HB 819 HAndgun Review Board

Schipperke · Apr 4, 2018

Biggfoot44 said:
The thing is , the latest version literally retains the HPRB . The Bill seeks to undermine it by a yet to be seen degree by adding ALJ imeadately above it in the appeals chain , but the Board is still there in current form .

819 sucks inherently , and is unnecessary . But since the Board is not abolished , and effects are ambiguous, by itself does not make a fruitful Litmus Test to be used in post game analysis that starts 4/10/ 18 for MGA, and 4/16/18 for the GOV .

We have 888 and 1032 for better predictors .

What is it yet to be seen? HPRB gives either side an adverse ruling and you can demand a de novo hearing in front of an ALJ who supercedes the board. It is not an appeal on the record of HPRB, it's a do over. You (or MSP) can add evidence or witnesses not brought before the board if you like. Not sure what an applicant pays to file for this step, but I think MSP doesn't have that issue.

Biggfoot44 · Apr 4, 2018

We have yet to see the actual practices regarding MSP use of Appeals . We have yet to see patterns (if any) of ALJs on Appeals before them ( if any ) .

I hear you , see where you're going with it . And have my own personal speculations . But we don't yet * know * .

***********

In the Dept of Be Careful What You Ask For - Your side made considerable effort to push " Don't Abolish the HPRB " . Sen Zirkin took us literally, and wrangled Sausage to give us literally what we asked for ... The Board not Abolished .

In 20/20 hindsight , our message should have been " Save the Board , AND maintain the current structure of Appeals Process of W&C related decisions by MSP. "

If someone wished , they might place 819 votes into the plethora of misc Committee Votes that went no farther . But TO ME , 819 as finnally written , doesn't rise enough to turn the Big Two in the Big Three of lightning rod Bills.

44man · Apr 4, 2018

Biggfoot44 said:
We have yet to see the actual practices regarding MSP use of Appeals . We have yet to see patterns (if any) of ALJs on Appeals before them ( if any ) .

I hear you , see where you're going with it . And have my own personal speculations . But we don't yet * know * .

***********

In the Dept of Be Careful What You Ask For - Your side made considerable effort to push " Don't Abolish the HPRB " . Sen Zirkin took us literally, and wrangled Sausage to give us literally what we asked for ... The Board not Abolished .

In 20/20 hindsight , our message should have been " Save the Board , AND maintain the current structure of Appeals Process of W&C related decisions by MSP. "

If someone wished , they might place 819 votes into the plethora of misc Committee Votes that went no farther . But TO ME , 819 as finnally written , doesn't rise enough to turn the Big Two in the Big Three of lightning rod Bills.

would you say that we do know this was not done to help us and not done to help the average joe to get a md ccw?

Schipperke · Apr 4, 2018

Board’s Action Requirements
Within 90 days after receiving a request for a review/hearing of the Secretary’s (of the State Police) action, the Board, at its discretion, may choose either to:

1) Review the record developed by the Secretary of the State Police; or
2) Conduct a hearing.

HPRB has totally abandon reviewing applications and making a finding. With this new system it would behoove them not to hear anyone and just thumbs up or down on the application and any additional documents they ask for or one enters. Why go through two hearings. Even now with all the permit modifications they are doing, I have no idea why they can't make a finding with a written statement and submitting previous testimony that has prevailed and is applicable to your own application.

CharlieFoxtrot · Apr 5, 2018

Who would even want to be on the HPRB now?

Abacab · Apr 5, 2018

CharlieFoxtrot said:
Who would even want to be on the HPRB now?

No doubt an unintended consequence that they're happy about.

Schipperke · Apr 5, 2018

CharlieFoxtrot said:
Who would even want to be on the HPRB now?

Glad you wrote that.

This doesn't take effect till Oct 1st if finalized. I'd implore the current board to comb through cases and overturn or sustain MSP on cases it can review on the record before then. There is a lot of precedent applicable to many modifications, save yourselves (and appellants) the trouble of hearings you do not need. MSP would have to appeal to circuit until Oct 1.

If this Bill becomes law, I'd never waste my time hearing a case if on that board. The DC board I don't believe had many hearings, it was all via interrogatories when I did mine and failed 2-0

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