and vica versa. I will say that one very unfortunate development lately there is that they’ve banned steel-jacketed (“magnetic”) ammo, which totally sucks given how much of that I have lying around in rifle calibers."

    I checked the NRA Range web site and their Facebook page, but did not see any mention of this new ammo limitation. Do you have any further info about it?

    Not a good change from my perspective. I'm curious why it came about since they have allowed this type ammo for several years and even boast about being able to handle rifles up to .460 magnum.
     

    erwos

    The Hebrew Hammer
    MDS Supporter
    Mar 25, 2009
    13,866
    Rockville, MD
    I saw the sign at the counter about the change two weeks ago when I was there for an IDPA match. They told me steel-jacketed ammo was hurting their backstop, and that even after repairs, they were not planning on allowing its use again. Yes, it sucks A LOT. I built a high-end 6.5 Grendel SBR that's now useless for training over there because there's no way to economically shoot the thing.
     

    Gizmo98

    Free At Last!!
    Nov 4, 2015
    683
    Central PA
    You mentioned improved grip strength. This is something I know I need to work on. What techniques do they teach/recommend?

    Great AAR! I love when they pop up.
     

    erwos

    The Hebrew Hammer
    MDS Supporter
    Mar 25, 2009
    13,866
    Rockville, MD
    You mentioned improved grip strength. This is something I know I need to work on. What techniques do they teach/recommend?
    So, what Mike prescribed to me, and I thought was really good, was thinking of your grip as twisting out a rag. It's a little hard to describe, but basically applying twisting pressure to your right hand and your left hand simultaneously to lock them up tighter, like if you were twisting out a wet rag. This removed all of my remaining horizontal sight drift immediately, albeit I didn't have all that much of it anyways, and aided in recoil control. Maybe I'm just dumb and not HSLD enough, but I never would have thought of that myself. The dry-fire practice comes in with trying to consistently form that grip during your draw process.

    Same deal with reloads. Brett got on my ass about doing them higher. I went home, ran a few par-timed drills my usual way, ran a few par-timed drills his way, and damned if I wasn't shaving off some time his way while getting more reliable reloads. It's not intuitive - everyone wants to reload low and have the gun closer to your mag pouch - but it works. The par timer doesn't lie.
     

    Gizmo98

    Free At Last!!
    Nov 4, 2015
    683
    Central PA
    So, what Mike prescribed to me, and I thought was really good, was thinking of your grip as twisting out a rag. It's a little hard to describe, but basically applying twisting pressure to your right hand and your left hand simultaneously to lock them up tighter, like if you were twisting out a wet rag. This removed all of my remaining horizontal sight drift immediately, albeit I didn't have all that much of it anyways, and aided in recoil control. Maybe I'm just dumb and not HSLD enough, but I never would have thought of that myself. The dry-fire practice comes in with trying to consistently form that grip during your draw process.

    Same deal with reloads. Brett got on my ass about doing them higher. I went home, ran a few par-timed drills my usual way, ran a few par-timed drills his way, and damned if I wasn't shaving off some time his way while getting more reliable reloads. It's not intuitive - everyone wants to reload low and have the gun closer to your mag pouch - but it works. The par timer doesn't lie.

    That's a good way to think of it. Thanks. I'll give it a try. Haley recommends a nutcracker approach where your fingers on the front of the grip are the pivot point, and you use them a lever to tighten down. I try that as well, but I sometimes get lazy. I'm going to order one of those squeeze things to work on my actual grip strength.
    I actually learned early on about doing reloads (and everything else) up high in "my workspace". I hate that term as it really invokes mall ninja images, but it's accurate. It also helps keep me focused at least somewhat on what's going on around me.
    How does the shot timer work with dry fire? Is the click loud enough to register? I always assumed it needed fairly loud input. I'd love to incorporate that.
    Thanks again for the great advice!
     

    erwos

    The Hebrew Hammer
    MDS Supporter
    Mar 25, 2009
    13,866
    Rockville, MD
    How does the shot timer work with dry fire? Is the click loud enough to register? I always assumed it needed fairly loud input. I'd love to incorporate that.
    I just set a par time and try to beat it. When I can beat it 80%-95% of the time, I lower it. No need to hear anything.
     

    Blaster229

    God loves you, I don't.
    MDS Supporter
    Sep 14, 2010
    46,407
    Glen Burnie
    With reloads, some people tighten up the "workspace" mantra to the point of being able to look through the trigger guard. This is why we learn to index that new mag with our pointer finger up to the mag well without looking. It's quicker to at least be able to get a shot out from high(er) ready after a mag exchange than it is to by brining it back up into your line of sight and then taking a shot. My pistol and threat will always be in the same "picture frame".
     

    erwos

    The Hebrew Hammer
    MDS Supporter
    Mar 25, 2009
    13,866
    Rockville, MD
    With reloads, some people tighten up the "workspace" mantra to the point of being able to look through the trigger guard.
    You're a guy with a lot of structured trigger time - do you think that specific technique works well?

    This is why we learn to index that new mag with our pointer finger up to the mag well without looking. It's quicker to at least be able to get a shot out from high(er) ready after a mag exchange than it is to by brining it back up into your line of sight and then taking a shot. My pistol and threat will always be in the same "picture frame".
    The pointer finger thing is something I ought to practice more, too. I get lazy about it, and I think it hurts my times/reliability.
     

    Blaster229

    God loves you, I don't.
    MDS Supporter
    Sep 14, 2010
    46,407
    Glen Burnie
    You're a guy with a lot of structured trigger time - do you think that specific technique works well?


    The pointer finger thing is something I ought to practice more, too. I get lazy about it, and I think it hurts my times/reliability.
    Heck no. The trigger guard thing is not necessary. I mean we're talking about looking at something MUCH larger than that trigger guard and pistol, so it's much easier to see the threat with the pistol somewhere in the "window". We're not aiming the trigger guard. I do think reloads need to be done "up top" somewhere and without looking.
    I know for me the mag finger point thing wasn't so much to help physically insert the mag (like a stripper clip of ammo to a mag), but more of helping me just locate the bottom of the magwell for (another term I hate using) muscle memory. Just like pointing your trigger finger is to "point shooting", this is to a mag reload.
    And for me, well tactically reloading a single stack like a P239, nothing worked and I always pinch my palm somehow. :)
     

    erwos

    The Hebrew Hammer
    MDS Supporter
    Mar 25, 2009
    13,866
    Rockville, MD
    And for me, well tactically reloading a single stack like a P239, nothing worked and I always pinch my palm somehow. :)
    You know, dumb as this sounds, one thing I really noticed on my subcompact Glock-alike was that I had a lot more difficulty doing fast mag changes because my hand kept getting in the way of the magazine dropping free. Not really what I expected at all, but it was real obvious.
     

    Blaster229

    God loves you, I don't.
    MDS Supporter
    Sep 14, 2010
    46,407
    Glen Burnie
    You know, dumb as this sounds, one thing I really noticed on my subcompact Glock-alike was that I had a lot more difficulty doing fast mag changes because my hand kept getting in the way of the magazine dropping free. Not really what I expected at all, but it was real obvious.
    Small sub compact pistols make terrible combat fighting guns.
     

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