NJ Resident Buying C&R Bolt Action Rifles in Maryland

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  • capt14k

    Active Member
    Jul 27, 2015
    221
    I tried weeding through the laws, but there seems to be a lot of changes in Maryland and a lot of laws. I am hoping fellow collectors can help me out.

    I have an option of picking up multiple C&R Rifles in Maryland at a gunshow. Seller is not an FFL01. I am an unlicensed NJ Resident. My original thought was to get my NJ FFL01 to take a ride with me. As an FFL01 he could take possession of them and then transfer them to me in NJ.

    Then I started thinking maybe it would be easier to just get a Maryland FFL01 at the show to transfer the rifles to me directly. So I started looking into Maryland Laws and found regulated firearms, adjacent states, and DC all of which are foreign to me. So I figured best to ask the guys who would know best.

    Everything I am looking to pick up is a centerfire rifle, all are bolt action, and all are over 50 years old. Any help would be appreciated.
     

    iH8DemLibz

    When All Else Fails.
    Apr 1, 2013
    25,396
    Libtardistan
    Apply for a C&R license.

    Outside of that, you'll need an 01 from either MD or NJ involved.

    If you buy from a MD 01, he'll have to send the rifles to a NJ 01, who would then transfer them to you in NJ.


    PS: You have a mighty understanding 01 if he's willing to make road trips with you.
     

    lazarus

    Ultimate Member
    Jun 23, 2015
    13,680
    Apply for a C&R license.

    Outside of that, you'll need an 01 from either MD or NJ involved.

    If you buy from a MD 01, he'll have to send the rifles to a NJ 01, who would then transfer them to you in NJ.


    PS: You have a mighty understanding 01 if he's willing to make road trips with you.

    Hmm? Because of New Jersey law? Or Maryland law? It is a long gun so under federal law so long as AN FFL01 somewhere transfers it to him he is fine. If it is at a gun show they should be able to walk over to any FFL01 and have them do the transfer (because it is interstate).

    It shouldn’t need to go back to New Jersey to be transfered by and FFL01 there.

    Only if it was a handgun would it need to go to an FFL01 in a New Jersey.

    An FFL03 C&R license (if you have one) would eliminate all of that and you could take posession in Maryland directly from the seller as you are a NJ resident so long as the firearms were over 50 years old and weren’t NFA items.
     

    iH8DemLibz

    When All Else Fails.
    Apr 1, 2013
    25,396
    Libtardistan
    Hmm? Because of New Jersey law? Or Maryland law? It is a long gun so under federal law so long as AN FFL01 somewhere transfers it to him he is fine. If it is at a gun show they should be able to walk over to any FFL01 and have them do the transfer (because it is interstate).

    It shouldn’t need to go back to New Jersey to be transfered by and FFL01 there.

    Only if it was a handgun would it need to go to an FFL01 in a New Jersey.

    An FFL03 C&R license (if you have one) would eliminate all of that and you could take posession in Maryland directly from the seller as you are a NJ resident so long as the firearms were over 50 years old and weren’t NFA items.

    I stand corrected. Brain fart. I've purchased long guns from 01s out of state, PA, and drove home with them.

    The way I read his post, NJ wouldn't allow him to buy guns in MD and drive back to NJ with them.

    Maybe the OP will return and comment.
     

    94hokie

    Active Member
    Mar 29, 2015
    832
    Severna Park, MD
    Hmm? Because of New Jersey law? Or Maryland law? It is a long gun so under federal law so long as AN FFL01 somewhere transfers it to him he is fine. If it is at a gun show they should be able to walk over to any FFL01 and have them do the transfer (because it is interstate).

    It shouldn’t need to go back to New Jersey to be transfered by and FFL01 there.

    Only if it was a handgun would it need to go to an FFL01 in a New Jersey.

    An FFL03 C&R license (if you have one) would eliminate all of that and you could take posession in Maryland directly from the seller as you are a NJ resident so long as the firearms were over 50 years old and weren’t NFA items.

    Maryland law. That stupid only selling to adjacent states law that is trying to be changed in the general assembly this term.
     

    Biggfoot44

    Ultimate Member
    Aug 2, 2009
    32,884
    It's a Maryland thing . Md still has on the books rifles and shotguns may be purchases by residents of * adjoining * states .

    Under Federal law , such purchases may be made in any state ( if legal in the state physically located , AND buyer's state .) That why we can make far flung FFL purchases, but only Va, WV, Pa, and DE residents can do so here.

    There is a Bill currently to change this , to bring Md into complience with Federal law .
     

    capt14k

    Active Member
    Jul 27, 2015
    221
    It is perfectly legal for me to purchase longuns that are NJ Legal in another state as long as they are transferred by a FFL01. Anytime I buy a rifle from a PA resident we meet at a PA FFL and they facilitate the transfer for $20 which includes PICS check.

    So since these aren't regulated I don't have to be an adjoining state resident under Maryland law or pay an extra fee is that correct?

    There is no limit on the number of C&R longguns that can be purchased at one time in Maryland?

    Does anyone have an idea of what the going rate is to transfer a longgun? Is there volume discount? Say 8 of them?

    Lastly does anyone have a recommendation of a FFL01 who will be at the Frederick County Fairgrounds Show Sunday April 8th?

    To address the FFL03 I don't have one because NJ does not recognize them. I still couldn't legally have any C&R Firearm longgun or handgun shipped direct to me. I couldn't use it to buy C&R handgun FTF in NJ, still need NJ PTP. Longguns we can buy FTF without a FFL and just our FIPD that everyone has to have to purchase longguns in NJ. There is no record of the sale. They are trying to change that. With a FFL03 I could go to Maryland and pick up the longguns and bring them back legally. Handguns no one knows for sure. Lastly NJ treats a FFL03 the same as a FFL01 and you are open to surprise NJSP inspections. Doesn't happen often but they are allowed to by law. If bill in NJ regarding background checks becomes law I probably will get a FFL03 and also get the hell out.
     

    capt14k

    Active Member
    Jul 27, 2015
    221
    As I was typing my reply I see there are replies about the adjacent state sales law. Does that apply to C&R longguns?
     

    Abulg1972

    Ultimate Member
    I tried weeding through the laws, but there seems to be a lot of changes in Maryland and a lot of laws. I am hoping fellow collectors can help me out.

    I have an option of picking up multiple C&R Rifles in Maryland at a gunshow. Seller is not an FFL01. I am an unlicensed NJ Resident. My original thought was to get my NJ FFL01 to take a ride with me. As an FFL01 he could take possession of them and then transfer them to me in NJ.

    Then I started thinking maybe it would be easier to just get a Maryland FFL01 at the show to transfer the rifles to me directly. So I started looking into Maryland Laws and found regulated firearms, adjacent states, and DC all of which are foreign to me. So I figured best to ask the guys who would know best.

    Everything I am looking to pick up is a centerfire rifle, all are bolt action, and all are over 50 years old. Any help would be appreciated.

    Maryland law contains almost nothing regarding transfers of long guns that are not regulated firearms. The only thing you'll find is a provision that allows a Maryland resident to purchase a long gun from a dealer in an adjacent state, and for a resident of an adjacent state to purchase a firearm from a Maryland dealer.

    Most dealers, at least that I have talked to, will not do a transfer involving a resident of another state who does not hold an FFL. I doubt that you will find a Maryland 01 who will process a transfer from a Maryland resident to you, a NJ resident. They will most likely want to ship the rifle to a NJ 01 FFL and let you deal with him. You could bring your NJ 01 FFL with you - that would be the best option.
     

    capt14k

    Active Member
    Jul 27, 2015
    221
    Maryland law contains almost nothing regarding transfers of long guns that are not regulated firearms. The only thing you'll find is a provision that allows a Maryland resident to purchase a long gun from a dealer in an adjacent state, and for a resident of an adjacent state to purchase a firearm from a Maryland dealer.

    Most dealers, at least that I have talked to, will not do a transfer involving a resident of another state who does not hold an FFL. I doubt that you will find a Maryland 01 who will process a transfer from a Maryland resident to you, a NJ resident. They will most likely want to ship the rifle to a NJ 01 FFL and let you deal with him. You could bring your NJ 01 FFL with you - that would be the best option.
    Unfortunately that is what I thought the answer was after seeing the adjacent state thing. Screwed by 10 miles of Delaware. The person I am getting the Rifles from normally would ship to my FFL01, but some of them are irreplaceable and I didn't want to risk shipping if I didn't have to. My FFL01 said he would take the ride a month ago but now isn't committing to the 8th. We are very friendly and I have spent a lot in transfer fees with him. Even on antiques since they must ship to a FFL01 in NJ. I offered him his fees plus an all you can eat Maryland Crab dinner. Hopefully he does it.

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    Abulg1972

    Ultimate Member
    NJ Resident Buying C&R Bolt Action Rifles in Maryland

    Unfortunately that is what I thought the answer was after seeing the adjacent state thing. Screwed by 10 miles of Delaware. The person I am getting the Rifles from normally would ship to my FFL01, but some of them are irreplaceable and I didn't want to risk shipping if I didn't have to. My FFL01 said he would take the ride a month ago but now isn't committing to the 8th. We are very friendly and I have spent a lot in transfer fees with him. Even on antiques since they must ship to a FFL01 in NJ. I offered him his fees plus an all you can eat Maryland Crab dinner. Hopefully he does it.

    Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk



    When it comes to non-regulated Long guns, Maryland pretty much says “do whatever Federal Law says to do.” I don’t interpret the adjacent state law as being restrictive, but as being permissive. In other words, I don’t interpret it as saying that a resident of a non-adjacent state cannot buy a long gun in MD from a MD 01. I interpret it as saying what we already know - that a resident of PA can buy a gun in MD from a MD 01. It’s a dumb law that really doesn’t do anything except create confusion and anxiety.

    I don’t think that law is the reason an 01 won’t do a transfer to a non-resident. Rather, I think it’s just a standard practice among 01s to not mess with transactions involving unlicensed residents of other states. I was in Texas recently and tried to gift a long gun to my dad, and the TX 01 wouldn’t do it because I am from MD.
     

    capt14k

    Active Member
    Jul 27, 2015
    221
    When it comes to non-regulated Long guns, Maryland pretty much says “do whatever Federal Law says to do.” I don’t interpret the adjacent state law as being restrictive, but as being permissive. In other words, I don’t interpret it as saying that a resident of a non-adjacent state cannot buy a long gun in MD from a MD 01. I interpret as saying what we already know - that a resident of PA can buy a gun in MD from a MD 01. It’s a dumb law that really doesn’t do anything except create confusion and anxiety.

    I don’t think that law is the reason an 01 won’t do a transfer to a non-resident. Rather, I think it’s just a standard practice among 01s to not mess with transactions involving unlicensed residents of other states. I was in Texas recently and tried to gift a long gun to my dad, and the TX 01 wouldn’t do it because I am from MD.
    I never had a problem in PA buying from FFL01 or having them do transfer between me and PA resident. I usually use Clayton's for transfers.

    Only time I had an issue was at the Oaks show 3 PA dealers wouldn't transfer a Hungarian M44 between me and seller, because they insisted we couldn't have a bayonet or bayonet lug in NJ on any firearm. It was a guy's private rifle he had for sale at the dealers table he worked for. Finally guy from Gettysburg did it because he knew NJ law. Ran PICS on laptop done in 5 minutes charged $12.

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    capt14k

    Active Member
    Jul 27, 2015
    221
    I think those in Free States are just afraid of the Commie States coming after them. In reality NJ or MD or any of the others can't do a thing if dealer follows Federal law.

    Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk
     

    Abulg1972

    Ultimate Member
    I never had a problem in PA buying from FFL01 or having them do transfer between me and PA resident. I usually use Clayton's for transfers.

    Only time I had an issue was at the Oaks show 3 PA dealers wouldn't transfer a Hungarian M44 between me and seller, because they insisted we couldn't have a bayonet or bayonet lug in NJ on any firearm. It was a guy's private rifle he had for sale at the dealers table he worked for. Finally guy from Gettysburg did it because he knew NJ law. Ran PICS on laptop done in 5 minutes charged $12.

    Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

    That's because your PA 01 likely feels comfortable that he/she knows what NJ law requires. Maybe PA has a similar "adjacent state law".

    There's no reason for an 01 in one state to refuse to do a transfer with a non-resident unless he/she is worried that he will trip over some legal requirement in the buyer's state of which he/she is ignorant. That's a legitimate concern. I wouldn't do it if I were an 01.
     

    capt14k

    Active Member
    Jul 27, 2015
    221
    That's because your PA 01 likely feels comfortable that he/she knows what NJ law requires. Maybe PA has a similar "adjacent state law".

    There's no reason for an 01 in one state to refuse to do a transfer with a non-resident unless he/she is worried that he will trip over some legal requirement in the buyer's state of which he/she is ignorant. That's a legitimate concern. I wouldn't do it if I were an 01.
    There is no adjacent law in PA or NJ. Actually I never heard of it til I started researching Maryland law, but you may have a point about them feeling more comfortable. Then again is there any state that a bolt action Milsurp isn't legal?

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    Abulg1972

    Ultimate Member
    There is no adjacent law in PA or NJ. Actually I never heard of it til I started researching Maryland law, but you may have a point about them feeling more comfortable. Then again is there any state that a bolt action Milsurp isn't legal?

    Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

    Arguably, it is illegal to ship a Swiss Model 1889 into Maryland, at least if the magazine is attached. Maryland's detachable magazine law prohibits the sale or transfer in or from Maryland of a detachable magazine that holds more than 10 rounds. You can detach the magazine on a Swiss M1889, although it was not designed that way to be "detachable" but to allow for cleaning.
     

    BeoBill

    Crank in the Third Row
    MDS Supporter
    Oct 3, 2013
    27,064
    南馬里蘭州鮑伊
    It is perfectly legal for me to purchase longuns that are NJ Legal in another state as long as they are transferred by a FFL01. Anytime I buy a rifle from a PA resident we meet at a PA FFL and they facilitate the transfer for $20 which includes PICS check.

    So since these aren't regulated I don't have to be an adjoining state resident under Maryland law or pay an extra fee is that correct?

    There is no limit on the number of C&R longguns that can be purchased at one time in Maryland?

    Does anyone have an idea of what the going rate is to transfer a longgun? Is there volume discount? Say 8 of them?

    Lastly does anyone have a recommendation of a FFL01 who will be at the Frederick County Fairgrounds Show Sunday April 8th?

    To address the FFL03 I don't have one because NJ does not recognize them. I still couldn't legally have any C&R Firearm longgun or handgun shipped direct to me. I couldn't use it to buy C&R handgun FTF in NJ, still need NJ PTP. Longguns we can buy FTF without a FFL and just our FIPD that everyone has to have to purchase longguns in NJ. There is no record of the sale. They are trying to change that. With a FFL03 I could go to Maryland and pick up the longguns and bring them back legally. Handguns no one knows for sure. Lastly NJ treats a FFL03 the same as a FFL01 and you are open to surprise NJSP inspections. Doesn't happen often but they are allowed to by law. If bill in NJ regarding background checks becomes law I probably will get a FFL03 and also get the hell out.

    There's your answer. I have a friend in Paramus who has a second residence in upstate NY who gets screwed even trying to buy ammunition.

    I believe that since you are an NJ resident, you are even more restricted than we are here.

    C&R handgun buy? Forget it, never happen.

    C&R rifle buy? If it's a knotty enough question that it's very, very dark grey, I'd leave it alone and check with a competent lawyer beforehand. Or chance the NJSP paying you a visit some day, since you'll be buying ammunition for it in NJ eventually...
     

    BeoBill

    Crank in the Third Row
    MDS Supporter
    Oct 3, 2013
    27,064
    南馬里蘭州鮑伊
    I think those in Free States are just afraid of the Commie States coming after them. In reality NJ or MD or any of the others can't do a thing if dealer follows Federal law.

    Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

    There is no adjacent law in PA or NJ. Actually I never heard of it til I started researching Maryland law, but you may have a point about them feeling more comfortable. Then again is there any state that a bolt action Milsurp isn't legal?

    Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

    I's not so much a question of which state you're buying in as much as a question of which state your new acquisition will end up residing in with you. That would be NJ, and you're ultimately subject to their laws, even if you went to Pakistan to buy a Khyber knockoff 1911.
     

    capt14k

    Active Member
    Jul 27, 2015
    221
    There's your answer. I have a friend in Paramus who has a second residence in upstate NY who gets screwed even trying to buy ammunition.

    I believe that since you are an NJ resident, you are even more restricted than we are here.

    C&R handgun buy? Forget it, never happen.

    C&R rifle buy? If it's a knotty enough question that it's very, very dark grey, I'd leave it alone and check with a competent lawyer beforehand. Or chance the NJSP paying you a visit some day, since you'll be buying ammunition for it in NJ eventually...
    C&R rifle or NJ legal AR variant is perfectly legal for me to buy in any state if a FFL01 in that state transfers it to me. I can then bring it back to NJ unloaded.

    Problem seems to be Maryland adjacent state law. Can anyone link the most recent wording of the law. I read somewhere that it only applied to regulated rifles. However I don't know definition of regulated.

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    Biggfoot44

    Ultimate Member
    Aug 2, 2009
    32,884
    5-204 (c) says simply " rifle or shotgun" .

    " Regulated Rifle " no longer exists in Md law . In 2013 , previously Regulated Rifles ( plus some more ) became banned . Currently , all rifles are either Banned, or cash & carry , with no inbetween.

    Added - As of today , neither of the Companion Bills to change this has had a Vote in Committee.
     

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