Legality of Mag Extension

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  • rbird7282

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 6, 2012
    18,530
    Columbia
    Jon, I would be careful of zealous prosecution under "constructive possession" laws. People sure do get convicted and imprisoned for unassembled parts under certain conditions. The presence of a legal use within the jurisdiction which you have the parts, is usually an affirmative defense (my example of three round extensions that can fit on seven or eight round magazines, with the seven round use being legal and therefore the parts probably legal).

    Also, saying you plan to assemble the parts in another state is generally not a defense.



    There is nothing illegal about what he is doing. Too much BGOS around here


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    1time

    Ultimate Member
    Apr 26, 2009
    2,258
    Baltimore, Md
    The mags already have a capacity over 10 rounds. He is increasing it, but they were already manufactured with over 10 round.

    It would be different if he had an 8 round mag that he was making a 11 round mag.
     

    Ammo Jon

    Ultimate Member
    Mar 3, 2008
    20,774
    Luckily I store my magazines out of state so there is no chance of constructive possession. Mags in PA, guns in DE, 9mm in WV and .950 JDJ in VA.
     

    rascal

    Ultimate Member
    Feb 15, 2013
    1,253
    There is nothing illegal about what he is doing. Too much BGOS around here

    Oh there are quite a few examples people are asserting as legal for which they are clearly not considering constructive possession case law.

    I was referring to this:
    To me it's the same as buying an upper. In and of itself, it cannot be made into a firearm.
    An upper with a 10" barrel in a SBR prohibition jurisdiction actually can be legal to own, but utterly illegal if you have readily accessible lower.
    So in several of the examples given it is not as cut and dried as people are asserting, but depends what else you have and where.
     

    rbird7282

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 6, 2012
    18,530
    Columbia
    Oh there are quite a few examples people are asserting as legal for which they are clearly not considering constructive possession case law.

    I was referring to this:
    An upper with a 10" barrel in a SBR prohibition jurisdiction actually can be legal to own, but utterly illegal if you have readily accessible lower.
    So in several of the examples given it is not as cut and dried as people are asserting, but depends what else you have and where.



    A 10” barreled upper is perfectly legal with a lower because it can be made into an AR pistol. I would say in that case that a pistol brace should probably be on the lower or at least in possession.
    As for the mags, personally, I would have no
    problem ordering and keeping those parts on hand.


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    rseymorejr

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 28, 2011
    26,002
    Harford County
    I'm still trying to imagine a scenario where the state is going through my magazines (or parts of magazines) trying to figure out when, where and how I came to have them????
     

    Zorros

    Ultimate Member
    Dec 10, 2017
    1,407
    Metropolis
    Receiving a magazine greater than 10rds in Maryland would be illegal.

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    There is a school of ( legal) thought that goes like this. When a seller delivers to a common carrier out of state, the title passes and the buyer is the owner. Therefore, what’s the difference between the buyer driving to pa and returning with the mag, or it being delivered to him by his agent, UPS? That said, i’s like to hear the buyer explain all of this to the seller. UCC lawyers might have a different belief.
     

    Hit and Run

    Ultimate Member
    Oct 15, 2010
    1,435
    Prince Frederick
    Under maryland law ( look at the old time sales tax cases) Assembly is very different than manufacturing which is taking raw components and creating something new versus adding together parts already manufactured.
    Sure wouldn't want to be the test case in any of these proposed scenarios.

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    lazarus

    Ultimate Member
    Jun 23, 2015
    13,673

    photoracer

    Competition Shooter
    Oct 22, 2010
    3,318
    West Virginia
    But if the magazine is already greater than 10 rounds capacity, would it be illegal? I don’t recall the exact text of the law, but I think it sums as manufacture of a magazine of greater than 10 rounds capacity. If the magazine was already greater than 10 rounds capacity, would it still be manufacturing it?
    Manufacturing means making not modifying. Manufacturing means building for sale and selling mags over 10 rds. in MD is prohibited. Mags larger than 10 rounds are legal to own in MD. The prohibition is about buying or selling large capacity mags in MD. That is often why in MD you sell the person your gun legally then meet out of state to pass him the large capacity mags (been there done that while I lived in the People's Republic). There were some issues in the past where companies would sell you a parts kit, which actually contained all the parts for a hi-cap mag, which you would assemble yourself.
    Once you own a hi-cap magazine in MD you can do anything to it, except sell it to another person in MD while both of you are in the state.
    Screwy laws if there ever are any. One reason why I moved thru the Iron Curtain into wild and wonderful WV.
     

    Pinecone

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 4, 2013
    28,175
    The problem is, it is not defined in that part of the law.

    So, you could become part of the test case.

    I don't see any issue with a mag extension being added to an already over 10 round mag. But personally, I would not install one inside MD to an under 10 round mag, if the final capacity were more than 10 rounds.

    As to ordering and shipping, an extension is not a mag. But MD did put a stop to mag "kits", so personally, I would pick them up out of state.
     

    Boats

    Beer, Bikes n Boomsticks
    Mar 13, 2012
    4,073
    Howeird County
    I appreciate the clarification, I will make sure that assembly takes place out of state.

    Not necessary.

    You mentioned that you want to turn a 30 round magazine into a 40rd magazine. Since the mags are already "high" capacity, there is no law against making a high-er capacity magazine.

    If the mags were 10 rounds, putting an extension on them would be illegal in this state.
     

    Ammo Jon

    Ultimate Member
    Mar 3, 2008
    20,774
    Not necessary.

    You mentioned that you want to turn a 30 round magazine into a 40rd magazine. Since the mags are already "high" capacity, there is no law against making a high-er capacity magazine.

    If the mags were 10 rounds, putting an extension on them would be illegal in this state.

    I wish you posted earlier, just got back from Utah! :innocent0
     

    danb

    dont be a dumbass
    Feb 24, 2013
    22,704
    google is your friend, I am not.
    Well, if you have turned a 30 rounder into a 40 rounder, you have "manufactured ...a detachable magazine that has a capacity of more than 10 rounds of ammunition." It does not matter how the mag started or whether you owned it before 2013, or anything else. All that matters is the end result. A prosecutor from even a 3rd rate school will say at some point, you had the follower, spring, and base plate off so at that moment it was not even a magazine. Then, you put parts back together into new configuration and made a (new) magazine, and s/he will highly likely win that argument, esp in an anti-gun state.

    I would strongly advise people not to be the test case for an anti-gun prosecutor, judge, and jury looking to cut their teeth for a big Bloomberg win. I realize that the reality is there is a 99.9% chance you wont get caught unless you do something else stupid, like use it in self defense against a didndunuffin. Which is to say, if/when you use your firearms in self defense, dont give the anti-gun prosecutors even a remote reason you look into you rather than the victim, i mean the didndunuffin. After all, you just shot someone who was turning their life around so someone will have to have justice.
     

    Zorros

    Ultimate Member
    Dec 10, 2017
    1,407
    Metropolis
    Sure wouldn't want to be the test case in any of these proposed scenarios.

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    Yeah. State’ burden to prove you broke the law. You don’t have to say anything that would incriminate you. Will a states atty try to subpoena the records of an out of state seller? Will the out of state seller refuse to comply? Not someasy, and all this to prosecute an individual who posses a few mags? I go to the range with a 15 rd mag. Sir, did you buy that in state after 10/13, did you buy it in pa? My $.02. And fabrication or assembly is not the same as manufacture. However, to each his own in terms of what risk he or she will take. And hope you don’t get caught in an extension sting operation when you order a couple of extensions.
     

    Ammo Jon

    Ultimate Member
    Mar 3, 2008
    20,774
    Yeah. State’ burden to prove you broke the law. You don’t have to say anything that would incriminate you. Will a states atty try to subpoena the records of an out of state seller? Will the out of state seller refuse to comply? Not someasy, and all this to prosecute an individual who posses a few mags? I go to the range with a 15 rd mag. Sir, did you buy that in state after 10/13, did you buy it in pa? My $.02. And fabrication or assembly is not the same as manufacture. However, to each his own in terms of what risk he or she will take. And hope you don’t get caught in an extension sting operation when you order a couple of extensions.

    I’d like you on extension retainer :)
     

    Boats

    Beer, Bikes n Boomsticks
    Mar 13, 2012
    4,073
    Howeird County
    Well, if you have turned a 30 rounder into a 40 rounder, you have "manufactured ...a detachable magazine that has a capacity of more than 10 rounds of ammunition." It does not matter how the mag started or whether you owned it before 2013, or anything else. All that matters is the end result. A prosecutor from even a 3rd rate school will say at some point, you had the follower, spring, and base plate off so at that moment it was not even a magazine. Then, you put parts back together into new configuration and made a (new) magazine, and s/he will highly likely win that argument, esp in an anti-gun state.

    I would strongly advise people not to be the test case for an anti-gun prosecutor, judge, and jury looking to cut their teeth for a big Bloomberg win. I realize that the reality is there is a 99.9% chance you wont get caught unless you do something else stupid, like use it in self defense against a didndunuffin. Which is to say, if/when you use your firearms in self defense, dont give the anti-gun prosecutors even a remote reason you look into you rather than the victim, i mean the didndunuffin. After all, you just shot someone who was turning their life around so someone will have to have justice.

    Nope.

    If that were the case, it would be illegal to:

    Disassemble a magazine for cleaning. Or
    Change out a follower spring with a new one.

    Because:

    The law does not state that it is illegal to modify an existing high capacity magazine, only that it is illegal to manufacture one.

    Which means that disassembly and reassembly is legal, but assembly of parts not already assembled constitutes manufacture.
     

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