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Old May 19th, 2017, 03:34 PM #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deesly1 View Post
So Correct me if I am wrong. I Lower purchased prior to 10/1/2013 was considered a firearm, due to the 4473 and the 77R you filed out. So all rules/laws before 10/1/2013 apply to that firearm! The proof is the 77R. There may be a problem with the long guns purchase before 10/1/2013 because the state never registered a 77R on those particular firearms. IMO
Nobody is denying that it is a firearm. It is very clearly a firearm. The issue with a stripped lower is what type of firearm does it represent. The law now restricts certain named firearms. There is an exemption if you owned/purchased those named firearms before the cutoff date. You may be correct that it is exempt, but a more strict interpretation would require that the stripped lower actually be turned into in one of the named firearm configurations. There is no clear answer, understand the differences and accept what ever risk you would like.
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Old May 19th, 2017, 03:52 PM #22
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Originally Posted by outrider58 View Post
OP, the word 'after' has the opposite meaning of the word 'before'.
DON'T YOU TRY TO SHOW HOW SMART YOUR ARE!!!!!
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Old May 19th, 2017, 04:05 PM #23
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There I go again, lol!

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Old May 20th, 2017, 09:05 AM #24
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If you go back on look at threads before Oct 1, 2013, many people were assembling their lowers with a pre-ban upper, and photographing them to make sure they were OK after the ban.

And, as I mentioned, the last time I know of people contacting MSP about this, they got conflicting answers.

Real answer, it was assembled in pre-ban configuration before the ban. Prove it was not.
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Old May 20th, 2017, 01:26 PM #25
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Think I remember AG Doug Gansler said it was legal to build non h-bar on preban lower. It was at a meeting with FFL's post FSA. Not sure which thread it's in
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Old May 20th, 2017, 06:55 PM #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcutonilli View Post
What is unclear is whether stripped lowers bought before the cutoff date can be assembled into a banned configuration. It becomes a matter of interpretation and how much risk you are willing to accept.


Seriously people - cite your resources!

http://mdsp.maryland.gov/Document%20...ong%20Guns.pdf

It's on the first page.
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Old May 20th, 2017, 08:30 PM #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dtmeyers View Post
Seriously people - cite your resources!

http://mdsp.maryland.gov/Document%20...ong%20Guns.pdf

It's on the first page.


Thank you!
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Old May 21st, 2017, 12:35 AM #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dtmeyers View Post
Seriously people - cite your resources!

http://mdsp.maryland.gov/Document%20...ong%20Guns.pdf

It's on the first page.
My source is the law itself.

The exemption that is relevant is Maryland Criminal Law Ann 4-303(b)(3) A person who lawfully possessed, has a purchase order for, or completed an application to purchase an assault long gun or a copycat weapon before October 1, 2013, may: (i) possess and transport the assault long gun or copycat weapon;

The advisory you cite specifically states that a '"stripped" lower receiver is not, at that point, an assault pistol, an assault long gun or a copycat weapon.' Since you have not possessed the assault long gun or copycat weapon prior to Oct 1, 2013, the exemption is not relevant and you may not even possess the assault long gun or copycat weapon.

The MSP cannot absolve you of the law and could potentially change its mind about the legality of the situation. i don't care which option you choose. Simply understand that there is some risk with assembling a pre ban stripped lower into a banned configuration.
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Old May 21st, 2017, 07:16 AM #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dtmeyers View Post
Seriously people - cite your resources!

http://mdsp.maryland.gov/Document%20...ong%20Guns.pdf

It's on the first page.
That solves it.

I had not seen that before.
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Old May 21st, 2017, 05:50 PM #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcutonilli View Post
My source is the law itself.

The exemption that is relevant is Maryland Criminal Law Ann 4-303(b)(3) A person who lawfully possessed, has a purchase order for, or completed an application to purchase an assault long gun or a copycat weapon before October 1, 2013, may: (i) possess and transport the assault long gun or copycat weapon;

The advisory you cite specifically states that a '"stripped" lower receiver is not, at that point, an assault pistol, an assault long gun or a copycat weapon.' Since you have not possessed the assault long gun or copycat weapon prior to Oct 1, 2013, the exemption is not relevant and you may not even possess the assault long gun or copycat weapon.

The MSP cannot absolve you of the law and could potentially change its mind about the legality of the situation. i don't care which option you choose. Simply understand that there is some risk with assembling a pre ban stripped lower into a banned configuration.
However MD considers the lower to be "the gun", therefore the MSP advisory makes perfect sense. The numbnuts who wrote the law had no concept of this and our side had no intention of spelling it out for them.
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Old May 21st, 2017, 08:31 PM #31
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Originally Posted by daggo66 View Post
However MD considers the lower to be "the gun", therefore the MSP advisory makes perfect sense. The numbnuts who wrote the law had no concept of this and our side had no intention of spelling it out for them.
It is not just MD, the ATF considers the lower the firearm.

In order to possess a banned rifle today, you need to have possessed it before Oct 1 2013. The problem is that a stripped lower is not considered a banned rifle so you cannot technically have possess a banned rifle prior to Oct 1, 2013 (unless it was previously put into that configuration).

If the law was simply about buying and selling, I would agree with you. The problem is that it includes possession, which is why you cannot buy a lower today and turn it into one of the banned rifles.

Maybe they realize the difficulty in proving that the lower was turned into a banned rifle before Oct 1, 2013.

The thing that still concerns me is that they still have an out when they say you still need to comply with other State laws. This could technically still mean that the conversion/assembly had to take place prior to Oct 1, 2013 to be legal.
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Old May 22nd, 2017, 04:09 AM #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcutonilli View Post
It is not just MD, the ATF considers the lower the firearm.

In order to possess a banned rifle today, you need to have possessed it before Oct 1 2013. The problem is that a stripped lower is not considered a banned rifle so you cannot technically have possess a banned rifle prior to Oct 1, 2013 (unless it was previously put into that configuration).

If the law was simply about buying and selling, I would agree with you. The problem is that it includes possession, which is why you cannot buy a lower today and turn it into one of the banned rifles.

Maybe they realize the difficulty in proving that the lower was turned into a banned rifle before Oct 1, 2013.


The thing that still concerns me is that they still have an out when they say you still need to comply with other State laws. This could technically still mean that the conversion/assembly had to take place prior to Oct 1, 2013 to be legal.
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Old May 22nd, 2017, 04:59 AM #33
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Building on a preban (10/2013) ar-15 lower

Quote:
Originally Posted by outrider58 View Post
OP, the word 'after' has the opposite meaning of the word 'before'.
As in, what is now was (GRIN)...
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Old May 22nd, 2017, 06:14 AM #34
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Originally Posted by outrider58 View Post
OP, the word 'after' has the opposite meaning of the word 'before'.
This made me laugh on an otherwise shitty Monday morning.
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Old May 22nd, 2017, 06:19 AM #35
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This made me laugh on an otherwise shitty Monday morning.
Happy to help.

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