Go Back   Maryland Shooters > The Arsenal > Rifles
Don't Have An Account? Register Here

Join MD Shooters
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old May 12th, 2021, 10:24 PM #41
Magnumite Magnumite is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Harford County, Maryland
Posts: 5,611
Magnumite Magnumite is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Harford County, Maryland
Posts: 5,611
The pretty standard true HBAR carbine I mentioned in a previous post tips the scale at 8.1 pounds with a rather large early vintage dot sight, there’s a few ounces to save. The front sight base far outweighs an MBUS and low profile gas block, 3-4 ounces to be saved there. Throw in a light weight free float That carbine could be 7.5 pounds.
__________________
If the brain were so simple we could understand it, we would be so simple we couldn’t.
Magnumite is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 13th, 2021, 11:42 AM #42
alucard0822's Avatar
alucard0822 alucard0822 is online now
For great Justice
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: PA
Posts: 15,047
Images: 11
alucard0822 alucard0822 is online now
For great Justice
alucard0822's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: PA
Posts: 15,047
Images: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by River02 View Post
Incredibly helpful post-- thanks and the pics are certainly welcome and appreciated. As always the MDS folks personal experience and suggestions add value to every project I've taken on to this point-- Great group to be associated with.
Thanks, there is a little bit of an art in building a rifle for a specific person, or for a specific purpose. Weight, overall size, balance, ergos, even noise and small stuff like control size/layout all make a difference. Light weight alone can make a rifle far more accessible for many people, but overall length/LOP is just as important. My wife GREATLY prefers my small SBR/braced stuff, for much of the same reason I like them, light weight, good balance, easy to handle. She also hates flash/noise, while she doesn't really understand why I buy some of the gun stuff I do, she absolutely LOVES shooting suppressed, even a linear comp/flash can makes a rifle more accessible, hates the added noise from even mild brakes. Greatly prefers 9mm or even 300BO over 5.56 and it's greater flash/noise. She likes a simple red dot, or LPVO with a good 1X, not a fan of higher powered optics or irons.

She likes large ambi controls, I run Raptors and Talons on everything anyway, but she also likes the oversized mag release and bolt catch too, makes then easier to see and work. Where I run a C grip with my support hand, she pulls in closer, and generally holds the magwell or close on the rail. Where I like at least a 9" M-lok with nothing on it, she runs 4" and 7" rails fine, likes a magwell that is easy to grip or a VFG(AFG on braced pistols) to help hold the rifle. She also likes smaller K/PWD braces and stocks, a little smaller footprint on the shoulder is more comfortable, and smaller grips for smaller hands, loves Magpul's slimline stuff. All in all if I build her a rifle, it would look completely different for something I would build myself, probably a PDW-ish 9mm suppressed SBR with red dot, and she likes shooting the couple AR9s I have more than anything rifle cal. She doesn't care for 16"+ rifles much, and hates a standard 16" M4 with irons, tiny controls, crappy trigger and muzzle heavy balance.
__________________
"Unfortunately, freedom allows sh*theads to get away with stuff. You always know the mark of a coward. A coward hides behind freedom. A brave person stands in front of freedom and defends it for others."
-Henry Rollins
alucard0822 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old May 13th, 2021, 03:42 PM #43
lazarus lazarus is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 7,179
lazarus lazarus is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 7,179
Quote:
Originally Posted by SkiPatrolDude View Post
IMO you really do hit diminishing returns with some of these ultra lightweight builds and at a cost of reliability in many cases.

A standard HBAR built around a standard receiver set, M16 profile BCG, H buffer and minimalist stock and handguard will be pretty dang light. Or you can spend hundreds more for a difference in weight that you and your wife will likely not feel.

Fluted barrels are nice, too, but I wouldn't go out of your way to have one fluted or pay too much extra for one. We're talking a few ounces at most.
IIRC a fluted HBAR 16" shaves about 4-5oz depending on the type of fluting. That's not a bad savings, especially since it is mostly coming off the end of the gun.

A 20" has a LOT of savings. About 6-7oz IIRC. That is pushing up on half a pound there. Again, from the end of the gun.

Typically most you are looking at between $20-80 more for a fluted version of a heavy barrel depending on the manufacturer.

Can't get much better weight savings per $ than that on parts with only a small number of exceptions.

PS and not that you'd be building it, but the weight difference on a 24" fluted heavy barrel compared to a standard heavy barrel is about 10-11oz from way out there on the gun (my 24" fluted HBAR 6.5 grendel upper is not bad. Still front heavy, but not bad at all. Really accurate too).
lazarus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 13th, 2021, 03:49 PM #44
lazarus lazarus is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 7,179
lazarus lazarus is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 7,179
Quote:
Originally Posted by alucard0822 View Post
Thanks, there is a little bit of an art in building a rifle for a specific person, or for a specific purpose. Weight, overall size, balance, ergos, even noise and small stuff like control size/layout all make a difference. Light weight alone can make a rifle far more accessible for many people, but overall length/LOP is just as important. My wife GREATLY prefers my small SBR/braced stuff, for much of the same reason I like them, light weight, good balance, easy to handle. She also hates flash/noise, while she doesn't really understand why I buy some of the gun stuff I do, she absolutely LOVES shooting suppressed, even a linear comp/flash can makes a rifle more accessible, hates the added noise from even mild brakes. Greatly prefers 9mm or even 300BO over 5.56 and it's greater flash/noise. She likes a simple red dot, or LPVO with a good 1X, not a fan of higher powered optics or irons.

She likes large ambi controls, I run Raptors and Talons on everything anyway, but she also likes the oversized mag release and bolt catch too, makes then easier to see and work. Where I run a C grip with my support hand, she pulls in closer, and generally holds the magwell or close on the rail. Where I like at least a 9" M-lok with nothing on it, she runs 4" and 7" rails fine, likes a magwell that is easy to grip or a VFG(AFG on braced pistols) to help hold the rifle. She also likes smaller K/PWD braces and stocks, a little smaller footprint on the shoulder is more comfortable, and smaller grips for smaller hands, loves Magpul's slimline stuff. All in all if I build her a rifle, it would look completely different for something I would build myself, probably a PDW-ish 9mm suppressed SBR with red dot, and she likes shooting the couple AR9s I have more than anything rifle cal. She doesn't care for 16"+ rifles much, and hates a standard 16" M4 with irons, tiny controls, crappy trigger and muzzle heavy balance.
IMHO, I am with your wife. I hate brakes. Even on a bench gun. I am a giant nope for a gun you are going to carry in the field or self defense. Don't need to lose my hearing and any real difference in how fast I can accurately shoot due to reduced recoil would only be of a benefit if I had decent ear protection on. Plus a lot of brakes add weight out at the end of the gun and make them slower to swing and more tiring to carry. Not saying they don't have perks, but IMHO they are almost exclusively in the competition crowd where they are wearing good ear and eye pro and generally only need to worry about faffing around with the gun for a few minutes at a time.

I can see the utility in very high energy rifles where you'd also still only be wearing ear and eye pro with. But I don't have any real interest in shooting those other than maybe a giggle fest on a few rounds from a 50BMG or what not.

I'd like a 300WSM (I might consider 325wsm instead) some day. For hunting as much as long range shooting. But I plan to use it with a can (so probably 300wsm), not a brake. And won't be loading it up with a brake to save my shoulder (can will help a fair amount with that).

Every single one of my ARs wears a linear comp for a reason...
lazarus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 13th, 2021, 04:09 PM #45
SkiPatrolDude's Avatar
SkiPatrolDude SkiPatrolDude is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Timonium-Lutherville
Posts: 1,354
SkiPatrolDude SkiPatrolDude is offline
Senior Member
SkiPatrolDude's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Timonium-Lutherville
Posts: 1,354
I initially put a VG6 Gamma brake on my wife's AR until I took it to the range to test. It's about the same size as a standard birdcage but WHOA it was loud. Took it off right when I get home and swapped for a spare Daniel Defense A2 style FH I had laying around.

For the 5.56 at least, the benefits of a brake are far outweighed by the cons of muzzle blast back to the shooters ear and to the sides. An absolute no-go if the rifle may ever be used defensively.

I think the best compromise between a brake and a compensator is the BCM Compensator Mod O. But they aren't cheap.

https://bravocompanyusa.com/bcmgunfi...or-mod-0-5-56/
__________________
“The Constitution shall never be construed to prevent the people of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms.”
– Samuel Adams

“Success is something you attract by the person you become.” - Jim Rohn
SkiPatrolDude is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

  Home Page > Forum List > The Arsenal > Rifles


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:00 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
© 2019, Congregate Media, LP Privacy Policy Terms of Service