Wear and Carry- NOT

Malthus · Oct 5, 2019

PJDiesel said:
They are supposed Maryland's Finest, let them do the police work to find out if you're legit or not. Supplying them with everything but the kitchen sink is part of the way we've gotten to where we are now.

If you are applying for something which requires verification that you actually meet necessary qualifications, it is generally your responsibility to prove that you meet those requirements. Not the duty of the issuing organization. It's silly to try and claim the police (or a bank, insurance company, or anyone else) is responsible for providing the man hours to investigate and verify your claims on an application.

That said, I have no doubt that while there was no direct malice involved in developing the workflow process/website; there was also no desire to try and make it as streamlined and user friendly as was possible either. That's not malice, that's just how many businesses approach IT projects.

Speed, money, quality...pick two. Speed and money almost always win in most projects.

RoadDawg · Oct 5, 2019

Malthus said:
If you are applying for something which requires verification that you actually meet necessary qualifications, it is generally your responsibility to prove that you meet those requirements. Not the duty of the issuing organization. It's silly to try and claim the police (or a bank, insurance company, or anyone else) is responsible for providing the man hours to investigate and verify your claims on an application.

That said, I have no doubt that while there was no direct malice involved in developing the workflow process/website; there was also no desire to try and make it as streamlined and user friendly as was possible either. That's not malice, that's just how many businesses approach IT projects.

Speed, money, quality...pick two. Speed and money almost always win in most projects.

Yup...

PJDiesel · Oct 5, 2019

RoadDawg said:
Yup...

Ask me how much useless ******** I had to supply for my permits to Florida,... or Pennsylvania.

They know upfront I'm not even a resident of their State, let alone a tax paying business owner....

I guess they'll always be cheerleaders and fanboys of the corrupt MSP, no real surprise there.

BeoBill · Oct 5, 2019

CrueChief said:
So I have a question then. I had always thought that with all the technology we have now that it wouldn't take a competent coder very long build said site/portal. Having now read that it would be completely normal for these things to have growing pains even in this day and age is some what surprising. Its not like this is a new thing, I would have thought that there are coders out there who would specialize in this sort of thing, but then again I have no idea what it takes to build one so there is that.

FYI, there are CHILDREN out there that specialize in this type of thing. This is a perfect example of the corrupt Maryland Way of doing things by crony contracting.

Straightshooter · Oct 5, 2019

My question of the day is, does the MSP accept credit card payment through their portal for the HQL? If so, why is it so difficult to accept it for a carry permit?

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BeoBill · Oct 5, 2019

lazarus said:
It is, but GW pushed to contract out everything for government and that goes triple for IT. My agency does most stuff in house and hires a few contractors to supplement certain skills we have a hard time hiring.

Then there are most other federal agencies. Think of it like the DOD model for IT. DOD doesn’t build a tank, they get bids and Raytheon goes and builds a tank and there is a DOD project manager who nominally oversees things. Most other federal agencies have IT program managers who oversee contractors who are contracted to build the system. The later almost always costs more and frequently has more issues.

But, private sector doing the work (with public dollars).

Here's the dirty little secret - Under DFARS, contractors are NOT shown in manpower slot allocations, so they become O&M costs, essentially invisible to the outside (because most "look sees" are rollups of rollups of rollups, etc.). It's almost impossible to isolate a single line item without burning a bunch of resources. And in the grand scheme of things, a small program/agency IT contract is lost in the rounding error of a CCs budget submittal. So they can hide the occasional Cadillac freelancer hire for a few months work as a subcontract within the 8a Prime's subcontract. They can even use "Other Year" money to further obscure the GS bosses' nephew.

BeoBill · Oct 5, 2019

Straightshooter said:
My question of the day is, does the MSP accept credit card payment through their portal for the HQL? If so, why is it so difficult to accept it for a carry permit?

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Can't make it too easy for the serfs to petition the Crown to exercise their civil right...

miles71 · Oct 6, 2019

I curious to see how an independent sole proprietor is handeled by the MSP. Anyone who does any services in md can be a sole proprietor without and llc or even business account.

For example, the business the MSP has created, firearms instructor!

Hmmmmmmm I say.

TD

Straightshooter · Oct 6, 2019

miles71 said:
I curious to see how an independent sole proprietor is handeled by the MSP. Anyone who does any services in md can be a sole proprietor without and llc or even business account.

For example, the business the MSP has created, firearms instructor!

Hmmmmmmm I say.

TD

Don't firearms instructors receive a certificate from the MSP?

But you are correct in your thinking that MSP has no idea what is involved in working a real job.

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Applehd · Oct 6, 2019

miles71 said:
I curious to see how an independent sole proprietor is handeled by the MSP. Anyone who does any services in md can be a sole proprietor without and llc or even business account.

For example, the business the MSP has created, firearms instructor!

Hmmmmmmm I say.

TD

Not sure what you are trying to say. I am a sole proprietorship and supplied Md. Business Express active business page, tax use, and FEIN page.
ETA... I would guess that a business checking account would keep their noses out of your private checking account.

miles71 · Oct 6, 2019

What I'm saying is in Maryland a person can be a sole proprietor without much and is still considered a business.
TD

Straightshooter · Oct 6, 2019

Those of us who live in the real world agree with you. The MSP Licensing Division lives in an alternate universe where everthing has to be goverment approved.

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PJDiesel · Oct 6, 2019

What he said......

Applehd · Oct 6, 2019

miles71 said:
What I'm saying is in Maryland a person can be a sole proprietor without much and is still considered a business.
TD

They really don't give a shit about your well-being, self-defense, or safety... they wanna see bank activity. It's, pretty much, the only thing that they see as good and substantial. That's the reality of it. Plain and simple.

Straightshooter said:
Those of us who live in the real world agree with you. The MSP Licensing Division lives in an alternate universe where everthing has to be goverment approved.

...and this. :sad20:

miles71 · Oct 6, 2019

Now don’t get your panties in a bind. I agree totally the process is silly and unfair and........

I was just saying it’s going to be interesting how the MSP deals with all the business types in Maryland.

I agree, this all sets up someone for a discrimination law suit if the they are denied or given any restrictions just because the MSP decides one business is not as businessy as another.

Now let’s all gather around the campfire for a singalong

TD

Straightshooter · Oct 6, 2019

miles71 said:
Now don’t get your panties in a bind. I agree totally the process is silly and unfair and........

I was just saying it’s going to be interesting how the MSP deals with all the business types in Maryland.

I agree, this all sets up someone for a discrimination law suit if the they are denied or given any restrictions just because the MSP decides one business is not as businessy as another.

Now let’s all gather around the campfire for a singalong

TD

I just dont see where you are coming from with the "it's going to be interesting to see how msp will deal with businesses". They've been dealing with it for quite some time. You either prove you're a business by providing the documents they require or you get denied. From there, you head to the appeals process.

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Applehd · Oct 6, 2019

miles71 said:
Now don’t get your panties in a bind...

...MSP decides one business is not as businessy as another.

Not in a bind... but I am in the renewal process and I'll let you know if my company is 'businessy' enough... not really looking forward to dealing with any MSPLD nonsense... it's becoming tiresome.

Nobody · Oct 6, 2019

miles71 said:
I curious to see how an independent sole proprietor is handeled by the MSP. Anyone who does any services in md can be a sole proprietor without and llc or even business account.

For example, the business the MSP has created, firearms instructor!

Hmmmmmmm I say.

TD

I am a sole proprietor and have no business licence. I am not required to by law and only provide a service. I do not collect sales tax but i do file 4 different schedule "c"s. Not hard to prove you are a business.

I would also say or would be pretty easy to fake one as well although i would not suggest it.

Nobody

Biggfoot44 · Oct 7, 2019

I'm with " it will be interesting to see " camp.

Yes, MSP has been dealing with this for a while , but we know well they can flip flop on a dime . They * might* percieve that the recent policy on Business Owners changes the playing field , and they have to step up their game, in order to keep the number of outstanding unrestricted Permits from escalating .

Now mind you, I would be delighted for my suspicions to be shown to be groundless , and hopefully they will .

Straightshooter · Oct 7, 2019

Biggfoot44 said:
I'm with " it will be interesting to see " camp.

Yes, MSP has been dealing with this for a while , but we know well they can flip flop on a dime . They * might* percieve that the recent policy on Business Owners changes the playing field , and they have to step up their game, in order to keep the number of outstanding unrestricted Permits from escalating .

Now mind you, I would be delighted for my suspicions to be shown to be groundless , and hopefully they will .

Don't lose sight of the fact that THEY made the changes in business owner restrictions. I dont see where the switch to an online application system has any bearing on that.

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