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Old January 8th, 2015, 12:11 PM #1
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CETME Model L (.223) in the US

Guys,

I know a few of you here build your own guns. Very recently APEX brought in some previously unavailable CETME Model L parts kits. These are basically HK33s but the Spanish version. CETME was basically set up using German Engineers fleeing post WWII Germany. So its the unofficial Grandchild of the German MG42 and STG45.

Right now, there are no receivers or semi parts out there but that will change if enough kits come in. I have always kind of loved the CETMEs. So I am thinking of ordering a kit. Price is cheap enough. The only other issues is the FSA of 2013. I don't think this would fall into a banned gun but... I am not 100% sure... maybe 99%. Any thoughts/interest?

I have no association with APEX. These kits could be crap but hopefully they are nice.

https://apexgunparts.com/product_inf...oducts_id/2439

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Old January 8th, 2015, 12:31 PM #2
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Would be nice if you find a barrel and receiver for the kit.
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Old January 8th, 2015, 01:18 PM #3
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I can't see how this would be banned. It's a derivative of the CETME, which is also not banned.

I am in the air about whether I want one. You're talking probably $800-$900 for receiver+barrel+build, so something like $1200 for a completed CETME-L once you add the kit and transfer. I don't necessarily think that's a bad deal, especially for an HK33-alike that uses AR-15 mags. But, much like the HK33, you're getting an obsolete rifle on the other side... so that's a thinker.
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Old January 8th, 2015, 01:43 PM #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erwos View Post
I can't see how this would be banned. It's a derivative of the CETME, which is also not banned.

I am in the air about whether I want one. You're talking probably $800-$900 for receiver+barrel+build, so something like $1200 for a completed CETME-L once you add the kit and transfer. I don't necessarily think that's a bad deal, especially for an HK33-alike that uses AR-15 mags. But, much like the HK33, you're getting an obsolete rifle on the other side... so that's a thinker.
I agree on the ban stuff. You estimate on price is extremely nice I think. Receiver is going to be low production and not cheap. Same with Semi parts for 922r. Build on HK style rifles is also not cheap if you don't do it yourself. That said, its going to be a pretty rare bird if you ever get it shooting. Likely not see one again. This is one of those guns, that if you are just looking for a 223 rifle, this is not for you. You have to want this gun and be willing to do a bit extra to get it. Also quality on these guns is not great. However with almost all parts kits... they almost always go up in price given some time.
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Old January 8th, 2015, 02:03 PM #5
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Barrel should be pretty simple. With no gas port to fool with just about any blank could be turned to make fit (it wont have the fluted chamber though.)

The receiver is where one is going to have to either wait for someone else to build them, or get creative w/ some form tools and make your own. The receiver cross section is much more 'square' than a HK so it would be far simple to make out of a couple pieces of sheetmetal pressed and welded together. As a DIY'er, the sides wouldn't be much harder to make than folding an AK. The rear of the mag well would be the tricky bit (since I dont even have a good pic of what one looks like.) Since the mag release for an AR mag is different than an HK mag, you probably can't even cut up a HK flat for donor rear magwell parts. Though the front of the magwell looks pretty darn square so if the rear is as simple looking it might not be so hard to do a good repro.
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Old January 8th, 2015, 02:30 PM #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IMBLITZVT View Post
Receiver is going to be low production and not cheap. Same with Semi parts for 922r. Build on HK style rifles is also not cheap if you don't do it yourself.
It's just a stamped and welded HK-alike receiver. I don't think it should be that difficult to do. Same for the 922r parts. Build costs are really not so bad for HK rifles, and I envision someone doing a whole bunch of kits production-line-style to keep costs down.

But, you're right - $1200 could be a low estimate, and it might be as much as $1600. There's a lot of good stuff you can buy for that money, and I don't know that this thing is really worth it. Parts kit could be a good investment if you wait for the right moment, but keep in mind that 100k CETME Ls were made... this could be a situation like the Galil parts kits, where it's going to take a long time to run out.
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Old January 8th, 2015, 02:40 PM #7
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Spanish only had it in service for a decade+ or so then replaced it with the G36 I think, but not sure why it was so short lived. Not very encouraging though. Anyone know details?
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Old January 8th, 2015, 02:59 PM #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyCamper View Post
Spanish only had it in service for a decade+ or so then replaced it with the G36 I think, but not sure why it was so short lived. Not very encouraging though. Anyone know details?
Poor performance in the Persian Gulf War due to bad mags. They were supposedly decent enough rifles once you gave them a good magazine.

Keep in mind that the G36 had other benefits over the CETME-L, though - built-in reflex sight, factory folding stock, lighter, etc.
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Old January 8th, 2015, 03:07 PM #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erwos View Post
It's just a stamped and welded HK-alike receiver. I don't think it should be that difficult to do.....100k CETME Ls were made... this could be a situation like the Galil parts kits, where it's going to take a long time to run out.
A stamped receiver is the hardest kind to repro. You need a larger company to do that. You can't just mill one yourself. The stamping dies will be expensive for small production. Who knows if you can import partial complete receiver flats from Spain. Then you need a semi auto design as its different enough I doubt the HK design will cover it.

I have found gun production numbers often don't mean much in terms of what comes on the Civilian market. How many Russian AK parts are in the US... not many at all considering how many were made. Probably more Polish, Romanian, Bulgy...etc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyCamper View Post
Spanish only had it in service for a decade+ or so then replaced it with the G36 I think, but not sure why it was so short lived. Not very encouraging though. Anyone know details?
Reports is that the quality on these guns is not as good. I don't have specifics on that. I still think that beats the M14 service length as standard issue...
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Old January 8th, 2015, 04:16 PM #10
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