Self evaluation time: How prepared are you to handle a violent encounter?

Crazytrain · Jul 26, 2009

I looked at my own preparation, and I am not impressed...

The Evaluation:

Equipment:

For a home encounter where I am legally armed: S&W 6906 9mm and Remington 570 12ga. Adequate, I think, for most likely encounters.

Away from home: Hand to hand or whatever I have available. Inadequate.

Training:

US Army Basic, Expert with M9, M16, M60 (air and ground), and Grenades. Whoop-de-do. I can hit the freakin' target on a range. No close quarters or dynamic training at all. And I don't have an M60 or grenades at home.

NRA safety training. Again, whoop-de-do. I probably won't accidentally shoot myself; but how much does this help in a violent encounter?

No real hand to hand training (ok, I have taken the occasional two hour course; but they are mostly worthless. As is my twenty year old "butt stroke to the head" army training).

Fortunately, I do get to the range and punch holes in targets with my handguns on a fairly regular (monthly?) basis, so I am very familiar with the physical operation of the weapons, and fairly accurate in a stationary environment.

Physical Conditioning:

Lean, mean, fighting machine. Oh, wait. That was twenty years ago. Now I'm sixty pounds overweight and I'm lucky to do ten pushup and a twelve minute mile. What happened?

Mindset:

I was once told that the key to successful violence is to have determined before hand when to use violence and to what level. It is too late to figure it out at the moment of truth. I decided a long time ago that I would not hesitate to use any force necessary, explosively, including lethal force, to defend myself or someone else. Removing the decision has come in handy a couple times in the past, where by engaging early I forced @55hole to disengage, thereby saving one or both of us some hurt. Hopefully, my mindset is in the right place.

CONCLUSION:

While my mind is in the right place, and when I'm at home I have the tools necessary to do the job, I am, overall, woefully underprepared for the task at hand.

The Solution:

I think it is time to get some training...

Firearms:

There appear to be a few regional schools that won't break the bank. Perroni's Tactical Training Academy? Pat Goodale's Practical Firearms Training?

Hand to Hand fighting and physical conditioning:

I'm thinking either Krav Maga, or Brazilian Jiu Jitsu. Something I can progress with rapidly, gain necessary skills, and get myself into better shape, not to mention reduce some of my excessive stress.

Ideally, I like to see a training package which combined hand to hand with firearms training. I don't know if anybody offers that kind of class.

Since money is tight, and since I appear to have adequate equipment, I think my firearms budget is going to transition from hardware to training for the next year or so. And I so wanted that AR-15. :shrug:

blindnoodle · Jul 26, 2009

Not very. MSP turned down my CCW application.

Inigoes · Jul 26, 2009

Your mindset in right, so why not just defend in place. Let the young-ins go on the offensive.

Judo or Jujitsu is a good hobby, though, fun to inflict pain and suffering on the young-ins.

K Train · Jul 26, 2009

there are different kinds of cqb.... a home invasion typically will not be the one you are preparing for w/ that mindset....

you seem like you are preparing for a cqb battle where you will be boucning from room to room doing combat rolls and such....

the average home invasion is in and out quick and painless.... if they encounter resistance they will generally try to un-ass the ao and get the f out of dodge.... chances are you really don't have anything they will find worth dying for.... they generally chose easy targets, etc....

if you feel you need a 'tactical training class' then so be it.... but there is another solution, take your money and go shoot. practice at home drawing your weapon, where would you keep it for a home invasion, etc.... go practice shooting, try shooting stress induced situations where your heart rate is elevated

if you haven't done hand to hand in 20 years you're more likely to hurt yourself taking a regular class... just take a self defense class and practice a few moves, its not like you're going to be a life and death battle....

use your brain most of all.... don't put yourself in a situation where you are the victim. if you're not a hero then don't try to be a hero. forget all the tactical ******** and leave it to professionals and guys who know what they are doing.....

Threeband · Jul 26, 2009

I can strongly recommend Pat Goodale. I just completed his Defensive Handgun I and II yesterday (and I'm still "coming down.") I definately plan to repeat those courses in the future, and take other courses from him as well.

If you can swing it, go to his facility in West-by-God. Otherwise he plans to do four or six days training at Thurmont next year.

Crazytrain · Jul 26, 2009

K Train said:
there are different kinds of cqb.... a home invasion typically will not be the one you are preparing for w/ that mindset....

you seem like you are preparing for a cqb battle where you will be boucning from room to room doing combat rolls and such....

the average home invasion is in and out quick and painless.... if they encounter resistance they will generally try to un-ass the ao and get the f out of dodge.... chances are you really don't have anything they will find worth dying for.... they generally chose easy targets, etc....

if you feel you need a 'tactical training class' then so be it.... but there is another solution, take your money and go shoot. practice at home drawing your weapon, where would you keep it for a home invasion, etc.... go practice shooting, try shooting stress induced situations where your heart rate is elevated

if you haven't done hand to hand in 20 years you're more likely to hurt yourself taking a regular class... just take a self defense class and practice a few moves, its not like you're going to be a life and death battle....

use your brain most of all.... don't put yourself in a situation where you are the victim. if you're not a hero then don't try to be a hero. forget all the tactical ******** and leave it to professionals and guys who know what they are doing.....

My mindset regarding violent encounters has changed somewhat in the past couple of years. It used to be mostly an academic mind exercise. However, in the past view years I have come much too close to bad situations. I know several people who have been mugged, and one poor girl who is lucky to be alive after getting bashed in the back of the head with a baseball bat (btw, she apparently has a clot or something in her brain as a result, which could eventually kill her at a later date). Someone was shot across the street from my house a couple months ago. Someone was shot at the base of my street on June 15th. I missed getting mugged by about five seconds when leaving a party, just because I shook one last hand (the guy who left right before me got it instead). I have spent some time in the inner city while working some investment property and I am hearing stories that will curl your hair. If the economy continues to decline, or if inflation skyrockets, people are going to get more and more desperate. I believe we could be on the precipice of a very bad time. I might be wrong. But I have to assume I'm not.

Maybe the average home invasion is in/out and painless; but is it wise to count on averages? Letting the professionals handle it is pointless. I'm not going out and raiding houses or anything. I am preparing for violence against me and mine. Since I don't keep a SWAT team on retainer, I need to be able to be able to keep me and my family as safe as possible without them.

I've never heard anyone suggest NOT taking a martial art. It is good exercise (something I need), good for strength (something I need), good for flexibility (something I need), good for endurance (something I need), good for agility, balance and good for when Bad Things Happen (which have come too close too many times lately). It's been about ten years since the last time I was personally jumped (in Attleboro, MA), but I believe that by reacting violently to the violence that was presented to me, the Bad Guy decided to go looking for easier targets (taunting me as he retreated). I don't know what the outcome would have been if he didn't disengage. I do know he was coming at me to attack, not just threaten. How do you know that wasn't about to be a life or death battle?

There are no guarantees. I don't know that I will ever need these skills. But I don't know, either, that I won't. I don't go looking for trouble; but neither do I cower at home behind triple locked steal security doors with a shotgun in my lap, scared of every person who walks his dog in front of my house. I know too many victims. I DO NOT want to be a victim. Therefor, I choose to prepare.

Crazytrain · Jul 26, 2009

Threeband said:
I can strongly recommend Pat Goodale. I just completed his Defensive Handgun I and II yesterday (and I'm still "coming down.") I definately plan to repeat those courses in the future, and take other courses from him as well.

If you can swing it, go to his facility in West-by-God. Otherwise he plans to do four or six days training at Thurmont next year.

Yeah, I have heard that he is good. Maybe this year. W.Va isn't all that far away.

Inigoes · Jul 26, 2009

Besides preparing yourself, have you thought of preparing your better half? Nice to go through the training with someone you know, and support each other while having a good time.

Crazytrain · Jul 26, 2009

Inigoes said:
Besides preparing yourself, have you thought of preparing your better half? Nice to go through the training with someone you know, and support each other while having a good time.

Yeah, I would like to get her involved. But she isn't interested.

Maybe in the future.

K Train · Jul 26, 2009

Adam said:
My mindset regarding violent encounters has changed somewhat in the past couple of years. It used to be mostly an academic mind exercise. However, in the past view years I have come much too close to bad situations. I know several people who have been mugged, and one poor girl who is lucky to be alive after getting bashed in the back of the head with a baseball bat (btw, she apparently has a clot or something in her brain as a result, which could eventually kill her at a later date). Someone was shot across the street from my house a couple months ago. Someone was shot at the base of my street on June 15th. I missed getting mugged by about five seconds when leaving a party, just because I shook one last hand (the guy who left right before me got it instead). I have spent some time in the inner city while working some investment property and I am hearing stories that will curl your hair. If the economy continues to decline, or if inflation skyrockets, people are going to get more and more desperate. I believe we could be on the precipice of a very bad time. I might be wrong. But I have to assume I'm not.

Maybe the average home invasion is in/out and painless; but is it wise to count on averages? Letting the professionals handle it is pointless. I'm not going out and raiding houses or anything. I am preparing for violence against me and mine. Since I don't keep a SWAT team on retainer, I need to be able to be able to keep me and my family as safe as possible without them.

I've never heard anyone suggest NOT taking a martial art. It is good exercise (something I need), good for strength (something I need), good for flexibility (something I need), good for endurance (something I need), good for agility, balance and good for when Bad Things Happen (which have come too close too many times lately). It's been about ten years since the last time I was personally jumped (in Attleboro, MA), but I believe that by reacting violently to the violence that was presented to me, the Bad Guy decided to go looking for easier targets (taunting me as he retreated). I don't know what the outcome would have been if he didn't disengage. I do know he was coming at me to attack, not just threaten. How do you know that wasn't about to be a life or death battle?

There are no guarantees. I don't know that I will ever need these skills. But I don't know, either, that I won't. I don't go looking for trouble; but neither do I cower at home behind triple locked steal security doors with a shotgun in my lap, scared of every person who walks his dog in front of my house. I know too many victims. I DO NOT want to be a victim. Therefor, I choose to prepare.

Adam, get off your ass and go exercise to get in shape to kick some young dudes ass. take all the tactical and martial arts courses you can afford.... don't miss your shots, don't let them get away.

As i tell my boss, its not the truth, but is that what you want to hear??

Crazytrain · Jul 26, 2009

K Train said:
Adam, get off your ass and go exercise to get in shape to kick some young dudes ass. take all the tactical and martial arts courses you can afford.... don't miss your shots, don't let them get away.

As i tell my boss, its not the truth, but is that what you want to hear??

No, you're right. I'm gonna go hide under my blanket and let the professionals take care of me. Call me when the world is rainbows and flowers.

newmuzzleloader · Jul 26, 2009

Adam said:
No, you're right. I'm gonna go hide under my blanket and let the professionals take care of me. Call me when the world is rainbows and flowers.

Give Obama everything he wants and we'll all be singing about "The Age Of Aquarius.

one-star · Jul 26, 2009

Adam said:
No, you're right. I'm gonna go hide under my blanket and let the professionals take care of me. Call me when the world is rainbows and flowers.

And Im sure the MSP will do a great job of protecting you.

Loose the weight, focus the mind.

But in the end its all about the deep down inside willingness to pull the trigger on a human target. Id say that the majority if not more than 80% of people (including gun owners) have fractions of a second hesitation on that one. It takes a special mental place when you go into combat and some serious de-programing when you come out----ask any cop or combat vet. If you want to defend your home/family/life make sure you mentally can do that (calmly and accurately) and everything else is just words....which is why martial arts, especially a combat-oriented one is good.

Hooker2 · Jul 26, 2009

Before stepping into the martial arts arena start a cardio routine to get your body in shape in order to perform what you wish to do. If you just jump into Krav without being in shape you will more than likely end up quitting. PM me as I have a PT regimen developed by a teammate (Moco Cop) that may help.

K Train · Jul 26, 2009

Adam said:
No, you're right. I'm gonna go hide under my blanket and let the professionals take care of me. Call me when the world is rainbows and flowers.

what good is being able to hit a target if you're not good enough to get to your gun......

again if you're serious, get off your ass and start working out, start small so you don't lose focus and quit. don't look for immediate results and don't try to be billy badass

boothdoc · Jul 26, 2009

sounds like alot of us( myself included). I have always been a shooter. I always haven't been fat and old(er). Now that I am the latter I find myself shbooting and training more often. I really need to loose 60lbs. and get back in shape. This would help tie everything I am doing together and make my loved ones and myself safer in the long run.

I have just started a cardio program and hope I have the Balls to stick with it.

Figure out how and what makes you tick and make the changes you need to insure your loved ones and your own safety.

Norton · Jul 26, 2009

Krav Maga is good stuff, but tough. Shoot me a PM if you want to chat about it.

woodstock · Jul 26, 2009

all fine and dandy suggestions here, now my 2 cents worth.

i am a personal trainer, who just happens to be a certified self-defense instructor, who is also an instructor for the NRA's personal protection in the home (i know many here have a disdain for the NRA, but they do offer more education than any other legit organization out there) and i am a survivor of many assaults against my person, including being jumped by five good ol' boys down in virginia who didn't like the fact i was a veteran of the navy, have pierced ears and a pretty girlfriend who didn't want to talk to them. as well, i was mugged in san diego and took a hip-shot from a .22LR in the assault. all that being said, martial arts works well with highly trained, HIGHLY trained individuals who will avoid the potential of encountering a confrontation in the first place, and then they will use their skills to thwart the attack and get outta dodge. self-defense doesn't always mean fancy stuff like martial arts. as well, going into an area of highly developed eye-to hand coordination like krav, will place you into a situation you may not be able to get out of easily, if you doubt your abilities~those abilities are physical abilities that require extensive amounts of conditioning.

start with the basics: while conditioning your body through practical exercises designed to meet your individual needs, heed the advice offered here by others and use your brain. during exercise sessions (consistent exercise), explore grappling techniques that you can master easily, or until your eye-to hand coordination and muscle memory becomes second-nature. as well, while working on your physical condition and goals, buy some snap caps and master your ability to get to your gun of choice and run through drills that you have created~in your home, as that is where you seem to be most concerned. make a plan, with a back-up plan that has another back-up plan. why so many back-up plans? because your assailant(s) is going to have a plan that may not fit into your plan. remember, action is better than re-action. think, re-think and then use your imagination to think more about how to better your original plan. cheers, woody.

billprudden · Jul 27, 2009

Hello -

First off, you get crazy bonus points for even asking yourself these questions - congrats, you are immediately better off than 99% of the population!

Given that approx half of the self-defense shootings, and all of the self-defense knifings and beatings, occur within contact-distance, you might wanna think about focusing your efforts there. Think about it: if the bad guy is 7 yards away, ain't you pretty much already good enough to fill that torso or even head with lead? The issue is what if he ain't? What if he is already hitting, grabbing, wrestling, stabbing you, as he may well be if he gets to pick the time and place and manner of the attack... That is our worst-case scenario, and it is very very difficult to train for at a square range with NRA rules and instructors who are much more interested in teaching you how to kill that 7-yard torso faster and harder.

The best training I have found for this pickledicerment is from InSights. They come to Harrisburg and other local places from time to time. Well worth the time and effort.

Congrats again for asking these questions. I fear there are not easy answers, like just buying the bestest newest red-dot sight... Were it only that simple!

Bill

one-star · Jul 28, 2009

Along those lines, I just found a fascinating article on how the brain deals with "threat" and why different people sense it differently

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/28/health/research/28brain.html?hp

Self evaluation time: How prepared are you to handle a violent encounter?

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