Colt to halt making AR-15's

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  • woodline

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Jan 8, 2017
    1,947
    It is interesting to see how polarized people are when it comes to Colt. I carried a colt M4A1 SOPMOD 2 in the Army. It worked fine for me, but didn't engender any specific strong feelings. Good tool. The rifles I've gotten to use the past few years (LWRC, H&K416, KAC SR16, Geissele) were all fine too, though I'd tend to admit I am most fond of the latter two. Far smoother shooting and more accurate than my colt. That said I'd have no problem carrying a colt again if that was what I was issued. Would rate it about middle of the pack. Above the LWRC and H&K (too heavy), below the KAC and Geissele. It's like the eagle plate carrier and heavy plates I used to have: way better than the crap big army was getting, way clunkier than what I have now.

    I think the timing of this announcement is interesting. It definitely preempts Colt having to take any sort of political stance at a time when anti-gun sentiment is higher than it has been since the last AWB. It may be a factor, or it may not. I don't think it would stop me from buying colt products in the future, if Colt made anything that I particularly wanted. Their ARs tend to lack features that I would prefer, so buying colt just to have the pony + spending $500-$1000 to set the rifle up the way I like seems like a waste. I guess that's what I get for being picky about triggers, rails, and furniture though. The OEM2 seems like the best fit for me. Toss the A2 grip, add a Geissele or BCM rail, add BCM furniture, Geissele or LaRue trigger. Seems like less of a hassle just to build what I want or buy from a manufacturer that sets rifles up the way I like them already.

    Incidentally I do not happen to be sentimental for the older style models that colt seems to be most loved for, so that may be why I don't feel strongly about them one way or the other.
     

    ironpony

    Member
    MDS Supporter
    Jun 8, 2013
    7,229
    Davidsonville
    My curiosity of with whom their contracts are with reminds me of a comment I recently read, FOX or FB ? Comment: "The AR15 is not used by any army in the world." This had many likes and was in regards to a "no weapons of war" post. So I ask, is it true that no armys use the AR15? Name one for 100 internet point.
     

    danb

    dont be a dumbass
    Feb 24, 2013
    22,704
    google is your friend, I am not.
    My curiosity of with whom their contracts are with reminds me of a comment I recently read, FOX or FB ? Comment: "The AR15 is not used by any army in the world." This had many likes and was in regards to a "no weapons of war" post. So I ask, is it true that no armys use the AR15? Name one for 100 internet point.

    AR15 is semi-auto, so this is probably what they mean. The age old conflation of semi-auto and full auto is how we get a scary black rifle ban. If Colt is contracting with governments, law enforcement, and military, they are probably selling both semi and full auto versions of their scary black rifles.
     

    ironpony

    Member
    MDS Supporter
    Jun 8, 2013
    7,229
    Davidsonville
    AR15 is semi-auto, so this is probably what they mean. The age old conflation of semi-auto and full auto is how we get a scary black rifle ban. If Colt is contracting with governments, law enforcement, and military, they are probably selling both semi and full auto versions of their scary black rifles.
    ahh, that slipped right by me.
     

    woodline

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Jan 8, 2017
    1,947

    ken792

    Ultimate Member
    Sep 2, 2011
    4,489
    Fairfax, VA
    My curiosity of with whom their contracts are with reminds me of a comment I recently read, FOX or FB ? Comment: "The AR15 is not used by any army in the world." This had many likes and was in regards to a "no weapons of war" post. So I ask, is it true that no armys use the AR15? Name one for 100 internet point.

    It's not accurate to say that the AR-15 was never select fire. Until I believe the early 70s, Colt marked both commercial full autos and its military contract M16 variants as AR-15s. M16 was the military's name. As far as Colt was concerned, they were just cataloged as some variant of the AR-15. After that, Colt started calling them M16s.

    Colt didn't introduce a semi auto AR variant until 1963 with the SP-1.

    Colt 613
    zib2.jpg


    Govt contract M16A1
    Mkg%20Early%20Colt%20M16A1.jpg


    Commercial "M16A1" that isn't actually a military designated M16A1.
    926-M16A1-Merge.jpg
     

    Occam

    Not Even ONE Indictment
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 24, 2018
    20,380
    Montgomery County
    Halt or suspend? I thought it was suspend. There is a difference.

    Well, in hopes of avoiding sub-MOA semantic hair-splitting...

    No, not really. When the drill sgt yells "HALT!" it's not the same as "PERMANENTLY END!"

    To halt is to stop what you're doing. It doesn't connote the intention to never resume what you were doing after (the train finally passes, the weather improves, the inventory for the civilian market gets drawn down, whatever).

    If Colt had said, "We are now ENDING this product line," we'd be having a different conversation. The maddening thing is that the press is lumping this right there with Walmart and other things as if they are coming from the same thought process and circumstances.
     

    dist1646

    Ultimate Member
    May 1, 2012
    8,784
    Eldersburg
    For the Colt haters out there, just a note: my first SOTAR Armorer's class had me disassembling and re-assembling a new Colt AR bought in early 2012. Chad was pleased to find that it gauged out perfectly, and said that that was to be expected of Colt products. Additional care in construction details of course lead to higher price, along with correspondingly decreased problems in use.

    Maybe this is because the gauges are made to meet the specs that Colt established in the very beginning of their production?

    There is a reason the military has stuck with Colt since the beginning.

    Ever hear of a little company called FN? Colt has played this game before. They had military contracts and thought they had a virtual lock on them so, they didn't bother with civilian production. Along came FN and Colt lost their contract bid. Colt almost went completely under. They didn't learn a thing.
     

    Combloc

    Stop Negassing me!!!!!
    Nov 10, 2010
    7,243
    In a House
    I'm well aware Colt has stopped civilian production before. I'm also well aware that they are currently producing M4's for both US and foreign military contracts along with FN. I like and own FN products too. I find their M249 to be excellent and, while I have one of their AR-15's, I can't tell you how well it works because I've never shot it. I'm sure it would work just fine though. Generally, I will buy from any company who supplies complete firearms to government entities because I know without question it was built to a standard greater than I am ever going to ask of it.

    I picked up another new in the box Colt M4 just today. My advice is to get them while you can because you just might make a good profit on them later.
     

    omegared24

    Ultimate Member
    Dec 23, 2011
    4,747
    Ijamsville, MD
    Maybe this is because the gauges are made to meet the specs that Colt established in the very beginning of their production?

    His point (to Chad's point) is that Colt is consistent in QC. Very few companies are consistent with complete rifles and/or parts. But that wasn't your point. Using your logic, no other manufacturer would ever gauge "properly". They'd have different base standards and most likely advertise it.

    Even good companies like SOLGW have stated that Colt puts out a good product. They are the standard that others are measured by.

    I'll never get the combative mentality toward Colt. They put out a good product in a mediocre market.
     

    TheOriginalMexicanBob

    Ultimate Member
    Jul 2, 2017
    32,804
    Sun City West, AZ
    Colt may not have an exclusive on the AR-15 design anymore...the patents ran out a long time ago. What Colt (and FN) have which the other makers don't is the TDP...technical data package. That includes not just the technical aspects of manufacturing the guns to MilSpec but all required inspections and upgrades in those specs. A Colt or FN rifle will be built to the latest military specifications of all parts. The clone makers simply cannot make that claim since they don't do the expensive tests required by MilSpec and they buy parts from who knows what sources which Colt and FN have to specify to the government.

    I'm not saying clone makers make bad guns by any means...some may well be better. The consumer just doesn't know and there's no way of finding out. Colt and FN build to a specific standard...the others may or may not.

    Colt has landed a number of contracts to foreign governments and it will take up their rifle production capacity for some time. Colt is simply taking care of those customers they've signed contracts with. Colt has a 110 day inventory of rifles...no sense in building more and adding to that backlog. When the market makes it worthwhile to start AR production again I think there's little doubt they'll take advantage of it. Colt is a business...the company has made mistakes in the past under different corporate ownership and philosophies...the future will tell whether Colt managers made a smart decision or a bad one.
     

    calicojack

    American Sporting Rifle
    MDS Supporter
    May 29, 2018
    5,384
    Cuba on the Chesapeake
    Well, in hopes of avoiding sub-MOA semantic hair-splitting...

    No, not really. When the drill sgt yells "HALT!" it's not the same as "PERMANENTLY END!"

    I am just saying there is a difference between "halt production never to produce again" and "suspend with the intention of resuming production in the future".
     

    Pinecone

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 4, 2013
    28,175
    BTW, Colt does not make all the parts for its rifles.

    I meet a guy a few years ago at a track day. He had a manufacturing company that made parts for phones. At one point. He had almost completed switched over to being a subcontractor for Colt making AR-15/M4 parts.

    BTW, he was tracking a Ferrari F430 Scudaria (list price $281,000, but none sold that low). And his wife was tracking his old car, an F430 Competitione.
     

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