What makes an HBAR an HBAR?

Hopalong · Apr 8, 2013

Do we have any actual, written guidance or direction from MSP or legislators as to what qualifies an AR-15 as an HBAR that is exempt from the ban on "Assault Long Guns"? I know that historically, it's been treated as "if the lower is marked HBAR, it's an HBAR".

But what about HBAR-marked lowers sold with non-HBAR uppers? Or non-HBAR-marked lowers sold with HBAR-like uppers? Is threshold of "HBAR-ness" based on what's stamped on the lower, overall configuration, both, or something else?

Moving forward, I feel like we really need a very clear explanation from either legislators or the MSP.

buzzsaw · Apr 8, 2013

Hop - I think that by changing a HBAR (heavy barrel) into a hybrid, you are thereby significantly altering the gun and it is no longer the original that was manufactured... I've heard that this causes it to then fall under an "other" under NFA, but I dont think that would be correct. But as far as I can tell, it's pretty silly overall.

pbharvey · Apr 8, 2013

I don't know but isn't this just a rehash of the Federal Assault Weapons ban? What happened back then...besides Columbine?

lx1x · Apr 8, 2013

H= heavy
Bar=short for barrel..

i have couple hbar rifles.. it doesnt say anything on reciever.. except one says match target (oly).

good question though what MSP allow to be hbar rifles. i've seen plenty different brands with heavy barrel but no other special marks on the reciever/lower.

TheYetti · Apr 8, 2013

pbharvey said:
I don't know but isn't this just a rehash of the Federal Assault Weapons ban? What happened back then...besides Columbine?

North Hollywood Shootout

Arcamm · Apr 8, 2013

Look at the Colt AR6721. It's sold by Colt with a heavy barrel and is listed in their catalogs as a heavy barrel. The reciever is only marked AR6721 and the barrel is marked HBAR. So what is it?

bmelton · Apr 8, 2013

lx1x said:
H= heavy
Bar=short for barrel..

I actually thought it was a Heavy Barreled AR.

Where the AR still stands for ARmalite, denoting the AR platform.

Semantics though, I freely concede.

lx1x · Apr 8, 2013

bmelton said:
I actually thought it was a Heavy Barreled AR.

Where the AR still stands for ARmalite, denoting the AR platform.

Semantics though, I freely concede.

maybe so..

Cmoney · Apr 8, 2013

I've had some FFLs tell me that they'll transfer anything with HBAR stamped on the barrel as an HBAR, I've had others say they will only do the "Colt Sporter HBAR" or whatever the exact wording is in the law.

ELEMENT94 · Apr 8, 2013

"Colt AR-15, CAR-15, and all imitations
except Colt AR-15 Sporter H-BAR rifle"

I take this to mean unless the rifle is marked "Colt AR-15 Sporter H-BAR" it is regulated, (now banned) however many, including MSP (apparently) do not.

paulstitz · Apr 8, 2013

wasn't our local Beltway Sniper at the end of the ban?

phx223 · Apr 8, 2013

ELEMENT94 said:
"Colt AR-15, CAR-15, and all imitations
except Colt AR-15 Sporter H-BAR rifle"

I take this to mean unless the rifle is marked "Colt AR-15 Sporter H-BAR" it is regulated, (now banned) however many, including MSP (apparently) do not.

This.

Hopalong · Apr 8, 2013

I feel that the replies so far quite clearly emphasize the need for clear guidance on the issue.

scottymd · Apr 8, 2013

MSP will not define it. I have looked into this several times and have gotten several different answers.

lx1x · Apr 8, 2013

scottymd said:
MSP will not define it. I have looked into this several times and have gotten several different answers.

msp doesnt make rules.. they only enforce them..

its up to the AG to tell MSP what that particular part will have to be.

ELEMENT94 · Apr 8, 2013

lx1x said:
msp doesnt make rules.. they only enforce them..

its up to the AG to tell MSP what that particular part will have to be.

And my chocolate lab knows more about guns than the AG.

IMBLITZVT · Apr 8, 2013

ELEMENT94 said:
"Colt AR-15, CAR-15, and all imitations
except Colt AR-15 Sporter H-BAR rifle"

I take this to mean unless the rifle is marked "Colt AR-15 Sporter H-BAR" it is regulated, (now banned) however many, including MSP (apparently) do not.

Except that the law clearly says that it covers all clones. So as long as its a clone of a "Colt AR-15 Sporter H-BAR", you are ok.

I think the law is pretty much unenforceable... so long as you have some connection to a HBAR. The Receiver is the regulated part. So long as your purchase an HBAR receiver, I don't see how they can stop much given the current law. Also if the barrel is marked HBAR, you would be ok even if its not on a HBAR receiver. There is nothing saying you can't rebarrel a HBAR. There is nothing saying you can't change the length of the barrel on a HBAR. So long as you have some excuse, the law is not clear so it sides against the Government. As long as you look like you believe you are following the law, I don't see any court finding you guilty. Of course MSP may still charge you.

However if MSP will not tell us how they define an HBAR and its not defined in the law...

Maybe the people of Maryland could pay COLT to make series called "Colt AR-15 Sporter H-BAR", in every configuration out there... The law is not clear except that any "Colt AR-15 Sporter H-BAR" is ok. There is nothing saying Colt can't make every model AR ever made and label it "Colt AR-15 Sporter H-BAR"...

This is as bad as banning 50 caliber guns...... 49.99 caliber on its way!

ELEMENT94 · Apr 8, 2013

IMBLITZVT said:
Except that the law clearly says that it covers all clones. So as long as its a clone of a "Colt AR-15 Sporter H-BAR", you are ok.

I think the law is pretty much unenforceable... so long as you have some connection to a HBAR. The Receiver is the regulated part. So long as your purchase an HBAR receiver, I don't see how they can stop much given the current law. Also if the barrel is marked HBAR, you would be ok even if its not on a HBAR receiver. There is nothing saying you can't rebarrel a HBAR. There is nothing saying you can't change the length of the barrel on a HBAR. So long as you have some excuse, the law is not clear so it sides against the Government. As long as you look like you believe you are following the law, I don't see any court finding you guilty. Of course MSP may still charge you.

However if MSP will not tell us how they define an HBAR and its not defined in the law...

Maybe the people of Maryland could pay COLT to make series called "Colt AR-15 Sporter H-BAR", in every configuration out there... The law is not clear except that any "Colt AR-15 Sporter H-BAR" is ok. There is nothing saying Colt can't make every model AR ever made and label it "Colt AR-15 Sporter H-BAR"...

This is as bad as banning 50 caliber guns...... 49.99 caliber on its way!

The law does not say it covers all clones. It says what I wrote above VERBATIM. The problem is the interpretation of the written word.

Hopalong · Apr 8, 2013

IMBLITZVT said:
Maybe the people of Maryland could pay COLT to make series called "Colt AR-15 Sporter H-BAR", in every configuration out there... The law is not clear except that any "Colt AR-15 Sporter H-BAR" is ok. There is nothing saying Colt can't make every model AR ever made and label it "Colt AR-15 Sporter H-BAR"...

I'd love it if one of the manufacturers in MD started production of AR lowers stamped with something like "MD-Compliant HBAR Clone" and only sold them in MD.

Think of the profit they'd make.

TheYetti · Apr 8, 2013

IMBLITZVT said:
This is as bad as banning 50 caliber guns...... 49.99 caliber on its way!

See 416 Barrett. For 50 BMG ban see 50 DTC

What makes an HBAR an HBAR?

The #1 community for Gun Owners of the Northeast

Member Benefits:

Man of Many Nicknames

Ultimate Member

Habitual Testifier

Peanut Gallery

Member

Ultimate Member

Active Member

Peanut Gallery

Active Member

Wild eyed pistol waver.

Active Member

Member at Large

Man of Many Nicknames

Active Member

Peanut Gallery

Wild eyed pistol waver.

Ultimate Member

Wild eyed pistol waver.

Man of Many Nicknames

Member

Users who are viewing this thread

Log in

Forum statistics