Shot group Criticism (airgun)

Arcticwolf · Mar 7, 2010

So I just did this like 5 mins ago wanted to see what you guys think. I took five shots from 25 yds with my Gamo big cat. Used Crossmen primer hollow point pellets. I think I can do better but I would like some constructive criticism.

fivepointstar · Mar 7, 2010

you TOTALLY missed the penny 6x's

great shooting for 25 yds!

Arcticwolf · Mar 7, 2010

fivepointstar said:
you TOTALLY missed the penny 6x's

great shooting for 25 yds!

Well i was aiming for the black dot behind the penny i think my sights are a lil off

futureseabee · Mar 7, 2010

good shooting! your constructive criticism is to not wake me up to tell me to get on mdshooters

fivepointstar · Mar 7, 2010

1" ...just a lil

futureseabee · Mar 7, 2010

fivepointstar said:
1" ...just a lil

that's what she said

Arcticwolf · Mar 7, 2010

futureseabee said:
that's what she said

to you

boule · Mar 7, 2010

Use different pellets. Flat or hollow point pellets are aerodynamically not that stable and due to the air turbulances created they slow down pretty fast. Depending on the muzzle velocity of your rifle, you may also have lighter pellets going transsonical at first and then dropping below, making them even more inaccurate.

Use flat points only if you want to shoot olympic match (10 yds), with low-power airguns or if you are looking for a cheap pellet for plinking. If you need accuracy for any distances, round head pellets are usually the way to go. They combine additional weight with a slight improvement in aerodynamics and thanks to the extra weight, they stay below speed of sound.

Another short warning - for accuracy stay away from anything that is either pointed or hollow-pointed. While the pellets are manufactured to fine tolerances, they are then dumped in a tin and the point (or sharp rim) is subject to enough stress to bend it out of alignment. This results in the center of mass being off the spin axis and a whobbling flight with all the improvements for accuracy this provides, including tumbling bullets.

Arcticwolf · Mar 7, 2010

boule said:
Use different pellets. Flat or hollow point pellets are aerodynamically not that stable and due to the air turbulances created they slow down pretty fast. Depending on the muzzle velocity of your rifle, you may also have lighter pellets going transsonical at first and then dropping below, making them even more inaccurate.

Use flat points only if you want to shoot olympic match (10 yds), with low-power airguns or if you are looking for a cheap pellet for plinking. If you need accuracy for any distances, round head pellets are usually the way to go. They combine additional weight with a slight improvement in aerodynamics and thanks to the extra weight, they stay below speed of sound.

Another short warning - for accuracy stay away from anything that is either pointed or hollow-pointed. While the pellets are manufactured to fine tolerances, they are then dumped in a tin and the point (or sharp rim) is subject to enough stress to bend it out of alignment. This results in the center of mass being off the spin axis and a whobbling flight with all the improvements for accuracy this provides, including tumbling bullets.

Thanks!!! I am gonna shoot up my 1,000 hollow points then i'll get some round nose thanks a lot!!!

Todd v. · Mar 8, 2010

I've had the best luck with flat pointed non-fluted pellets. In my airgun they shoot well above and beyond anything else I've tried for accuracy. My gun is a Crossman break barrel with peep sights and will group about half the size of what you're getting @ 25 yards. I haven't found any other pellets that shoot as well, in my gun anyway. And light and fast is not neccisarily your friend, staying above or below the transonic point is.

Dino · Mar 8, 2010

That's a pretty good group! :thumbsup:

You should note that springer airguns (in general) do sacrifice some accuracy due to the recoil of the spring.
The trick to good accuracy is to place the barrel (or forearm) on a rest of some sort and just allow the recoil.
Do not grasp the forearm in anticipation or in an attempt to reduce recoil.
It may take a little practice, but I think you'll be able to tell a difference in groupings and consistancy.

boule · Mar 8, 2010

Dino said:
You should note that springer airguns (in general) do sacrifice some accuracy due to the recoil of the spring.

Not necessarily. Most spring airguns are just cheaply-made with triggers that require one hell of a pull. By the time the piston hits the end of the chamber, the pellet should alreay be out of the barrel, so vibrations do not affect the shot that much and should be dampened out within the system. If you put down the gun anywhere, though, these first vibrations might make it jump.

There are a couple of old match air-rifles (Feinwerkbau 150&300, Diana 75, Anschütz 380) use a piston or runback system to reduce all vibrations until the pellet is safely on the way. These systems are usually death to scopes but the rifles are hellish accurate.

Todd v. · Mar 8, 2010

My break barrel pellet rifle would not shoot worth a darn with a scope on it.... I was getting groups almost 2 times as large and went back to the irons.

boule · Mar 8, 2010

Todd v. said:
My break barrel pellet rifle would not shoot worth a darn with a scope on it....

Two possibilities:
- the break action might not be tight enough so the barrel is slacking
- the scope mount can move

There are quite a few more influences on the accuracy of an air rifle. If you really want to know how to accurize one, please feel free to drop by with some beer as it will take an hour or two to go through the major influencing factors and a day to tune up your rifle.

Dino · Mar 8, 2010

boule said:
Not necessarily. Most spring airguns are just cheaply-made with triggers that require one hell of a pull. By the time the piston hits the end of the chamber, the pellet should alreay be out of the barrel, so vibrations do not affect the shot that much and should be dampened out within the system. If you put down the gun anywhere, though, these first vibrations might make it jump.

I'm sorry but I have to disagree ...
Not only have I read this many times before over the years, but I've also seen it explained on TV's "American Airgunner" series and have experienced it for myself first hand. There is a certain technique that is favored by folks who shoot springer air rifles and that is by design, and has nothing to do with them being "cheaply-made".

And if what you say is true, then it shouldn't matter much if vibrations make the rifle "jump" because by then, according to you, the pellet would have already exited the barrel.

boule · Mar 8, 2010

Dino said:
And if what you say is true, then it shouldn't matter much if vibrations make the rifle "jump" because by then, according to you, the pellet would have already exited the barrel.

Nope, I was inaccurate. There are actually three main vibration events in a springer air rifle.
- When the spring is loosened.
- When the piston compresses the air
- when the piston head impacts the cylinder

The first vibration from the mass of the piston being released can be balanced by either a two-pison, recoil or moving mass system and is generally canceled out. If there is no such system, you are right that this will be felt and depending on balance and positioning of the rifle, you might feel the rifle jump.
The shaking caused by the piston compressing the air should not be too strong to cause inaccuracy and cushions the later impact. If you have voliatile lubricants in the piston, you can get a small explosion at this compression stage, causing a pressure-jump and inaccuracy.
Finally, the piston face impacts the cylinder. By now, the pellet should have left the rifle, so that this last and major impact is not influencing your shot (but it will rattle your scope).

Hope I have cleared up my inaccurate description now.

guthook · Mar 8, 2010

Todd v. said:
I've had the best luck with flat pointed non-fluted pellets. In my airgun they shoot well above and beyond anything else I've tried for accuracy. My gun is a Crossman break barrel with peep sights and will group about half the size of what you're getting @ 25 yards. I haven't found any other pellets that shoot as well, in my gun anyway. And light and fast is not neccisarily your friend, staying above or below the transonic point is.

I guess all rifles are different. Mine hate the smooth pellets. For some reason, they love the plain old flat tip, "fluted" Gamo Match Diablo and the rounded Gamo Hunter. My rifle and pistol despise RWS Meisterkugeln. The rifle likes the Diablo and the pistol likes the Hunter, both from Gamo and available anywhere.

If you have an air rifle with a awful trigger, look into Charlie Da Tuna's adjustable drop in trigger replacement GRT-III. Took my Gamo Varmint Hunter's hard, spongy trigger pull and made it a hair trigger!!!! I wish I had a pull guage to give you the actual pull, but is super light. :thumbsup:

He says it does not work in brand new Gamo's. The link has the models it will fit. The installed pic is in the bottom left corner.

Arcticwolf · Mar 9, 2010

boule said:
Two possibilities:
- the break action might not be tight enough so the barrel is slacking
- the scope mount can move

There are quite a few more influences on the accuracy of an air rifle. If you really want to know how to accurize one, please feel free to drop by with some beer as it will take an hour or two to go through the major influencing factors and a day to tune up your rifle.

I might take you up on the offer sometime.

Shot group Criticism (airgun)

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