Buffer-less AR?

Bart_man · May 22, 2012

I got my head around short pointable rifles for PDW or CQB and got stuck on folding stocks. I don't have anything with a folder and I've been thinking I want one.

so I started searching the interwebz and discoverd a thread on AR-15.com about AR's with folders. Not being one to put a lot of stock in Ar-15.com i researched the things they mentioned in that thread

I found this

and this review Article from soldier of fortune

Then I learned that Para ord only made it for one year and they dont make it anymore.

Then I learned that ZM weapons created the weapon and now has the license back from Para.

anyone ever seen operated....worked on (Chad), or had any other firsthand experience with one of these?

straightsilver3 · May 22, 2012

I'm going way back but a book I had about AR'S (can't remember the name of book) featured a builder named Alan Zita he was building bufferless AR pistols maybe someone can remember the book I got it through Paladin Press

Bart_man · May 22, 2012

straightsilver3 said:
I'm going way back but a book I had about AR'S (can't remember the name of book) featured a builder named Alan Zita he was building bufferless AR pistols maybe someone can remember the book I got it through Paladin Press

yup thats the guy..

Bart_man · May 23, 2012

hmmm no takers huh?

erwos · May 23, 2012

Alright, I did some research on this once upon a time. Your options are not great.

There's the ZM, as you've noted. Para bought the rights to it from ZM, and when it didn't sell, sold them back to ZM. The concept is interesting, but it's not $1800 interesting.

Oly made the OA-93 uppers. These look a little funky, as the recoil system is top-mounted.

And, of course, .22LR AR-15s don't require a buffer, either. I am actually going to be running my .22LR SBR this way when the stamp comes back.

The conclusion I reached after investigating the 5.56 options was essentially that, for a folding stock, the AR-15 was not the appropriate platform. For example, the Sig 556 is roughly comparable in weight to the ZM guns, but has much better support. Better still would be a P556 converted to an SBR, but whether this is an option for you, I don't know.

I also question whether you really want to be doing "CQB" with a folded stock. The traditional use for a folding stock was to make life easier on mounted troops in vehicles. I'm not an operator or anything, but for "CQB", I think I'd much rather have a collapsed stock and a short barrel. I have tried to shoot a carbine with the stock folded, and I could not understand how anyone could find it a good plan in the real world. Recoil control was horrible, leading to related accuracy problems.

Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk 2

nomo613 · May 23, 2012

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2012/05/03/law-tactical-ar-15-folding-stock-adapter/

stupidest folding ar15 in the world. you cant even fire it with the folded.

Buffer-less AR?

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