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Old May 19th, 2017, 08:26 AM #1
YouWillShootYourEyeOutKid YouWillShootYourEyeOutKid is offline
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Building on a preban (10/2013) ar-15 lower

It is my understanding that if you have a stripped lower receiver that was purchased before 10/2013, it must have an hbar if it is assembled after 10/2013. Is this correct?
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Old May 19th, 2017, 08:36 AM #2
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A non-HBAR upper is okay for pre 10/2013 lowers you own, even if built today.
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Old May 19th, 2017, 08:37 AM #3
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You can also do MULTIPLE pre-ban uppers for your pre-ban lower.
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Old May 19th, 2017, 08:40 AM #4
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Old May 19th, 2017, 08:51 AM #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinK View Post
A non-HBAR upper is okay for pre 10/2013 lowers you own, even if built today.
Quote:
Originally Posted by teratos View Post
You can also do MULTIPLE pre-ban uppers for your pre-ban lower.
For the record, the OP doesn't believe either of you and will only take the word of an IP.
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Old May 19th, 2017, 09:03 AM #6
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yup because the msp says different.
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Old May 19th, 2017, 09:10 AM #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YouWillShootYourEyeOutKid View Post
yup because the msp says different.
That question IS NOT the same question. The question is what can you do with a lower purchased BEFORE 10/1/13.
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Old May 19th, 2017, 10:00 AM #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YouWillShootYourEyeOutKid View Post
yup because the msp says different.
But that response says a lower that was purchased AFTER 10/2013, right?

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Old May 19th, 2017, 10:03 AM #9
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Quote:
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But that response says a lower that was purchased AFTER 10/2013, right?

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Exactly, but the OP can't seem to understand the difference.
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Old May 19th, 2017, 10:08 AM #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daggo66 View Post
Exactly, but the OP can't seem to understand the difference.


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Old May 19th, 2017, 10:14 AM #11
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I'm honestly trying to help him understand. Asking him to post here was my last resort.
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Old May 19th, 2017, 11:49 AM #12
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OP, the word 'after' has the opposite meaning of the word 'before'.
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Old May 19th, 2017, 12:25 PM #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YouWillShootYourEyeOutKid View Post
It is my understanding that if you have a stripped lower receiver that was purchased before 10/2013, it must have an hbar if it is assembled after 10/2013. Is this correct?
The law is ambiguous about the issue. A strict interpretation would say that it needed to be assembled into a non hbar configuration before the cutoff date. Others are not as strict on the interpretation. In either case, the state would need to prove that it was not possessed prior to the cutoff date. You need to determine the level of risk you are willing to take. I tend toward the less strict interpretation.
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Old May 19th, 2017, 12:43 PM #14
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If you can prove you owned it PRIOR, BEFORE, or PRECEDING 10/13, then you can use whatever barrel profile (NFA excluded). The HBAR requirement is for lowers purchased AFTER or LATER than 10/13. Assembly date in this case is not relevant.
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Old May 19th, 2017, 12:55 PM #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HordesOfKailas View Post
If you can prove you owned it PRIOR, BEFORE, or PRECEDING 10/13, then you can use whatever barrel profile (NFA excluded). The HBAR requirement is for lowers purchased AFTER or LATER than 10/13. Assembly date in this case is not relevant.
First of all you don't need to prove anything, that is the states job. Technically the sale of stripped lowers has not changed. What has changed is stripped lowers bought after the cutoff date cannot be assembled into a banned configuration. What is unclear is whether stripped lowers bought before the cutoff date can be assembled into a banned configuration. It becomes a matter of interpretation and how much risk you are willing to accept.
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Old May 19th, 2017, 12:57 PM #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcutonilli View Post
First of all you don't need to prove anything, that is the states job. Technically the sale of stripped lowers has not changed. What has changed is stripped lowers bought after the cutoff date cannot be assembled into a banned configuration. What is unclear is whether stripped lowers bought before the cutoff date can be assembled into a banned configuration. It becomes a matter of interpretation and how much risk you are willing to accept.
I suppose you're right, but the general consensus seems to be that ownership before 10/13 is all that matters. IANAL.
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Old May 19th, 2017, 02:25 PM #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcutonilli View Post
First of all you don't need to prove anything, that is the states job. Technically the sale of stripped lowers has not changed. What has changed is stripped lowers bought after the cutoff date cannot be assembled into a banned configuration. What is unclear is whether stripped lowers bought before the cutoff date can be assembled into a banned configuration. It becomes a matter of interpretation and how much risk you are willing to accept.
So Correct me if I am wrong. I Lower purchased prior to 10/1/2013 was considered a firearm, due to the 4473 and the 77R you filed out. So all rules/laws before 10/1/2013 apply to that firearm! The proof is the 77R. There may be a problem with the long guns purchase before 10/1/2013 because the state never registered a 77R on those particular firearms. IMO
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Old May 19th, 2017, 02:34 PM #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YouWillShootYourEyeOutKid View Post
It is my understanding that if you have a stripped lower receiver that was purchased before 10/2013, it must have an hbar if it is assembled after 10/2013. Is this correct?
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Old May 19th, 2017, 02:54 PM #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcutonilli View Post
The law is ambiguous about the issue. A strict interpretation would say that it needed to be assembled into a non hbar configuration before the cutoff date. Others are not as strict on the interpretation. In either case, the state would need to prove that it was not possessed prior to the cutoff date. You need to determine the level of risk you are willing to take. I tend toward the less strict interpretation.
This ^^^^^^

Last time this came up, several of us emailed MSP about the question. A couple of us emailed more than once.

And got different answers. Probably them most honest one, basically said they did not know, and know one had made up their mind.

So do what you think is OK.
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Old May 19th, 2017, 02:55 PM #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deesly1 View Post
So Correct me if I am wrong. I Lower purchased prior to 10/1/2013 was considered a firearm, due to the 4473 and the 77R you filed out. So all rules/laws before 10/1/2013 apply to that firearm! The proof is the 77R. There may be a problem with the long guns purchase before 10/1/2013 because the state never registered a 77R on those particular firearms. IMO
Email MSP and ask the question.

And then a few days later, do it again.

Then post the results.

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