Forum for Kerosene Lantern Collectors / Users ?

While I was digging into my question from the other thread , after a while I thought I'd look for a Forum dealing with Kero Lanterns , and join up , and ask driveby newbie questions . But I can't find one ?

I thought the interwebs had communities for absolutely everything , but I'm drawing a blank with initial search . Occasional threads in various survialist, prepper , and homesteading/ off grid Fora , but nada for a dedicated group . And merely the collecting aspects of vintage American Lanterns is large enough , I'd be shocked if there isn't and internet community .

Any sugguestions ?

You could start an internet forum that discusses the in and outs and nuances of various kerosene lanterns found throughout the lantern collecting world.

I've had kerosene lantern questions for years. Proper wick size? Where to buy wicks? Correct height settings for wicks? Is lamp oil the same as kerosene? Who makes quality, long lasting, lamps? Is American made better than overseas made? What should you look for in a quality lamp? And on and on and on.

Maybe this thread will catch fire. Lamp joke.

My better half has likely over 75 maybe more any thing from 4 inch tall, wall hanging types with deflector to 5 foot tall wood floor lamp

List of links:
https://www.lanternnet.com/links.htm

1. Whichever size fits your burner assy ( the doo hickey with knob that moves wick up and down ) .

In general a tradeoff of light output vs fuel consumption . ( Insert discussion of historical applications as forerunners of todays blinking battery powered warning lights, and large scale industrial purchases ).

Modern cheap Chineese lantern shaped objects can be kinda random . In my other thread my Swallow uses 3/8 in knockoff of origionals that used 1/2in . The current Wal-Mart (in store) $7 lantern uses 3/8 in knockoff of design that used 5/8in .

2. 100% cotton is what you want . Every serious internet seller , and a few independent old school hardware stores sell them . Other than OEM on a few really cheap Chineese lantern shaped objects , it all looks almost as if from same supplier, with a red stripe stitched down the center .

A package of two wicks is a cpl $ , or for serious users , 33 foot rolls are very affordable .

3. Much lower than most people would intuitively think .

The usually quoted figure is 1/16 inch above the metal part the wick actual comes out of ( not the higher curved piece closer to globe .

Turning higher will briefly put out more light , but quickly cover inside of globe with soot .

Sidenote - As a draught lantern warms up , the flame gets larger/ brighter . Start out with wick setting seemingly too low , wait 5min , then fine tune if necessary . A seemingly correct setting at cold start up will produce sooting .

Yellow flame good , orange flame bad .

3. Yes, No , Maybe, Sort of , Sometimes, and it depends

In technical terms ,flat wick kerosene lanterns & lamps are designed/ intended around a thin liquid of Flashpoint between 125 and 150 deg F . Much higher flashpoint will be harder to light , burn sootier, etc . Much lower flashpoints will put a risk of events involving Bad Things involving Fire - Runaways , or even KaBooms .

Part of the confusion comes from language . In British English , Kerosene is called Parrifin Oil . This is a much bigger problem than just collequisms , because there actually is such a thing as Parrifin Oil , but it is a totally different thing ( much thicker , higher flashpoint , usable with certain round wicks , not usable with most flat wick designs . )

Some "lamp oil " is kero based . Some "lamp oil" is parrifin based . Some is misleading/ confusing in consumer labeling . When in doubt , the W.T. Kirkman website has extensive listings by brand name, and product number of what is / isn't acceptable .

Beyond Flashpoint and viscosity , is matter of various additives " clog up the wick " . Refer back to " lamp oils " with various dyes and scents . ( As general sugguestions , dilute Citronella oil 50:50 with regular kerosene .)

And then folklore, tall tales, and the internet are full of tales of what can be used "in emergency" , because cheap or free access , SHTF , End of World .

Mineral Spirits , alcohol , namptha ( Coleman fuel) , various industrial solvents . You can find a number of accounts on the internet to the effect of " I do it all the time, it works for me " . Treat these with a grain of " hey, hold my beer and watch this ! " , as the internet also abounds with accounts of " and then the latern exploded/ burst into flames ".

On the other end of the spectrum , whole bunches of people really want to use olive oil , vegtable oil, and bio- whathaveyou . They want to badly enough to build/ modify lanterns/ lamps to be able to do so . With a stock Kerosene lantern , either won't work , or lots of problems .

"Might work " -Flaspoint & viscosity reasonably close . Could have issues or side effects from additives -

Jet A , JP-8

Surprisingly , #2 Diesel . Flashpoints in correct range , but longer carbon chains . Repeated accounts inform that current ULSD gives much less clogging than traditional diesel . Still engine specific additives, and low temerature gelling . But , I'll probably experiment with it eventually .

#4&5 - The last USA mass produced lanterns were in 1956 . Only one remaining Mfg in Western Hemisphere, specifically Germany . Unknown if additional for home market , but only one model exported .

Dietz moved from Syracuse NY to Hong Kong in 1956 . Corporate offices remain there , but production switched to Mainland in '80s iirc .

The good news is the Dietz branded has continued the circa 1956 designs, with metal thicknesses and overall quality far above generic china crap , and somewhat close to the past standards when USA mfg .

The W.T. Kirkman Co imports the entire Dietz product line , plus some exclusive variations . They have a premium line , where the base models have key USA mfg small parts added, their own spec globes, and refinished. They also scratch build some lanterns in California , but are $$ .

Since we brought up money , china crap is under $10 , Dietz , Freuerhand, Kirkman premium generally $20-50 , with lots in $20-35 . Yes , a $20somthing Dietz is huge step up from $10 China . Specific vintage and antique collectables vary widely depending upon rarity and condition . Certain models that were high production for industrial and gov't agencies can be rare in mints condition, as most origonals saw hard service back in the day .

That's one heck of a great write-up.

Thank you.

In the context of LEDs , or even pressurized ( aka "Coleman type" ) lanterns , flat wick tubular lanterns don't give much candlepower/ lumens . The better comparison is how much light they give , in comparison to darkness .

Dead flame lanterns ( commomly known generically as "railroad lanterns " ) primarily are meant to be seen as signals , and not to see with .

3/8in wicks could serve as signals , but also could be a personal light . You could use it to walk from your tent to the outhouse.

5/8in wicks would do fairly well to light a room . 3/4 and 7/8 would porportionally be brighter , or larger room/ work space . 7/8 is largest common size for handheld lanterna . 7/8in would have output in 12-14 cp range .

Think back to reasonably correct Western movies , at least for later part of old west era ( hot draft invented 1868 , cold draft 1880's ). Sometimes saloons or large spaces had hanging fixtures with multiple normal sized lamps . If a single large lamp , those would be 1 1/8 to 1 1 1/4in wick . Likewise street lights in pre electricty, pre natural gas " further locomotive headlamps pre electrity .

Not asked -

The lanterns with the taller, elongated globes do provide more light than those with shorter, more round globes . The taller ones provide more forced air circulation from the improved draft . But the short globes make for a more compact lantern , and are easier for people with big hands and fat fingers to clean the inside of the globe .

The * shape * of the top of the wick . The default answer is straight , and flat . Some people do various points and convex rounded in effort for bigger/ brighter flames . And essentially they don't provide any advantage .

What might help, probably won't hurt is to just barely clip the corners at 45deg . Not really change overall flame , but supposed to provide more even burn , without as much tendency to orange at the edges .

**************

Our area is blessed with semi- common availability of bulk clear 1-k ( aka K-1) kerosene . Typically from gas stations , but a few independent fuel oil dealers also deliver , albeit with 100 or 150gal minimum . With lantern fuel consumption measured in oz , this rounds off to nearly free light .

In other parts of the country , and Europe it is only found in small cans/ bottles as camping supplies, or gallons as a solvent . Conversely , in the developing world , kerosene is THE energy source . Despite eco weanies advocating solar power for impoverished African villages , worldwide , in regions that have advanced beyond strictly gathering sticks for firewood , but don't have a widespread reliable rural electrical grid , kerosene is the overwhelming source for lighting and cooking .

Synthetic kerosene , typically marketed for reduced odor indoor kerosene space heaters likewise can be used for lanterns indoors . More expensive than bulk from the gas station , but not prohibitive , and much cheaper than "lamp oil " by the pint or quart .

I have a Butterfly 350 CP pressurized lantern I brought back with me from a trip to Indonesia. I believe they are a knockoff from a German design. Mine had o-rings for the pump instead of leather cups. The Butterfly lanterns sold Stateside have the latter due to copyright issues.

I use 500CP mantles on them. Throws out a good amount of light. If you'd rather not spend a lot of time pumping them up, you can replace the pump with a cap containing a Schrader valve (like a tire). You can then use a regular tire or bicycle pump.

I bought on eBay an unusual valve design. The seller welded the valve to the pressure guage, so I can use either the hand pump or a tire pump.

One filling will keep it running more than 12 hours.

Yes , clone of the Petromax .

The genuine Petromax advertises their products as being multi-fuel . Even though a clone , multiple reports of the clones having fire/ explosion events with gasoline/ Coleman fuel . But probably well enough, and a great value for sticking with kerosene .

The Butterfly brand ( Malaysia ) product that recently cought my eye is their clone of the original Primus stove .

( The general interweb scuttlebutt places higher regard upon the Malaysian kero products , than the generic Chinese .)

For those really into Kerosene:

Kerosene Stoves
http://stpaulmercantile.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=73

Kerosene Refrigerators
https://www.amazon.com/DOMETIC-KEROSENE-FRIDGE-BISQUE-400B/dp/B0751833W1

These are a couple of sites I have discovered.

I have been using this guy for several years for kerosene heater wicks. Very good and quick. Especially good if you have an older or less common heater. Loads of information on his site for heater and lantern wicks.

http://www.milesstair.com/

Found this site for parts and information for my Coleman lanterns since local stores seem to be getting away from fueled lanterns.

http://www.oldcolemanparts.com/home.php

Will post more when I have time.

I have a question some of you might have an answer too. I have a lantern that is at least 40 years ols and has been creating a lot of soot at the top of the chimney. I replaced the wick with some wick material my father had ( he's been gone since2008 and he grew up in an era when they were used more frequently then now) but it still smokes. Do you think the lantern fuel has gone bad or the wick material I used was old and had gone bad? Any suggestions appreciated as I really don't want to just toss it out. We use it ocassionally when the lights go out.
Thanks!

Eliminate the variables easily and cheaply .

A pair of wicks under $5 . Sealed pint can of pure Kerosene is $5.79 at Wally World . Good cleaning , make sure no dust bunnies or dead insects inside the tubes blocking the air flow . Less than $10 investment .

And .... The most typical cause of soot , is wick turned up too high . It doesn't take very much wick . Start out with 1/16 in exposed , let warm up for 5min before further fine tuning .

Biggfoot44 said:

Eliminate the variables easily and cheaply .

A pair of wicks under $5 . Sealed pint can of pure Kerosene is $5.79 at Wally World . Good cleaning , make sure no dust bunnies or dead insects inside the tubes blocking the air flow . Less than $10 investment .

And .... The most typical cause of soot , is wick turned up too high . It doesn't take very much wick . Start out with 1/16 in exposed , let warm up for 5min before further fine tuning .

Click to expand...

Thanks. I'm pretty sure the wick is not too high. Guess I'll have to get more wicks and kerosene. So should I let it warm up a bit before replacing the chimney?

Buy a lantern that uses a mantle like a Coleman lantern does. Brighter whiter light with less odor and less fuel consumption. Worth the extra $$$. Used this type 40 years ago when I was living off the grid. I keep one as back up these days.

1/16 inch above the actual burner , not the crown . Translated - Just barely sticking above the actual mechanism that adjusts the wick , not the rounded part you see inside the globe . On some lanterns ( " Rising Crown style) the crown is part of the baseplate of the globe assy, and moves out of the way when you raise/ swing over the globe. On others the crown sits on top of the burner, and stays in place when you raise the globe .

Once lit , lower the globe . The globe must be down for the draft process to take place .

By the process of convection, additional fresh air is introduced to the flame . As it warms up , the air chamber heats up , and slightly pressurizes the fuel tank , also increasing the height of the flame .

( The fount aka fuel tank just looks like a plain ol fuel tank from the outside . It has an inner wall , creating an air chamber , seperate from the actual liquid storage area . This is also why you don"t overfill . Don't fill to the top ! If your lantern doesn't have a fill line indicated , then never fill above the base of the filler neck .)

I have and like the Britelyt lantern although I rarely burn with anything other than white gas type fuels.

got some railroad lanterns from my grand father
in a storage trailer, with everything else. Thanks
for the links, got some more reading to do..


-Rock

I started collecting railroad lanterns back around 1991 or 92. The railroad lanterns got me collecting barn and other lanterns. I had to stop buying the damn things because I was using money from my "gun fund" to support the habit. I have somewhere between 150 and 200 lanterns if you were to count railroad lanterns, switch lamps, and the battery operated railroad lanterns. I found them at yard sales, auctions and antique stores although I bought very few at antique stores because antique dealers overprice anything that is railroad.
My oldest lantern I have was made by a company called Steam Gauge and Lantern Company. It dates to 1860 to 1880. I don't have anything too rare or elaborate. No brass tops or two colored globes in my collection.
More to the point though, I can recommend a couple of books for anyone that collects lanterns. Lanterns That Lit Our World, Books One and Two written by Anthony Hobson. It covers all kinds of lanterns such as railroad, marine, fire, farm, mill lanterns, carriage, construction lanterns, etc. These books can probably be found in any library or book store. I have not looked, but I'm sure you could find them on line.
For the more serious railroad collector there is a two volume book (plus supplements), called The Illustrated Encyclopedia of Railroad Lighting by Richard C. Barrett. These are serious books and when I bought them they were $60 each.

You win Toolguy so far , but I'm fairly new this . My rarest so far is a Embury Little Air Pilot . My front burner desire for now is a streamlined hot blast .

While I also have interest in trains and railroads , hasn't yet merged into railroad lanterns per se .