Button Instead Of Trigger

hermyjoe · Dec 19, 2018

pbharvey said:
I would like an RPG mounted on my bumper and wired to the horn of my truck.
Today would have been an especially fantastic day for that.

only if it can be reloaded for those deserving the extra shot....lol

Pinecone · Dec 19, 2018

Tungsten said:
That is definitely a possibility and on the right track, but it still looks like a lever to me and I'm not sure the placement is ideal. My initial thought was an actual button like on a F-16 yoke.

That does not fire the gun.

There is a trigger on the front of the grip that fires the gun.

Missiles are fired, and bombs dropped, but a button on the top.

Red arrow is gun trigger. Yellow arrow is bomb and missile.

Tungsten · Dec 19, 2018

Pinecone said:
That does not fire the gun.

There is a trigger on the front of the grip that fires the gun.

Missiles are fired, and bombs dropped, but a button on the top.

Red arrow is gun trigger. Yellow arrow is bomb and missile.

Yup. But I'm only looking at placement not actually same function. I was thinking a button with a downward push as opposed to a trigger with a backwards pull. Possibly using the thumb instead of the first finger for pressing it.

Batt816 · Dec 19, 2018

pbharvey said:
I would like an RPG mounted on my bumper and wired to the horn of my truck.
Today would have been an especially fantastic day for that.

LIKE!

Blacksmith101 · Dec 19, 2018

Tungsten said:
Yup. But I'm only looking at placement not actually same function. I was thinking a button with a downward push as opposed to a trigger with a backwards pull. Possibly using the thumb instead of the first finger for pressing it.

M6 aircrew survival gun (squeeze lever):
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M6_Aircrew_Survival_Weapon

M2 "Ma Duce" .50 caliber Machine Gun (paddle pushed by thumb):
See Figure 071-022-0001-3.
https://www.armystudyguide.com/content/SMCT_CTT_Tasks/Skill_Level_1/0710220001-sl1-maintain-a.shtml

Original triggers were a right angle lever that directly actuated the the sear to release the tumbler attached to the cock.

Trigger
https://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/920/1/TR-YORK-TP?PageSize=100

Video of trigger pushing up the sear to release the action:
http://www.lewis-clark.org/media/qtmovies/inside.webm

Rack&Roll · Dec 19, 2018

K31 said:
I saw a article about a muzzleloader that had electric ignition. It was a bench rest rifle. I think they wanted to isolate it from all body movement that might effect accuracy.

My rifle whispers this to me when it thinks no one else is listening...

K31 · Dec 19, 2018

Rack&Roll said:
My rifle whispers this to me when it thinks no one else is listening...

Careful, someone will single you out for legalized SWATing.

Sirex · Dec 19, 2018

My buddy built a breach loading, electronic button activated 20mm cannon. If that counts.

Dave · Dec 19, 2018

pop-gunner said:
I own a Winchester Thumbtrigger.
Is something like that what you had in mind?

Just wanted a video about these. very simple and cool design.

outrider58 · Dec 19, 2018

Even a phased plasma rifles in the 40 watt range has a trigger. Buttons were proven to be too unreliable and downright dangerous, especially during cleaning.

engineerbrian · Dec 19, 2018

Ma Deuce has a button

delaware_export · Dec 19, 2018

iirc, it was a remington ml, which was formed on the basis of a m700, with an electronic ignition.

*** edit: quick google: it was the remington etronix, not a ml. some funky cartridges??? seems to have died a while ago.

battery in the grip, and trigger just makes the connection. maybe there was even a key like slot to turn it on.

there may have been others.

K31 said:
I saw a article about a muzzleloader that had electric ignition. It was a bench rest rifle. I think they wanted to isolate it from all body movement that might effect accuracy.

Threeband · Dec 19, 2018

You could try a slipgun.

It's a single action revolver with the trigger and sear removed completely, and ,usually had the hammer spur lowered.

You cock it by swiping the hammer back, and fire it by allowing the hammer to slip from under the web of your thumb. No trigger, no trigger finger.

Elmer Keith said it was very fast, but that those who specialized in shooting slipguns were usually not very good with regular sixguns. It was a niche thing.

DaemonAssassin · Dec 20, 2018

The problem with a button, especially the solenoid type found on paintball markers, is that they require the use of an electrical system. Electrical systems require a battery and wires, and that adds weight. No matter what, if you are going to use a button as a trigger and still utilize common ammo, you will still have to devise a way to go from electrical signal to a mechanical motion for the hammer to strike the primer. The weight of the electrical components and battery, not to mention reliability will cause issues.

Believe me, I looked at this possibility a while back, to mod a AR-15, but found that the added weight wasn't worth it.

Tungsten · Dec 20, 2018

DaemonAssassin said:
The problem with a button, especially the solenoid type found on paintball markers, is that they require the use of an electrical system. Electrical systems require a battery and wires, and that adds weight. No matter what, if you are going to use a button as a trigger and still utilize common ammo, you will still have to devise a way to go from electrical signal to a mechanical motion for the hammer to strike the primer. The weight of the electrical components and battery, not to mention reliability will cause issues.

Believe me, I looked at this possibility a while back, to mod a AR-15, but found that the added weight wasn't worth it.

I am thinking of a mechanical button, not electrical. I see no reason why it would add any weight. Also being a smaller form factor, you could place it anywhere on the grip, actuated by any finger.

DaemonAssassin · Dec 20, 2018

Tungsten said:
I am thinking of a mechanical button, not electrical. I see no reason why it would add any weight. Also being a smaller form factor, you could place it anywhere on the grip, actuated by any finger.

Mechanical would still need a way to increase that small movement into enough movement to trip the disconnector and allow the hammer to be released. Also looking at how to get it to reset consistently creates more problems. You have limited mechanical energy from a button press, no matter what you try to do with the design. It comes down to simple physics.

Threeband · Dec 20, 2018

No hammer or firing pin in the shotgun I mentioned previously.

Blacksmith101 · Dec 21, 2018

DaemonAssassin said:
Mechanical would still need a way to increase that small movement into enough movement to trip the disconnector and allow the hammer to be released. Also looking at how to get it to reset consistently creates more problems. You have limited mechanical energy from a button press, no matter what you try to do with the design. It comes down to simple physics.

What about a double set trigger with a button release for the trigger when set?

DaemonAssassin · Dec 21, 2018

Blacksmith101 said:
What about a double set trigger with a button release for the trigger when set?

It still comes down to mechanical energy. If it is stored in springs, you will have very little movement to cause it to trip and the firearm to discharge. Essentially it will be like a new Sig P320 that goes off when smacked. Extremely limited engagement causes severe safety issues. The lack of mechanical energy from pressing a button also will cause issues in allowing the reliable function of the firing mechanism.

The easiest way to demonstrate this is a solenoid on the trigger of a paintball marker, even though the system requires a electrical system to ensure function. The amount of movement with the solenoid is so minute that it would be impossible to create a safely functioning firearm with that little movement to fire it. But when you look at the other side of it with autococker paintball markers, they do not use an electrical system, nor do they utilize the solenoid system to discharge the marker. They use a standard trigger, with some modifications that we won't get into here so we don't muddy the waters, but by and large autocockers operate the same way a normal firearm fires. Mechanical energy causes the firing system to operate.

The physics of using a button to discharge a firearm or even a paintball marker, require the use of an electrical system of some sort, in order to ensure reliable function and safety. That is the inescapable truth.

Pinecone · Dec 21, 2018

Tungsten said:
Yup. But I'm only looking at placement not actually same function. I was thinking a button with a downward push as opposed to a trigger with a backwards pull. Possibly using the thumb instead of the first finger for pressing it.

Harder to do when you are holding the firearm. With an aircraft stick, you are not holding it up.

Button Instead Of Trigger

The #1 community for Gun Owners of the Northeast

Member Benefits:

Active Member

Ultimate Member

Attachments

Ultimate Member

Ultimate Member

Grumpy Old Man

R.I.P

"Part of that Ultra MAGA Crowd"

Powered by natural gas

Ultimate Member

Eats Bacon Raw

JMB fan club

Ultimate Member

The M1 Does My Talking

Why should we Free BSD?

Ultimate Member

Why should we Free BSD?

The M1 Does My Talking

Grumpy Old Man

Why should we Free BSD?

Ultimate Member

Users who are viewing this thread

Log in

Forum statistics