The American Rifle Act

dreadpirate · Jul 19, 2017

Ok - here's what we need to do; new legislation that allows CMP to sell old M16's that have been converted to semi-auto. That's right, C&R (Vietnam Era) M16's converted to semi-auto and sold to the general public. Why not?

How do we get the ball rolling? Let's do it!!

Alea Jacta Est · Jul 19, 2017

We can call it Maxine's Law

AssMan · Jul 19, 2017

Why convert them? Can the pre-86 guns be sold as NFA items? That would really drive prices down.

dreadpirate · Jul 19, 2017

snallygaster said:
Why convert them? Can the pre-86 guns be sold as NFA items? That would really drive prices down.

Sounds good to me - I so amend the original post.

AssMan · Jul 19, 2017

dreadpirate said:
Sounds good to me - I so amend the original post.

And by the time the law passes, many will be C&R

dreadpirate · Jul 19, 2017

snallygaster said:
And by the time the law passes, many will be C&R

I really like all the optimism! :thumbsup:

yellowsled · Jul 24, 2017

The problem is if they are modified, they are not in original configuration and I think it would loose its C&R status then.

JHE1956 · Jul 24, 2017

As long as we are dreaming, anything could be written into the statute -- exemption from the 86 restrictions and C&R qualified even if modified for semi-auto only. Question though, can an M-16 lower be modified to SA only in a way that it cannot be easily converted back to selective fire?

Armadillofz1 · Jul 24, 2017

JHE1956 said:
As long as we are dreaming, anything could be written into the statute -- exemption from the 86 restrictions and C&R qualified even if modified for semi-auto only. Question though, can an M-16 lower be modified to SA only in a way that it cannot be easily converted back to selective fire?

I believe once the hole above the selector is drilled, it can't be undrilled.

ken792 · Jul 24, 2017

JHE1956 said:
As long as we are dreaming, anything could be written into the statute -- exemption from the 86 restrictions and C&R qualified even if modified for semi-auto only. Question though, can an M-16 lower be modified to SA only in a way that it cannot be easily converted back to selective fire?

As a physical matter, yes. Riveting across or welding up the full auto pin hole would prevent installing an auto sear. It could also be drilled larger and then riveted to prevent the installation of an auto sear if the rivet is removed. Such a conversion could also include welding or riveting in a sear block or some plates to take up the extra space on the inside that a full auto receiver has. You could also straight up cut that area out of the lower and leave a big gap where the auto sear pin would have sat.

They do such conversions in Europe, where "once a machine gun always a machine gun" is not a thing.

yellowsled said:
The problem is if they are modified, they are not in original configuration and I think it would loose its C&R status then.

Not necessarily. If the laws were changed to allow it, the receivers could be modified to semi auto only and still be the same receiver, such as with a rivet through the full auto pin hole or even just welding it up.

That's kind of how DEWATs work now with C&R status. DEWATs need to be on the NFA registry to be legal, but they're not functional firearms. The receivers are intact, but they're rendered inoperable in some way. Usually, it's something simple like a lead plug in the chamber or the bolt being spot welded closed. They transfer with NFA paperwork, but tax free on a Form 5. You may reactivate a registered DEWAT with a Form 1 and a $200 tax stamp. It is considered "manufacturing," but it retains the C&R status.

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/atf-national-firearms-act-handbook-chapter-10/download

JHE1956 · Jul 24, 2017

ken792 said:
As a physical matter, yes. Riveting across or welding up the full auto pin hole would prevent installing an auto sear. It could also be drilled larger and then riveted to prevent the installation of an auto sear if the rivet is removed. Such a conversion could also include welding or riveting in a sear block or some plates to take up the extra space on the inside that a full auto receiver has. You could also straight up cut that area out of the lower and leave a big gap where the auto sear pin would have sat.
https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/atf-national-firearms-act-handbook-chapter-10/download

While we are at it then, let's put Semi Auto only M14s in the bill.

somd_mustangs · Jul 24, 2017

Wouldn't a semi-auto M-16 be banned for sale in MD anyway?

ken792 · Jul 24, 2017

JHE1956 said:
While we are at it then, let's put Semi Auto only M14s in the bill.

Back in the 60s, that was a thing briefly with the M14M. The receivers rolled off the factory with all the full auto features present, but never had a selector switch installed. The selector parts were welded to the receiver and they were built up as National Match rifles for civilian sale. I believe once this program was ended, they approved all the match mods for the National Match M1 to give civilian shooters the opportunity to run a fully accurized rifle.

http://ww2.rediscov.com/spring/VFPC...g/DETAILS.IDC,SPECIFIC=11981,DATABASE=objects,

TheOriginalMexicanBob · Jul 24, 2017

I was always under the impression with ATF that "once a machine gun always a machine gun."

ken792 · Jul 24, 2017

TheOriginalMexicanBob said:
I was always under the impression with ATF that "once a machine gun always a machine gun."

That didn't come about until 1968 when they defined a receiver as the firearm. Before some point in the 50s, an "unfunctional" machine gun was not even legally a firearm or regulated in any way. Returning GIs from WWII with bringback full autos would throw the bolt or some parts overboard and be perfectly fine. After that, but prior to 1968, it was fine if it were a DEWAT. You could mail order a fully intact Thompson SMG with the bolt brazed shut and it wasn't legally a firearm.

Caeb75 · Jul 24, 2017

snallygaster said:
Why convert them? Can the pre-86 guns be sold as NFA items? That would really drive prices down.

Nope. They had to be transferrable as in on paper prior to 19MAY1986 in order to be transferrable to civilians.

AssMan · Jul 24, 2017

Caeb75 said:
Nope. They had to be transferrable as in on paper prior to 19MAY1986 in order to be transferrable to civilians.

Bummer. Guess we'll just need an exemption by Executive Order then

ken792 · Jul 24, 2017

snallygaster said:
Bummer. Guess we'll just need an exemption by Executive Order then

Current law allows the executive branch to order more amnesty registrations.

AssMan · Jul 24, 2017

ken792 said:
Current law allows the executive branch to order more amnesty registrations.

Not_an_outlaw · Jul 24, 2017

snallygaster said:
And by the time the law passes, many will be C&R

I will be C&R!

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