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Where to start.... Adjustable gas block, what a difference ! I whole heartedly recommend the SLR adjustable gas block, it truly transformed the abrupt cycling PA10 into a smooth cycling .308 rifle. Ended up using the 5 clicks from fully closed setting, 10 more clicks ( opening the gas flow more ) were available.
I used the standard weight AR15 rifle buffer for the accuracy and function testing first
4 clicks failed to cycle 2 of 20 rounds of FGMM .308 168gr, and 5 of 40rds of ZQI, 2 of 20 Horn. TAP "AR" ( ... 5 clicks performed 100% with the FGMM, ZQI ) The Hornady TAP "AR" needed 6 clicks to cycle with the KAK 9.3oz heavy rifle buffer.
Interestingly, at one point while firing the Horn. TAP AR round , I adjusted the gas block one additional click wider, and the point of impact for the next 10rds shifted 2 inches down and 2 1/2 inches left ?! .... It is just as possible that I "shifted" as well... but 10rds makes it hard for me to think it was just me.
ZQI also performed miserably accuracy wise ... again.
At 5 clicks and the rifle fired approx. 300rds trouble free. ( Except the later heavy buffer tested 2 Horn. rds. , with the standard rifle buffer it was fine )
The brass caseheads no longer show smear marks from the ejector, which is directly attributable to the "slower" ( milliseconds slower ) speed of the action. Pressure levels have dropped more prior to extraction because of this... so the case has a moment more to time to lose the chamber gripping PSI.
The new replaced by me ..firing pin retaining cotter key is not bent ( I forgot to mention this earlier, the OEM PSA cotter key was getting bent from the violent cycling !?!? , I had a replacement on hand so changed it out )
The rifle now feels like a 7.62x39 AR.... so it is a pleasure to shoot !!
I haven't compared group measurements yet ( from the OEM configuration compared to the current configuration ) ... but I did see improvement, for the most part across the board.
I will add.... the GEN 3 Magpul PRS's recoil pad.. while "softer" then the old models, needs the sharp edges radiused more..... by rd 300, it was biting into the shoulder more then needed... I will fix that !
Later on I will post the various ammos groups.
I used the standard weight AR15 rifle buffer for the accuracy and function testing first
4 clicks failed to cycle 2 of 20 rounds of FGMM .308 168gr, and 5 of 40rds of ZQI, 2 of 20 Horn. TAP "AR" ( ... 5 clicks performed 100% with the FGMM, ZQI ) The Hornady TAP "AR" needed 6 clicks to cycle with the KAK 9.3oz heavy rifle buffer.
Interestingly, at one point while firing the Horn. TAP AR round , I adjusted the gas block one additional click wider, and the point of impact for the next 10rds shifted 2 inches down and 2 1/2 inches left ?! .... It is just as possible that I "shifted" as well... but 10rds makes it hard for me to think it was just me.
ZQI also performed miserably accuracy wise ... again.
At 5 clicks and the rifle fired approx. 300rds trouble free. ( Except the later heavy buffer tested 2 Horn. rds. , with the standard rifle buffer it was fine )
The brass caseheads no longer show smear marks from the ejector, which is directly attributable to the "slower" ( milliseconds slower ) speed of the action. Pressure levels have dropped more prior to extraction because of this... so the case has a moment more to time to lose the chamber gripping PSI.
The new replaced by me ..firing pin retaining cotter key is not bent ( I forgot to mention this earlier, the OEM PSA cotter key was getting bent from the violent cycling !?!? , I had a replacement on hand so changed it out )
The rifle now feels like a 7.62x39 AR.... so it is a pleasure to shoot !!
I haven't compared group measurements yet ( from the OEM configuration compared to the current configuration ) ... but I did see improvement, for the most part across the board.
I will add.... the GEN 3 Magpul PRS's recoil pad.. while "softer" then the old models, needs the sharp edges radiused more..... by rd 300, it was biting into the shoulder more then needed... I will fix that !
Later on I will post the various ammos groups.
1st Photo....FGMM 168gr... Oddly, the rifle prefers , slow methodical shooting with this ammo.
2nd photo ...Reasonably rapid fire... ( bang, back on target, bang ) produces large groups ... not all ammo did this.
3rd photo.... GGG 2013 Ball.... GGG preferred to be rapid fired....
4th photo.... as well as the XM80 Ball, rapid fire.
Maybe shouldn't drink so much coffee and smoke so many cigs, prior to accuracy testing.... Lol
2nd photo ...Reasonably rapid fire... ( bang, back on target, bang ) produces large groups ... not all ammo did this.
3rd photo.... GGG 2013 Ball.... GGG preferred to be rapid fired....
4th photo.... as well as the XM80 Ball, rapid fire.
Maybe shouldn't drink so much coffee and smoke so many cigs, prior to accuracy testing.... Lol
1st photo ..... MEN 2016 Ball
2nd photo .....MEN 2016 ball again
3rd photo.../ Aus. Outback 168gr SMK
4th photo.....Hornady TAP "AR" .... this is the Heavy Buffer group that shifted after "one more click of gas "....first 6 , top right, added click, bottom left 5.... ( Rifles are fussy !! )
2nd photo .....MEN 2016 ball again
3rd photo.../ Aus. Outback 168gr SMK
4th photo.....Hornady TAP "AR" .... this is the Heavy Buffer group that shifted after "one more click of gas "....first 6 , top right, added click, bottom left 5.... ( Rifles are fussy !! )
Survialshop...
"Are you using the Armalite AR 10 Buffer system ? "
This one from PSA....http://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-pa10-a2-rifle-buffer-tube-kit.html
"Depends on if it was sighted in with the Tap Ammo or are you saying g it changed after the Gas system adj. . "
POI changed after adjusting one click more open.
"Doughtful Chamber pressure changed by small adj. to redirected propellant gas through Barrels Gas Port , Chamber pressure has already dropped by the time the Buulet passes the Gas Port . Action may be loosening up from round count , breaking in , more or less . "
Agreed about chamber pressure... I should have said less gas being used to yank the case from the chamber while the chambered round is still at high pressure... so the "slower" cyclic action of the BCG is "allowing" the case more time ( milliseconds ) before extracting.
"Sounds like FP over travel , could be a Machining issue , out of spec Bolt . The FP retaining pin is only to hold it in place , don't think it should touch it , the FP has stop flange for that purpose & it should stop correctly by the machined surface or flange inside the Bolt . "
Interesting... I will have to look into this more. FWIW, No primers appeared pierced, and for the most part looked "normal". ... I will say the Hirt. cases had pretty "deep" firing pin strikes.
"Are you using the Armalite AR 10 Buffer system ? "
This one from PSA....http://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-pa10-a2-rifle-buffer-tube-kit.html
"Depends on if it was sighted in with the Tap Ammo or are you saying g it changed after the Gas system adj. . "
POI changed after adjusting one click more open.
"Doughtful Chamber pressure changed by small adj. to redirected propellant gas through Barrels Gas Port , Chamber pressure has already dropped by the time the Buulet passes the Gas Port . Action may be loosening up from round count , breaking in , more or less . "
Agreed about chamber pressure... I should have said less gas being used to yank the case from the chamber while the chambered round is still at high pressure... so the "slower" cyclic action of the BCG is "allowing" the case more time ( milliseconds ) before extracting.
"Sounds like FP over travel , could be a Machining issue , out of spec Bolt . The FP retaining pin is only to hold it in place , don't think it should touch it , the FP has stop flange for that purpose & it should stop correctly by the machined surface or flange inside the Bolt . "
Interesting... I will have to look into this more. FWIW, No primers appeared pierced, and for the most part looked "normal". ... I will say the Hirt. cases had pretty "deep" firing pin strikes.
Just an FYI.... Apparently Magpul makes a different MIAD Gen 1.1 Type 2 hand grip with taller backstraps for the PA10.... I have ordered one up, as well as some of the Brownells $10 AR10 metal mags to try out.
"* NOTE: This TYPE 2 Kit uses taller backstraps for optimized fit with certain 7.62x51 receivers such as the Armalite AR-10A/B/T, DPMS LR308, KAC SR25, LaRue OBR, LMT .308 MWS, Palmetto PA10, and S&W M&P10."
https://www.magpul.com/products/miad-gen-1-1-grip-kit-type-2
Received and installed... fixed issue.
"* NOTE: This TYPE 2 Kit uses taller backstraps for optimized fit with certain 7.62x51 receivers such as the Armalite AR-10A/B/T, DPMS LR308, KAC SR25, LaRue OBR, LMT .308 MWS, Palmetto PA10, and S&W M&P10."
https://www.magpul.com/products/miad-gen-1-1-grip-kit-type-2
Received and installed... fixed issue.
at this point I would not buy more Brownells 20rd mags at even $5 a mag.... even if a little filing at the latch helps.
I just received mine, unloaded, ....width 1.0645..... snug fit in magwell.....with bolt closed, locks in well , .... does remove freely ( not quite drops free ).
Loaded 20rds easily..... loaded width 1.099... tight fit in magwell.... have to VERY FIRMLY smack the bottom to get it to lock in ( even after filling some of the OAL of the leg off of both the front and back of the follower..... and it will not drop free, ( while fully loaded.. period. )
I will try to lightly file the mags latch area, in order to make insertion easier.... but, I think the ultimate problem is the feedlip spread, since unloaded it snapped into place easily.
Function was 100% hand cycled.
I just received mine, unloaded, ....width 1.0645..... snug fit in magwell.....with bolt closed, locks in well , .... does remove freely ( not quite drops free ).
Loaded 20rds easily..... loaded width 1.099... tight fit in magwell.... have to VERY FIRMLY smack the bottom to get it to lock in ( even after filling some of the OAL of the leg off of both the front and back of the follower..... and it will not drop free, ( while fully loaded.. period. )
I will try to lightly file the mags latch area, in order to make insertion easier.... but, I think the ultimate problem is the feedlip spread, since unloaded it snapped into place easily.
Function was 100% hand cycled.
Ok... while I am happy with the rifles performance, eventually I will want better accuracy. Criterion, Krieger, Bartlein barrels or such..... 18" 1n10 twist or a 20" maybe.
What barrel spec's ( DPMS ? ) should I keep an eye out for ? .... and will the PA10 Bolt work with what barrels ?
For that matter, I would like a spare BCG or bolt in general... PSA is almost always out of stock, so what other ones are compatible ?
I wish PSA wasn't so "secretive" about the various parts and such....
Updated Criterion Barrels said their barrels are GTG.
Thanks ahead of time !
What barrel spec's ( DPMS ? ) should I keep an eye out for ? .... and will the PA10 Bolt work with what barrels ?
For that matter, I would like a spare BCG or bolt in general... PSA is almost always out of stock, so what other ones are compatible ?
I wish PSA wasn't so "secretive" about the various parts and such....
Updated Criterion Barrels said their barrels are GTG.
Thanks ahead of time !
So, I ordered another upper... in SS.. 18" ( one of the two will be a parts donor to my better barrel.....) between the 2, which ever is less accurate will receive the new barrel.
So which ever upper is the lesser will be the parts donor for the better barrel.
My M21 and My Krieger barreled AR15 will shoot most all ammo "better" ( those barrels have made me an addict to accuracy ) ... they both have ammo they hate, but for the most part there is a general improvement in overall accuracy ... that is what I'd like with a better quality barrel.
The issue with the M21 is it only holds great accuracy for about 150rds before the groups open up ( seems to be related to the gas piston and fouling )... a good cleaning will restore the accuracy, but the Krieger AR15 doesn't do that.... I am hoping the AR platform in .308 ( with a decent barrel and a little finessing.. trueing the receiver face and a properly headspaced bolt ) will yield the results I would like.
At this point, I am strongly considering a 18" or 20"Criterion rifle length gas. The price is good and the reputation is very good.
So which ever upper is the lesser will be the parts donor for the better barrel.
My M21 and My Krieger barreled AR15 will shoot most all ammo "better" ( those barrels have made me an addict to accuracy ) ... they both have ammo they hate, but for the most part there is a general improvement in overall accuracy ... that is what I'd like with a better quality barrel.
The issue with the M21 is it only holds great accuracy for about 150rds before the groups open up ( seems to be related to the gas piston and fouling )... a good cleaning will restore the accuracy, but the Krieger AR15 doesn't do that.... I am hoping the AR platform in .308 ( with a decent barrel and a little finessing.. trueing the receiver face and a properly headspaced bolt ) will yield the results I would like.
At this point, I am strongly considering a 18" or 20"Criterion rifle length gas. The price is good and the reputation is very good.
Old Sarge..
Currently I am using a Primary Arrms 4-14x44... IMHO it is a heck of a deal for a Front Focal plane scope.
http://www.primaryarms.com/primary-...pe-acss-hud-dmr-308-223-reticle-pa4-14xffp308
The mount is just as good.
I have numerous that I have been using for years.
Quote....
" Whats the thing weigh . I didn't see it specified , even in the manual ."
1lb 7oz at least... so with the mount I imagine close to two lbs.... heavy to be sure, but it is FFP .. and that is what my tired old eyes like.
Currently I am using a Primary Arrms 4-14x44... IMHO it is a heck of a deal for a Front Focal plane scope.
http://www.primaryarms.com/primary-...pe-acss-hud-dmr-308-223-reticle-pa4-14xffp308
The mount is just as good.
I have numerous that I have been using for years.
Quote....
" Whats the thing weigh . I didn't see it specified , even in the manual ."
1lb 7oz at least... so with the mount I imagine close to two lbs.... heavy to be sure, but it is FFP .. and that is what my tired old eyes like.
Well.... I ordered up the "better" barrel today....
Criterion 18" Middie.... https://msrarms.com/collections/m-o...rid-contour-barrel-308-ar?variant=29092302337
As well as the Brownells version of the Geissele reaction rod and JP Upper vise blocks.
After shooting again on last Sat. ... I couldn't bear the thought of shooting so much expensive ( compared to 5.56 ) .308, and accepting the PSA barrels accuracy level ( really , Lack of accuracy ).
Criterion said the barrel should fit just fine, but did caution me about using the Nickel Boron Bolt... the reason being .. A. Quality, ... B. Since it is a coating, headspace could be excess as it possibly wears off / flakes off the locking lugs or bolt face.
Interesting... I had never thought of that.
Granted if the bolt was produced properly, it should be a-ok.
For me... that is another reason to use a conv. bolt or a nitrated bolt... or at least one that is not a coating.
Criterion commented on this at another forum...
Originally Posted by smoothy8500 View Post
Then again some of the Ni Boron bolts have insufficient headspace since the coating built-up on the bolt face.
^ This! The gentleman you spoke with (I'm guessing it was Mike) has had some issues with improperly coated BCG's wearing or flaking over time in the past, but an issue you're more likely to run into (if you purchase a budget Nickel Boron BCG) is a manufacturer that does not take into account the added surface material thickness into their production specifications, creating potential headspace issues.
As a caveat, this by no means indicates that a Nickel Boron finish is inferior or not recommended for use as a BCG coating. I would just recommend reading a number of reviews before purchasing any new bolt carrier group to see if the BCG manufacturer's customers have encountered issues in the past. Checking headspace is always a good idea, and it never hurts to do a little product research before buying!
Boot_Scraper.... Same here... the "budget" idea is long gone :laffs::laffs:... I was lying to myself anyway !!
Accuracy is addictive.... you know what they say, "Only an accurate rifle is interesting."
I knew I wouldn't be happy unless the rifle was "hopefully" as accurate as my SAI '96 M21... for a longer firing session.. soooooo.... I just hope no one puts a Krieger .308 barrel on sale during the "Labor Day" sales... or a Vortex scope.... or a.... ( PSA already had 168gr FGMM back on sale for $16 / 20rds, damn them ! )
Actually... the worse part was, realizing I have all the tools I need to build an AR15.... not an AR10 sized receiver...
Criterion 18" Middie.... https://msrarms.com/collections/m-o...rid-contour-barrel-308-ar?variant=29092302337
As well as the Brownells version of the Geissele reaction rod and JP Upper vise blocks.
After shooting again on last Sat. ... I couldn't bear the thought of shooting so much expensive ( compared to 5.56 ) .308, and accepting the PSA barrels accuracy level ( really , Lack of accuracy ).
Criterion said the barrel should fit just fine, but did caution me about using the Nickel Boron Bolt... the reason being .. A. Quality, ... B. Since it is a coating, headspace could be excess as it possibly wears off / flakes off the locking lugs or bolt face.
Interesting... I had never thought of that.
Granted if the bolt was produced properly, it should be a-ok.
For me... that is another reason to use a conv. bolt or a nitrated bolt... or at least one that is not a coating.
Criterion commented on this at another forum...
Originally Posted by smoothy8500 View Post
Then again some of the Ni Boron bolts have insufficient headspace since the coating built-up on the bolt face.
^ This! The gentleman you spoke with (I'm guessing it was Mike) has had some issues with improperly coated BCG's wearing or flaking over time in the past, but an issue you're more likely to run into (if you purchase a budget Nickel Boron BCG) is a manufacturer that does not take into account the added surface material thickness into their production specifications, creating potential headspace issues.
As a caveat, this by no means indicates that a Nickel Boron finish is inferior or not recommended for use as a BCG coating. I would just recommend reading a number of reviews before purchasing any new bolt carrier group to see if the BCG manufacturer's customers have encountered issues in the past. Checking headspace is always a good idea, and it never hurts to do a little product research before buying!
Boot_Scraper.... Same here... the "budget" idea is long gone :laffs::laffs:... I was lying to myself anyway !!
Accuracy is addictive.... you know what they say, "Only an accurate rifle is interesting."
I knew I wouldn't be happy unless the rifle was "hopefully" as accurate as my SAI '96 M21... for a longer firing session.. soooooo.... I just hope no one puts a Krieger .308 barrel on sale during the "Labor Day" sales... or a Vortex scope.... or a.... ( PSA already had 168gr FGMM back on sale for $16 / 20rds, damn them ! )
Actually... the worse part was, realizing I have all the tools I need to build an AR15.... not an AR10 sized receiver...
I received the SS Barreled Upper today from PSA...18" middie, FF, SS barrel, Nitrated BCG
http://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-...15-m-lok-upper-with-bcg-and-ch-516445088.html
Weight of just the upper, from the PSA is 5 1/3lbs
I has the same gas tube binding issue the FF Barrel nut and the BCG... exactly the same. ( The barrel nut makes contact with the gas tube, forcing it in to the top
The gas key is properly staked... just like the first.
The charging handle lacks the raised "tab" at the front of it.. just like the first.
The upper is also bone dry...no extra oil at all... a very slight amount of something on the BCG.
Going to change the gas block to an SLR adjustable, grind down the barrel nut flat to allow free movement of the gas tube, oil it up, use a BCM Gunfighter "Brake" on this barrel and see how it shoots.
I am hoping for better accuracy then the nitrated barrel has done, and will be reporting more info as I get it.
Again, which ever upper shoots the worst, will receive the Criterion replacement barrel. ( I have high hopes for much better, consistent accuracy )
Photos of its OEM state will follow.
http://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-...15-m-lok-upper-with-bcg-and-ch-516445088.html
Weight of just the upper, from the PSA is 5 1/3lbs
I has the same gas tube binding issue the FF Barrel nut and the BCG... exactly the same. ( The barrel nut makes contact with the gas tube, forcing it in to the top
The gas key is properly staked... just like the first.
The charging handle lacks the raised "tab" at the front of it.. just like the first.
The upper is also bone dry...no extra oil at all... a very slight amount of something on the BCG.
Going to change the gas block to an SLR adjustable, grind down the barrel nut flat to allow free movement of the gas tube, oil it up, use a BCM Gunfighter "Brake" on this barrel and see how it shoots.
I am hoping for better accuracy then the nitrated barrel has done, and will be reporting more info as I get it.
Again, which ever upper shoots the worst, will receive the Criterion replacement barrel. ( I have high hopes for much better, consistent accuracy )
Photos of its OEM state will follow.
This has been a great thread to read. As a new guy to 308 ARs, and one who has been out of the AR game in general for almost 20 years, I have enjoyed reading your posts as well as those of the other very helpful contributors... my son just bought a PSA PA-10 (http://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-...-win-ss-lightweight-15-m-lok-acs-l-rifle.html) and I forwarded him the link to this thread. I think he needs to read this before he receives the rifle, so he knows what he could expect.
This thread also has helped me make the decision to dive into a 308 AR myself, and the PSA seems to be a fairly safe bet for the money, as long as one is OK with the possibility of having to tweak things some. Since I'm not afraid of that possibility, I think I am going to jump on the bandwagon and order one for myself. I will probably go with the Classic Lower, and the 18 mid length M4 style upper, since they come to about $460 all together right now, and with 8 kids and 3 dogs, I'm all about budget.
So, bfoosh006, my pocketbook sincerely thanks you for your well written reviews, because otherwise I would no doubt be looking towards a much higher priced entry into the 308 AR world.
This thread also has helped me make the decision to dive into a 308 AR myself, and the PSA seems to be a fairly safe bet for the money, as long as one is OK with the possibility of having to tweak things some. Since I'm not afraid of that possibility, I think I am going to jump on the bandwagon and order one for myself. I will probably go with the Classic Lower, and the 18 mid length M4 style upper, since they come to about $460 all together right now, and with 8 kids and 3 dogs, I'm all about budget.
So, bfoosh006, my pocketbook sincerely thanks you for your well written reviews, because otherwise I would no doubt be looking towards a much higher priced entry into the 308 AR world.
bfoosh006
Members
109 posts
Posted Monday at 08:21 PM
This is the new 18" SS upper....
The first image is with the OEM gas block loosened and pulled back so everyone can see how much the barrel nut was pushing the gas tube up, it would not freely enter the gas tube hole at all... as a matter of fact it took a fair bit of gentle pushing to allow it to go in.
The second image is with it entered into the hole in the receiver... note how much it is flexed at the front of the gas block.
Third photo shows the wear from the OEM install and me taking it on and off.
Furth photo show the clearance now after grinding off material along the entire top... free movement and clearance.
I will add... the gas tube was binding the BCG ( via the gas tube interaction ) the same way my first upper was.
Again That binding will not help accuracy and function ( let alone longevity of parts ) at all.
So if yours is like the first photo... fix it for your own good... I'd bet you'll be happy you did.
bfoosh006
Members
109 posts
Posted Monday at 08:21 PM
This is the new 18" SS upper....
The first image is with the OEM gas block loosened and pulled back so everyone can see how much the barrel nut was pushing the gas tube up, it would not freely enter the gas tube hole at all... as a matter of fact it took a fair bit of gentle pushing to allow it to go in.
The second image is with it entered into the hole in the receiver... note how much it is flexed at the front of the gas block.
Third photo shows the wear from the OEM install and me taking it on and off.
Furth photo show the clearance now after grinding off material along the entire top... free movement and clearance.
I will add... the gas tube was binding the BCG ( via the gas tube interaction ) the same way my first upper was.
Again That binding will not help accuracy and function ( let alone longevity of parts ) at all.
So if yours is like the first photo... fix it for your own good... I'd bet you'll be happy you did.
QUOTE....
"why not just slightly bend the gas tube.. if you move the barrelnut on and off again it will be yet another thing to try to line up and may the tourque gods be with you.. just reading your last thread maybe i missed something in the process.. i had to bend a gas tube "just" on a build and it has been reassembled three times.. shoots as expected! just a fraction to clear! my .02 "
IMHO... while I could have bent the gas tube.. it may have worked or not... the amount of heat going through the gas tube is a lot, so I wanted the gas tube to be unaffected by any external forces, either from me or the barrel nut.
Quote....
how much heat does a barrel nut get? just sayin.. my opinion is the long run factor, i think you are doing a good job with what you have to work with and im no expert. i like it simple, less cutting is more to work with..
as i think about it a gas tube would be eaiser/ cheeper to replace.. my .02
I think the heat he is referring to is how it effects the Gas Tube , they are effected by it & do expand some , not to mention some pressure spike movement when peak Gas signature is put to them .
The Gas Tube path is a common issue with 308AR Barrel nuts , not so much any more , because most manufacturers have learned that the 308AR Barrel Nut is much larger the its little brother . "
Just to be clear.. yes, I was referring to the heat in the gas tube.. I don't like the idea of trial and error on bending the gas tube. ...( YMMV )
For the sake of accuracy, the BCG should freely return to battery, the same way every time.
And the PSA FF barrel nut has no splines to line up ( like a "normal barrel nut ) with the gas tube.
"why not just slightly bend the gas tube.. if you move the barrelnut on and off again it will be yet another thing to try to line up and may the tourque gods be with you.. just reading your last thread maybe i missed something in the process.. i had to bend a gas tube "just" on a build and it has been reassembled three times.. shoots as expected! just a fraction to clear! my .02 "
IMHO... while I could have bent the gas tube.. it may have worked or not... the amount of heat going through the gas tube is a lot, so I wanted the gas tube to be unaffected by any external forces, either from me or the barrel nut.
Quote....
how much heat does a barrel nut get? just sayin.. my opinion is the long run factor, i think you are doing a good job with what you have to work with and im no expert. i like it simple, less cutting is more to work with..
as i think about it a gas tube would be eaiser/ cheeper to replace.. my .02
I think the heat he is referring to is how it effects the Gas Tube , they are effected by it & do expand some , not to mention some pressure spike movement when peak Gas signature is put to them .
The Gas Tube path is a common issue with 308AR Barrel nuts , not so much any more , because most manufacturers have learned that the 308AR Barrel Nut is much larger the its little brother . "
Just to be clear.. yes, I was referring to the heat in the gas tube.. I don't like the idea of trial and error on bending the gas tube. ...( YMMV )
For the sake of accuracy, the BCG should freely return to battery, the same way every time.
And the PSA FF barrel nut has no splines to line up ( like a "normal barrel nut ) with the gas tube.
And, because times have changed ( and no offense to anyone ) ..... I will give a "beware of what some guy on the internet says to do" warning... and anyone doing what I have done is proceeding at their own risk !!, ....as I have no way of knowing anyone's level of proficiency with home "gunsmithing" and "do it yourself tasks". IF YOU ARE NOT COMFORTABLE doing what I have chosen to do, then DON'T DO IT !
Me and/or anyone, including the webpage, at www.mdshooters.com is responsible for someone else's own decision's and actions.
I am not saying this to be mean spirited, but more as a warning. Make your own decisions, and be responsible for your own choices.
I am saying that is the route I took. I am not sure I could have bent the gas tube enough or correctly.. at least to my liking.
Also, honestly.. had I not ground the barrel nut, I still feel like the edge closest to the receiver would have been pushing on the gas tube.
AGAIN no offense to anyone !! I have been quite specific through this thread as to what worked for me... I don't want to feel like I should stop posting based on someone not understanding what I am doing with my property.
Me and/or anyone, including the webpage, at www.mdshooters.com is responsible for someone else's own decision's and actions.
I am not saying this to be mean spirited, but more as a warning. Make your own decisions, and be responsible for your own choices.
I am saying that is the route I took. I am not sure I could have bent the gas tube enough or correctly.. at least to my liking.
Also, honestly.. had I not ground the barrel nut, I still feel like the edge closest to the receiver would have been pushing on the gas tube.
AGAIN no offense to anyone !! I have been quite specific through this thread as to what worked for me... I don't want to feel like I should stop posting based on someone not understanding what I am doing with my property.
Updates...
The D&H 20rd and 10rd mags feel much stronger the Brownells...they latch in better then the Brownells, needing only a normal slap, but do not drop free currently. I can feel a little feed lip spread when fully loaded, but not enough to hinder seating.
They are not better fitting / sliding then the Magpuls or Lancers...
So if you want some smooth sided fits all USGI M14 type mags... I'd use them.
Hand cycled feeding was perfect....I think after the magwell wears in they will drop free better.
The Brownells version of the Geissele reaction rod is "Ok"... I didn't bother to look at the overall length and you need to use a 1/2 drive ratchet to secure it... there is in no way, enough of the rod sticking out the ass end of the receiver to DIY grind vise flats and still engage the barrel extension locking lugs.
And I was expecting a snugger fit into said locking lugs... the rest of the rod fits in the BCG channel perfectly
The JP Universal Vise blocks are GTG... I would have preferred the blocks extend the entire length of the receiver, rather then one end or the other.
The D&H 20rd and 10rd mags feel much stronger the Brownells...they latch in better then the Brownells, needing only a normal slap, but do not drop free currently. I can feel a little feed lip spread when fully loaded, but not enough to hinder seating.
They are not better fitting / sliding then the Magpuls or Lancers...
So if you want some smooth sided fits all USGI M14 type mags... I'd use them.
Hand cycled feeding was perfect....I think after the magwell wears in they will drop free better.
The Brownells version of the Geissele reaction rod is "Ok"... I didn't bother to look at the overall length and you need to use a 1/2 drive ratchet to secure it... there is in no way, enough of the rod sticking out the ass end of the receiver to DIY grind vise flats and still engage the barrel extension locking lugs.
And I was expecting a snugger fit into said locking lugs... the rest of the rod fits in the BCG channel perfectly
The JP Universal Vise blocks are GTG... I would have preferred the blocks extend the entire length of the receiver, rather then one end or the other.
The Criterion Barrel...
I want to make a special notation about the quality of the packaging Criterion did...
Outstanding will sum it up.
Heavy Cardboard tube, bubble wrapped with plenty of spare on both the muzzle end and breach end, PlastiDip type caps on the breach end ( clear over the rim that makes contact with the receiver face ) and on the muzzle and that expandable plastic netting over all of it.
Details count !!! The care taken in packaging, makes me think they really do take pride in their workmanship.
Thank You Criterion Barrels.
I have to say... if I knew which upper was going to be the recipient of the Criterion Barrel... I would probably stay up waaaay to late getting it installed.
I want to make a special notation about the quality of the packaging Criterion did...
Outstanding will sum it up.
Heavy Cardboard tube, bubble wrapped with plenty of spare on both the muzzle end and breach end, PlastiDip type caps on the breach end ( clear over the rim that makes contact with the receiver face ) and on the muzzle and that expandable plastic netting over all of it.
Details count !!! The care taken in packaging, makes me think they really do take pride in their workmanship.
Thank You Criterion Barrels.
I have to say... if I knew which upper was going to be the recipient of the Criterion Barrel... I would probably stay up waaaay to late getting it installed.
