Spend my $1000

hi3cho · Dec 21, 2016

So I just recently got my C&R License and have made one purchase so far, a Romanian Tokarev. My first purchase had to be a handgun to be shipped to the house. I will have to post a funny story about the delivery/signature of that one. It seems like the C&R Market is pretty predictable in things go up after the surplus supply dries up. I am looking to purchase 3-4 guns for a total of about $1000 possibly a little more, as an investment. The only two C&R I already have is the Romanian Tok and a Mosin 91/30 Hex

So if you had my $1000 to burn for a few surplus guns that are most likely to go up in value in the next few years, what would they be? Post prices, and sellers if you know them. Below is what I have gathered from following the C&R forum over the past few weeks.

Yugo SKS Unissued (400-450)
Mauser M48 (250-300)
Swiss K31 (300-350)
Total (950-1100)

28Shooter · Dec 21, 2016

I like your list but I think your K31 estimate is low for a nice one.

SmokeEaterPilot · Dec 21, 2016

Are you looking more for shooting or collecting?

I'd be careful for buying for investments. The reason I say that, is I collect pretty much only 1903s anymore and watch those prices VERY carefully. I've seen some variants that used to be over 3k a few years ago, now a very difficult sale for 1500.

That being said, collect because it's something you're interested in. Focus less on the "investment" aspect.

cimiM1 · Dec 21, 2016

Good list. In place of the M48, maybe a nice Finn M39 ($300-$450) but I realize they've gotten out of hand with the recent classic releases. If not an M39 maybe a nice Finn 91/30 ($250-$350) with a Tikka or VKT barrel in a 2 piece finn stock. You have to look for those items in classified posts though.

hi3cho · Dec 21, 2016

28Shooter said:
I like your list but I think your K31 estimate is low for a nice one.

What do you think a reasonable price would be and/or where to look? I pulled the price from googling and a classic ad for $339 came up but it is now out of stock. I am not familiar with the market for them, It was just recommended in another thread.

The C&R prices seem to be all over the place with the big C&R retailers, gunbroker/armslist, forum trading/Classified, and what people say they should cost. Then add condition and variations and it is a tough market to keep track of.

hi3cho · Dec 21, 2016

SmokeEaterPilot said:
Are you looking more for shooting or collecting?

I'd be careful for buying for investments. The reason I say that, is I collect pretty much only 1903s anymore and watch those prices VERY carefully. I've seen some variants that used to be over 3k a few years ago, now a very difficult sale for 1500.

That being said, collect because it's something you're interested in. Focus less on the "investment" aspect.

I am a collector by nature, I have always collected things since I was a kid, with baseball cards, to sports memorabilia, to sports figures. Most of those hobbies resulted in losses. I have nice 'collection' of modern guns which I have been collecting over the past 5 years. In just watching some of the lower grade C&R market like Mosin and Nagant Revolvers, it seems like the market generally only rises for the lower end surplus stuff once the supply dries up. I am not yet looking into the higher end stuff but the lower end stuff seems like it will in now way lose value moving forward.

I will probably not do much shooting of them because I barely have time to shoot my modern stuff with having an infant and a toddler. I look at this as a collecting hobby I would do anyway even if with some other hobby but with this one I am likely to make money or at least breakeven, even though I will probably not sell anything.

Fox123 · Dec 21, 2016

hi3cho · Dec 21, 2016

cimiM1 said:
Good list. In place of the M48, maybe a nice Finn M39 ($300-$450) but I realize they've gotten out of hand with the recent classic releases. If not an M39 maybe a nice Finn 91/30 ($250-$350) with a Tikka or VKT barrel in a 2 piece finn stock. You have to look for those items in classified posts though.

Good info, This is stuff I am looking for. I will look into these.

yellowsled · Dec 21, 2016

I am selling a lot of stuff right now... One that may interest you is a M39 that still has its Finn arsenal hangtag and Antique 1898 dated receiver. Also check the link in my signature, I have some other stuff posted including a very nice M24/47.

Shoot me a PM if u like

hi3cho · Dec 21, 2016

This may be a dumb question but how do you tackle the C&R market. What I mean is there is a ton of models/variants and things to look at. Its not like the new gun market where you can see prices every day and the market is set. I have a pretty good memory and pick up things pretty quickly but the market just seems daunting. Maybe its just because I am newer to it and you just pick it up after years and years of collecting and researching. I am contemplating making list/cheat sheet with models and types and things to look for. It actually would be a great idea for a sticky but could be a lot of work.

cimiM1 · Dec 21, 2016

I've made some purchasing mistakes but I think that most gather information about particular firearms via the forum(s) and publications. You can pick up one of the various Pricing Catalogs to give you a good idea on what's out there and some background on each item. I look for price guidance in looking at how much things are selling for in the classifieds and to some extent closed auction values.

yellowsled · Dec 21, 2016

hi3cho said:
This may be a dumb question but how do you tackle the C&R market. What I mean is there is a ton of models/variants and things to look at. Its not like the new gun market where you can see prices every day and the market is set. I have a pretty good memory and pick up things pretty quickly but the market just seems daunting. Maybe its just because I am newer to it and you just pick it up after years and years of collecting and researching. I am contemplating making list/cheat sheet with models and types and things to look for. It actually would be a great idea for a sticky but could be a lot of work.

they vary from market to market, and with time desirability changes. I have spent a lot of time researching and identifying special markings that add value to firearms. The older gun market is a animal in itself.

fred333 · Dec 21, 2016

As others've suggested, buy what you like. Investing, especially with the next president pitching the idea of changing federal firearm laws (which could potentially cause a reshuffling of gun values), is unpredictable.
That said, of all the C&R stuff I've got, I've got one gun that seems to've nearly tripled in value in the two years I've had it: the Beretta 1951. Purchased for ~$250, I've recently seen two in similar (VG) condition sell on Gunbroker for upwards of $800 and one for just under $1,000. And it remains, by far, my favourite sidearm. It's the gun that Fleming should've assigned to all 00s.

mawkie · Dec 21, 2016

Wish I had a crystal ball to use to give you sage advice about which items to invest in. Me, I'm a bargain hunter who only purchases what's of interest to me. And while my interests are varied they're just a drop in the C&R ocean. If you're focused on investment potential then the best advice I can give you is to stick to those items that are popular (Garands, M1 Carbines, Lugers, Broomhandles, 1911s, etc). They'll probably do best in holding and gaining value with time. If you venture into niche parts of the market (my love for all things French for instance) expect the potential for profit to be thinner. But if you buy the best example you can afford, even of a niche item, you will probably do quite well. So my advice would be to not get 3 average items but look to pool that $1k and get a single outstanding example. A bit risky when compared with spreading your investment out (kinda like buying stocks) but I believe if done prudently you'll do well down the road.

reverendbeer · Dec 21, 2016

fred333 said:
That said, of all the C&R stuff I've got, I've got one gun that seems to've nearly tripled in value in the two years I've had it: the Beretta 1951. Purchased for ~$250, I've recently seen two in similar (VG) condition sell on Gunbroker for upwards of $800 and one for just under $1,000. And it remains, by far, my favourite sidearm. It's the gun that Fleming should've assigned to all 00s.

Remember when Cole's was basically giving them away? Good times, good times.

hi3cho · Dec 21, 2016

mawkie said:
Wish I had a crystal ball to use to give you sage advice about which items to invest in. Me, I'm a bargain hunter who only purchases what's of interest to me. And while my interests are varied they're just a drop in the C&R ocean. If you're focused on investment potential then the best advice I can give you is to stick to those items that are popular (Garands, M1 Carbines, Lugers, Broomhandles, 1911s, etc). They'll probably do best in holding and gaining value with time. If you venture into niche parts of the market (my love for all things French for instance) expect the potential for profit to be thinner. But if you buy the best example you can afford, even of a niche item, you will probably do quite well. So my advice would be to not get 3 average items but look to pool that $1k and get a single outstanding example. A bit risky when compared with spreading your investment out (kinda like buying stocks) but I believe if done prudently you'll do well down the road.

I get what you are saying and I get the parallels to investing but I kind of look at it a different way. I see it as surplus firearms being IPO's and once they are all sold the market always sets it self higher. Now this is not always correct for IPO's but it does seem to be for C&R Surplus. Now Garand and M1 Carbines the market is set and are highly collectable and people know what they have. More like a value stock of an established company like Verizon. I am not looking to use this as a means for income or to get rich, just a hobby to hold or increase in value over time. The collector in me likes the idea of more guns at a lower price which are more likely to double or triple in value but not be a real threat to decrease.

Mike OTDP · Dec 21, 2016

For $1K? I'd go with the P64. Not my favorite gun, but if you're thinking of investment potential, that's it. A Cz-82 if you can find one reasonably priced.

That being said, there's potential with the new Administration for some imports from Russia...and the Russians squirreled away everything that would shoot after the Great Patriotic War.

iH8DemLibz · Dec 21, 2016

Finnish M39s and Russian Mosins are boat oars when compared to the quality and craftsmanship of the Yugoslavian M48s and M48As.

German Mauser design through and through for 250 bucks.

hi3cho · Dec 21, 2016

Mike OTDP said:
For $1K? I'd go with the P64. Not my favorite gun, but if you're thinking of investment potential, that's it. A Cz-82 if you can find one reasonably priced.

That being said, there's potential with the new Administration for some imports from Russia...and the Russians squirreled away everything that would shoot after the Great Patriotic War.

SOG has P64 Police Compact Unissued Condition for $239, Is that a good price. Shipping is around $25 though.

CasualObserver · Dec 21, 2016

hi3cho said:
SOG has P64 Police Compact Unissued Condition for $239, Is that a good price. Shipping is around $25 though.

That seems about average to me. I like the p64 and think they will go up some once they dry up like everything else has. Keep in mind, SOG adds 3% I believe for credit card payments. However, I think their grading in my experience is very fair.

Spend my $1000

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