AR-15 build info.

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  • Apone

    Active Member
    May 1, 2009
    530
    Salida, CO
    Colt makes the most complete out-of-the box rifle out there. A competent builder can equal, and maybe surpass it, though. If someone handed me a Colt, I sure as hell wouldn't turn it down.
     

    X-Factor

    I don't say please
    Jun 2, 2009
    5,244
    Calvert County
    I've put untold thousands (perhaps tens of thousands) of rounds through Colt rifles, both in my current occupation and the Marine Corps, it's what I'm most familar with.

    Bushmaster? I don't think you could pay me enough to own one, though I've horribly abused a few here and there...
     

    Russ D

    Ultimate Member
    Nov 10, 2008
    12,027
    Sykesville
    Apone do you have any experice with Sabre Defence uppers? As far as complete upper assemblies I hear they are very good. Personally I build all my own uppers cuz I can get all the performance if not more for almost half the money. Some manufacturers like Noveske, Larue, Colt go the extra mile with thier upper assemblies and if I was going into battle with my life on the line I may even rather have one of thier pre-built uppers. I can get all the accuracy with my builds, but I don't have nearly the same level of consistancy or experience as a company who makes thousands of uppers a year.
     

    DD214

    Founder
    Apr 26, 2005
    14,081
    St Mary's County
    Yeah that one lol. Why? Am I missing something?

    Nope. I think it is a good chart for what it is. I just figured you might have come across it in your research. After reviewing The Chart I felt comfortable enough with Colt to pay the Prancing Pony Premium. I'm glad I did.
     

    Russ D

    Ultimate Member
    Nov 10, 2008
    12,027
    Sykesville
    Yeah that one lol. Why? Am I missing something?

    This is a long running debate between the Colt faithful and those who don't drink the Colt kool-aide. Colt makes fine rifles. You can't take that away from them. Are they worth the premium? That's debatable.
     

    X-Factor

    I don't say please
    Jun 2, 2009
    5,244
    Calvert County
    Dollar for dollar it has seemed to me that they are cheaper than say, RRA. However, according to THAT chart RRA ain't all that super hot, though they offer ALOT of options when you build one of their guns. Frankly if I'm building a rifle that if it ever needs to be relied on, I want something I KNOW will hold up. Yeah I drink the Colt kool aid. I drink the HK kool aid, too, so take from that what you will. ;)

    Regardless of the mini debate, EXCELLENT read and I look forward to the next installment. :D
     

    DD214

    Founder
    Apr 26, 2005
    14,081
    St Mary's County
    Dollar for dollar it has seemed to me that they are cheaper than say, RRA. However, according to THAT chart RRA ain't all that super hot, though they offer ALOT of options when you build one of their guns. Frankly if I'm building a rifle that if it ever needs to be relied on, I want something I KNOW will hold up. Yeah I drink the Colt kool aid. I drink the HK kool aid, too, so take from that what you will. ;)

    Regardless of the mini debate, EXCELLENT read and I look forward to the next installment. :D

    Once you get your Colt built and post photos, you will need to post this pic as well to ward off any naysayers: ;)


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    X-Factor

    I don't say please
    Jun 2, 2009
    5,244
    Calvert County
    I'm FAR from an elitist....it's just my opinion that Colt makes a superior rifle (THE best? probably not). To each their own. *shrug* I'll never look down my nose at someone based on their rifle choice....hell at least they HAVE one....

    Seriously. I hope I haven't come across like that....
     

    Apone

    Active Member
    May 1, 2009
    530
    Salida, CO
    Not at all - remember, this is a discussion about building an AR. I don't think anyone (with any common sense) will argue that a Colt AR should be considered as one of the best out there.
     

    X-Factor

    I don't say please
    Jun 2, 2009
    5,244
    Calvert County
    Not at all - remember, this is a discussion about building an AR. I don't think anyone (with any common sense) will argue that at Colt AR should be considered as one of the best out there.

    Wait, what? :confused:

    Anyway, I'll check back in tomorrow. Bedtime for X-Factor.
     

    Russ D

    Ultimate Member
    Nov 10, 2008
    12,027
    Sykesville
    Nope not me. Like I said you can't take that away from them. Personally I just like to build my own stuff. Would I put it up against a Colt? Any day of the week. Do I look down on anyone who owns a Colt? Nope no way. Could I afford to to what I do and buy Colt parts? Not in this lifetime. Again if I'm going to war hand me a Colt and I won't complain one bit. At the range? My guns will equal them if not better them for much less money.
     

    Apone

    Active Member
    May 1, 2009
    530
    Salida, CO
    Russ-

    I haven't personally done anything w/ Sabre, but I've heard great things. I like their offerings. They hit all of the key points - I don't think I would have a problem using one of their rifles or uppers. I understand your apprehension about using a custom built upper assembly. The most strenuous thing you can do is run a rifle through a carbine course (besides taking it into combat). I can definitely build my own upper, but I know that I can't repair it in the field if something goes wrong. Just about every lower part can be repaired in the field or at a carbine class in about 10 minutes with minimal tools. That's kinda where I draw the line. As far as the Sabre upper, If you get ahold of one, post and let us know how it holds up.
     

    Apone

    Active Member
    May 1, 2009
    530
    Salida, CO
    Wait, what? :confused:

    Anyway, I'll check back in tomorrow. Bedtime for X-Factor.

    Sorry X - that didn't make much sense! No - you aren't being elitist. Not one bit. I just want to focus on building AR's from the ground up, not purchasing a complete rifle.

    My previous statement still stands, though - Colt makes one of the best (the best) factory rifles out there. I don't think this should even be open for discussion. Lastly - I don't think the "chart" is updated as often as it should be. Still, Colt is hands down better than any other complete rifle manufacturer out there.
     

    Russ D

    Ultimate Member
    Nov 10, 2008
    12,027
    Sykesville
    Russ-

    I haven't personally done anything w/ Sabre, but I've heard great things. I like their offerings. They hit all of the key points - I don't think I would have a problem using one of their rifles or uppers. I understand your apprehension about using a custom built upper assembly. The most strenuous thing you can do is run a rifle through a carbine course (besides taking it into combat). I can definitely build my own upper, but I know that I can't repair it in the field if something goes wrong. Just about every lower part can be repaired in the field or at a carbine class in about 10 minutes with minimal tools. That's kinda where I draw the line. As far as the Sabre upper, If you get ahold of one, post and let us know how it holds up.

    Man I'm having too much fun building my own uppers right now to consider buying a complete upper. Now if I had the funds to buy a complete upper and then add another 5-700$ to it to get what I'd like I'd probably go Colt. What I can do is build an upper with all the great features of the Colt like M16 carriers, MPI bolts, staked receivers, and all of that plus match grade barrels for way less money. Not one of my uppers has ever jammed once either. Does that make it as good as Colt? Pobably not. Am I having more fun? Definitely.
     

    DD214

    Founder
    Apr 26, 2005
    14,081
    St Mary's County
    Man I'm having too much fun building my own uppers right now to consider buying a complete upper. Now if I had the funds to buy a complete upper and then add another 5-700$ to it to get what I'd like I'd probably go Colt. What I can do is build an upper with all the great features of the Colt like M16 carriers, MPI bolts, staked receivers, and all of that plus match grade barrels for way less money. Not one of my uppers has ever jammed once either. Does that make it as good as Colt? Pobably not. Am I having more fun? Definitely.

    I agree that building them is much more fun than buying a complete rifle. I've got about a half dozen ARs in my safe that I built. I enjoyed every build and have been completely satisfied with every rifle. The last AR that I added to the collection was the Colt 6920, and the only reason that I purchased it is because of the Prancing Pony. It was more of an investment since Colt rifles seem to retain their value better than pretty much any other brand, and as ridiculous as it is I always get the "Wow, it's a real Colt!" reaction at the range. Also, I wanted a rock solid AR that could stand up to the worst torture that a SHTF situation could throw at it, and it seemed that Colt would be the logical choice (but not the only choice). It is now the only AR that I take to the range, and I could not be happier.

    Apone,

    As penance for taking your most excellent thread somewhat off course, I made it a sticky. Actually, the only sticky in the rifle forum. Nice write-up!
     

    DD214

    Founder
    Apr 26, 2005
    14,081
    St Mary's County
    I'm FAR from an elitist....it's just my opinion that Colt makes a superior rifle (THE best? probably not). To each their own. *shrug* I'll never look down my nose at someone based on their rifle choice....hell at least they HAVE one....

    Seriously. I hope I haven't come across like that....

    My photochop that I posted is a joke. It is aimed at those whose eyes roll back in their head and foam at the mouth at the very mention of the name "Colt". It is a visual tool for fanning the flames of hatred for all things endowed with a Pony. Some of the best meltdowns on gun boards happen in Colt related threads. I would never seriously claim that all other ARs are inferior, but it is fun to do so just to watch the reaction. :)

    Anyway, it is a moot point to me, since if the the S really HTF I would grab my FAL anyway. ;)
     

    Mark C

    Active Member
    Jul 6, 2008
    216
    Great timing for this post. I've decided I want an AR, but I'm poor, so I'm going to build it one piece at a time as I scrounge up some cash. I figure that's a win-win, don't go into debt for a new toy, and learn a lot along the way.

    I'll be getting a lower from Dan @ GC soon, then save a few months for a barrel (while waiting for my C&R to come in to get those discounts at Midway). So I'm researching barrel options now. I like the look of the varmint-style rifles the most, and I intend this rifle to be a dedicated paper puncher. I'm thinking a WOA 20" .223 Wylde 1:8 twist in SS, no flash hider/brake, I like the 'naked' look. Seems like a great compromise between cost (want to stay in the ~$300 ballpark for barrel), quality, performance, etc. Good choice or is there something better?
     

    X-Factor

    I don't say please
    Jun 2, 2009
    5,244
    Calvert County
    My feeling is this: critical parts should be the best I can afford. Non critical parts? Cheap. :D I don't think Colt makes the best parts for every part of the gun (see my Colt upper thread), but I do think they make damn near the best upper on the market, so that's what I want to get. I'm certainly open to correction, though.
     

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