Open Carry Dad Wins?

5cary · Aug 12, 2015

Not sure how I feel about this: Open Carry Dad.

Why go to open carry? I would think CCW would be better for the armed citizen, less distracting (especially to kids), and make those of us that do carry seem less..."in your face" about it.

Circuit Judge Archie Hayman on Monday ruled in favor of Kenneth Herman and the gun-rights advocacy group Michigan Open Carry. Herman filed a lawsuit in March against the Clio district, arguing he was denied access to Edgerton Elementary multiple times while trying to pick up his daughter because he was carrying his pistol openly.

MikeTF · Aug 12, 2015

State law allows people with concealed-pistol licenses to carry their firearms openly in schools.

For that state, he's following the law. Just like in Virginia, if I want to go to Applebees and have a beer with my meal, I have to open carry. He had to open carry in the school. There was legislation to allow concealed carry in schools but Gov. Rick Snyder vetoed it.

"Mr. Herman was licensed to do what he did under state law. But the school district said, 'No, we're going to come up with a policy, a regulation that is more restrictive than state law.' That, they of course can't do," said Dean G. Greenblatt, the attorney for Herman and Michigan Open Carry, which was also part of the lawsuit.

-- Sound familiar?

5cary · Aug 12, 2015

Ah, I read that he *can* open carry in schools. I did not realize that that's the *only* way he can.

legislation that Gov. Rick Snyder vetoed that would allow concealed weapons in schools.

Well...that's just ass backwards. What would be the point of vetoing concealed weapons in schools if open carry is already "allowed"? Makes no sense.

I'm an advocate for any kind of carry, but I really do get what the school is saying here. CCW in schools is the way to go. That way if anyone sees a gun, it's either a bad guy about to do bad things, or a good guy about to stop a bad guy from doing bad things. Either way bad things are happening...and no one is confused by it.

But the article (and the actions of dad) make more sense now. Thanks for the clarification.

Stoveman · Aug 12, 2015

I don't get all the paranoia and angst about seeing a properly holstered firearm on a person.

Maybe its just me but the last thing that I'm thinking when I see someone OC'ing is "Oh my God, this guy standing in line at Wendy's is about to shoot up the place!!"

Willing to bet there's not a big market for HiPoint holsters.....

5cary · Aug 12, 2015

Stoveman said:
I don't get all the paranoia and angst about seeing a properly holstered firearm on a person.

Maybe its just me but the last thing that I'm thinking when I see someone OC'ing is "Oh my God, this guy standing in line at Wendy's is about to shoot up the place!!"

Willing to bet there's not a big market for HiPoint holsters.....

I really don't have *any* problem with OC. I can just understand the issues with doing it at school. I certainly wouldn't outlaw it, I would just wonder why someone would choose to do it (over CCW). I do get it in this case, though (only option?).

Bertfish · Aug 12, 2015

I have always viewed OC as a positive thing. Chances are if someone has a firearm holstered on their side and they are minding their own business then they are not aiming to cause problems. Not like they are trying to conceal anything.

44man · Aug 12, 2015

Bertfish said:
I have always viewed OC as a positive thing. Chances are if someone has a firearm holstered on their side and they are minding their own business then they are not aiming to cause problems. Not like they are trying to conceal anything.

I think this way myself.

Bertfish · Aug 12, 2015

The question I have to ask here is did this guy really want to carry his firearm in to the school for personal defense reasons or did he do this just to stir up an OC debate and lawsuit? Again, I'm all for OC, but we seem to have had a rash of stupidity lately with OC advocates intentionally provoking a public response to their antics. Just because you can doesn't always mean you should.

44man · Aug 12, 2015

Bertfish said:
The question I have to ask here is did this guy really want to carry his firearm in to the school for personal defense reasons or did he do this just to stir up an OC debate and lawsuit? Again, I'm all for OC, but we seem to have had a rash of stupidity lately with OC advocates intentionally provoking a public response to their antics. Just because you can doesn't always mean you should.

well if he was ccing and the law says no ccing in schools but open carry is ok then, to be on the right side of the law, open carry is his only option to pick his child up from school.

Bertfish · Aug 12, 2015

44man said:
well if he was ccing and the law says no ccing in schools but open carry is ok then, to be on the right side of the law, open carry is his only option to pick his child up from school.

This is true. So at least in this instance it was most likely an effort to exercise what rights he was permitted.

MikeTF · Aug 12, 2015

I would CC to school and I could sit in my car CC'ing. If I had to go into the school, it was a PITA. I would have to secure the firearm in the car in order to go in. That's how it is in Va. I hated having to leave the firearm in the car.

Stoveman · Aug 12, 2015

44man said:
well if he was ccing and the law says no ccing in schools but open carry is ok then, to be on the right side of the law, open carry is his only option to pick his child up from school.

This ^^^^^^ Remember, in Free America you strap on your shootin' iron first thing in the morning and don't take it off until you hit the rack.

So your average Joe doing average Joe things like taking daughter to school, picking up, whatever, even if he normally CC's just flips the shirt over when arriving at the school, does the kid thing and then goes on about the day.

If more average Joe and Janes OC'd in around a school eventually it would become commonplace as it should be.

trickg · Aug 12, 2015

What always blows my mind is how the libtards see open carrying people as being offensive and somehow inherently dangerous. Little do they realize that the person who is openly packing a pistol is probably the safest person they could be around.

Biggfoot44 · Aug 12, 2015

With another longstanding nod of the head to our esteemed Civil Rights Advocate; Let's play substitute the Noun.

It would hypothetically be less hassle for a visable minority parent to venture into a ( whereever) with baggy clothing and a pulled down hood to conceal his ethnic status.

At *some point* standing up for principle has to trump personal convience. Is this the point ? DamnifIknow ? But the point does exist somewhere.

MikeTF · Aug 12, 2015

I think that the other parents would think that the OC guy is working in some sort of LE capacity. It seems the only person voicing concern, is the school's administration, which knows what he does for a living.

Long1MD · Aug 12, 2015

MikeTF said:
For that state, he's following the law. Just like in Virginia, if I want to go to Applebees and have a beer with my meal, I have to open carry. He had to open carry in the school. There was legislation to allow concealed carry in schools but Gov. Rick Snyder vetoed it.
-- Sound familiar?

I was not aware that you could drink any alcohol at all when carrying concealed. Are you allowed to carry open carry and drink in VA? I would think having a blood alcohol content wouldn't play well in court for the shooter.

MikeTF · Aug 12, 2015

Long1MD said:
I was not aware that you could drink any alcohol at all when carrying concealed. Are you allowed to carry open carry and drink in VA? I would think having a blood alcohol content wouldn't play well in court for the shooter.

If I go to a restaurant, I can have a drink, if I switch from concealed carry to open carry. I cannot consume a beverage if I am concealed carrying unless I'm a police officer or other 'exempt' person.

Long1MD · Aug 12, 2015

I need to move

Stoveman · Aug 12, 2015

MikeTF said:
If I go to a restaurant, I can have a drink, if I switch from concealed carry to open carry. I cannot consume a beverage if I am concealed carrying unless I'm a police officer or other 'exempt' person.

Hence originated the term "Virginia Tuck" which is the act of tucking your shirt behind your IWB carried firearm....

rseymorejr · Aug 12, 2015

Bertfish said:
The question I have to ask here is did this guy really want to carry his firearm in to the school for personal defense reasons or did he do this just to stir up an OC debate and lawsuit? Again, I'm all for OC, but we seem to have had a rash of stupidity lately with OC advocates intentionally provoking a public response to their antics. Just because you can doesn't always mean you should.

Did Rosa Parks REALLY want to sit in the front of the bus?

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