Who to believe?

natsb · Nov 1, 2014

I am just getting started in reloading. I am at the stage where I have a bunch of Nosler 60gr Ballistic Tip Varmint bullets, trimmed and primed 223 cases, and a pound of Hodgdon Benchmark powder.

So I go to the manuals and find the following load data:
Hodgdon - start 23, max 24.6
Lee - start 22, max 24.6
Nosler - start 21.5, max 23.5

Who is right? Is this where I toss a coin and hope for the best? I am especially concerned that the Nosler max is almost the same as the Hodgdon start.

BradMacc82 · Nov 1, 2014

Loading for an AR or bolt gun??

BigDaddy · Nov 1, 2014

natsb said:
I am just getting started in reloading. I am at the stage where I have a bunch of Nosler 60gr Ballistic Tip Varmint bullets, trimmed and primed 223 cases, and a pound of Hodgdon Benchmark powder.

So I go to the manuals and find the following load data:
Hodgdon - start 23, max 24.6
Lee - start 22, max 24.6
Nosler - start 21.5, max 23.5

Who is right? Is this where I toss a coin and hope for the best? I am especially concerned that the Nosler max is almost the same as the Hodgdon start.

My Lee 2nd edition, has 23g as the start for a 60g "jacketed bullet"
Hodgon's online specifies a Hornady VMax
And my Nosler manual is MIA, but I'll bet it specifies the Ballistic tip.

Aside from them using different test rifles, the bullet is also a variable. While the VMax looks just like a BT, I do not know that it has the same bearing surface area nor the same jacket material, so I would go with Nosler's data.

natsb · Nov 1, 2014

BradMacc82 said:
Loading for an AR or bolt gun??

AR

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BradMacc82 · Nov 1, 2014

Start at 21.3 and work up.

What length gas system?

natsb · Nov 1, 2014

BradMacc82 said:
Start at 21.3 and work up.

What length gas system?

Mid

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BradMacc82 · Nov 1, 2014

natsb said:
Mid

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You'll have plenty of room to work, safely.

I push 69gr Noslers out of a 16" Middy - 25.1gr of H335, no significant pressure signs. Loaded to magazine length. Wolf SRP.

stu929 · Nov 1, 2014

I run 24.5 same bullet and powder ;-)

BradMacc82 · Nov 1, 2014

stu929 said:
I run 24.5 same bullet and powder ;-)

I got lucky, that load ran just as well in my 24" Savage 10 as it did in my AR - the bolt was a bit tighter with the groups since the Middy ran a light-weight barrel.

BUFF7MM · Nov 1, 2014

I would use the bullet manufactures information.

stu929 · Nov 1, 2014

I can tell you I noslers book. Its very limited on powder choices and in the reloading climate today its hard to find most of them.

Uncle Duke · Nov 1, 2014

Not at all a flip of a coin in my opinion.

Where you have multiple choices for load data, I'd definitely start with the bullet manufacturer's data when you have it available. Where bullet weights can be identical across different manufacturers, bearing surfaces and bullet design characteristics can and do differ. To me anyway, the bullet manufacturer is specifying their suggested load data for THEIR specified bullet. Take their word for it as your best source of the 3 sources, start with their suggested starting load, and slowly and very gradually work your way up while being alert for pressure signs in YOUR rifle.

j8064 · Nov 1, 2014

Buff7mm said:
I would use the bullet manufactures information.

This ^^^

Uncle Duke said:
Not at all a flip of a coin in my opinion.

Where you have multiple choices for load data, I'd definitely start with the bullet manufacturer's data when you have it available. Where bullet weights can be identical across different manufacturers, bearing surfaces and bullet design characteristics can and do differ. To me anyway, the bullet manufacturer is specifying their suggested load data for THEIR specified bullet. Take their word for it as your best source of the 3 sources, start with their suggested starting load, and slowly and very gradually work your way up while being alert for pressure signs in YOUR rifle.

And this ^^^

Just as bullets and powders are different, firearms are different. No bullet or powder manufacturer ever tests their published loads in your firearm.

DaemonAssassin · Nov 1, 2014

The "sticky" threads cover where you should get you load data. If you are using Sierra bullets, use the Sierra reloading book to get the correct information. Use Nosler's reloading book for Nosler's bullets.

Blacksmith101 · Nov 2, 2014

There are other variables beside bullet and powder.

The case (manufacturer and capacity) and the primer mainly.

Which is why you always start low and work your way up.

Lighter loads cost less (more reloads per pound of powder) and beat up your gun less. More is not always better and the trade off of a few FPS is seldom worth it, the hole in the paper doesn't care.

outrider58 · Nov 2, 2014

DaemonAssassin said:
The "sticky" threads cover where you should get you load data. If you are using Sierra bullets, use the Sierra reloading book to get the correct information. Use Nosler's reloading book for Nosler's bullets.

I tend to go with powder specs because bullet specs don't always cover the powder I'm using. In doing so, if I can't find my bullet in the powder's specs, I find a bullet of similar length and weight and adjust accordingly working my way up. I tend to load a lot of 68-69 gr. 224 bullets so it's not a lot of math to arrive at a safe starting point.

DaemonAssassin · Nov 3, 2014

outrider58 said:
I tend to go with powder specs because bullet specs don't always cover the powder I'm using. In doing so, if I can't find my bullet in the powder's specs, I find a bullet of similar length and weight and adjust accordingly working my way up. I tend to load a lot of 68-69 gr. 224 bullets so it's not a lot of math to arrive at a safe starting point.

For an experienced reloader that is fine, but the OP said he was new to reloading. He is also asking which information to use for his loads. Recommending him to use the manufacturer books is the safest thing for him to do.

outrider58 · Nov 3, 2014

I am relatively new to reloading also but I have taken some classes. It can be frustrating sometimes with the scarcity of reloading materials, having to resort to using in some cases, new or no-mainstream powders, bullets, primers etc. Not saying to be careless. On the contrary, to be extra careful. And as always, if unsure, always ask someone.

sgt23preston · Nov 3, 2014

Given only the information that you presented, if it was me, I'd load 23 grains = Mathematical Mid Point of all 6 loads...

Hodgdon - start 23, max 24.6
Lee - start 22, max 24.6
Nosler - start 21.5, max 23.5

It was on the safe side of all 3 load ranges...

jjones88 · Nov 3, 2014

natsb said:
I am just getting started in reloading. I am at the stage where I have a bunch of Nosler 60gr Ballistic Tip Varmint bullets, trimmed and primed 223 cases, and a pound of Hodgdon Benchmark powder.

So I go to the manuals and find the following load data:
Hodgdon - start 23, max 24.6
Lee - start 22, max 24.6
Nosler - start 21.5, max 23.5

Who is right? Is this where I toss a coin and hope for the best? I am especially concerned that the Nosler max is almost the same as the Hodgdon start.

Did you check COL? Guessing Nosler has their BT seated a lot shorter then the others....

Ran into a similar issue with N133 and when i was trying to find a start point, suddenly realized that Hodgdon had the bullet seated deeper then the other two. Makes figuring out a starting point a little harder but if you know you plan to seat longer (Those V-max's for me like around 2.245-2.250) then you are a little safer on the max if you crest 24 gr (as always watch for pressure signs, I'd probably start looking around 23.9 - 24.0)

When you are bouncing from data sources keep that COL as one of the first things to check

Who to believe?

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