1918 Colt 1911

GolfR · Jun 2, 2017

My neighbor is looking to offload a 1918 Colt 1911 S/N 547xxx. It is a government model that appears to have original frame and slide although the slide doesn't have a S/N which I believe was correct for this time period. The barrel is marked with an "S" and "P" which I believe means it is a springfield barrel. The gun has been VERY nicely reblued and basically doesn't have a scratch on it. I haven't pulled the gun apart enough or know enough about the originality of the other components.

He wants $1500 for it which seems little steep to me but I'm looking for feedback from those that may deal more regularly in these types of firearms. I'm not really looking for a "collectors item" as I would like to shoot it very occasionally. I also don't want to spend way more than it's worth. Unfortunately, I don't have any pictures of it.

Anyone have any thoughts?

Thanks in advance!

BBossman1 · Jun 2, 2017

The refinish removed all collector value from this pistol, its only value now is as a shooter, IF its in a condition thats safe to fire..

Originality is everything in the military arms collectors market. $1500 will buy a decent "full featured" modern 1911 you can shoot and enjoy to your hearts content.

metalman3006 · Jun 2, 2017

@ $750.00 for a reblue

hairba111 · Jun 2, 2017

Are you sure the barrel is marked "SP"? 1918 models had High Point barrels, it may be correct if you mistook the "H" for an "S". Mine looks like "IP" because the H was off center when struck.

A reblue does kill the collectors value but $1500 is not a bad price for a "Black Army" 1911. Sounds like a shooter to me! Have fun with it!

Jimbob2.0 · Jun 2, 2017

Too much given its reblued it's a $800 gun max.

If it was original and decent up to $2000

bpm32 · Jun 2, 2017

Jimbob2.0 said:
Too much given its reblued it's a $800 gun max.

If it was original and decent up to $2000

Probably $3000 and up now--it's amazing how much M1911/M1911A1 prices have gone up just in the last couple of years.

And the quality of fakes is high--it's really disheartening.

GolfR · Jun 2, 2017

hairba111 said:
Are you sure the barrel is marked "SP"? 1918 models had High Point barrels, it may be correct if you mistook the "H" for an "S". Mine looks like "IP" because the H was off center when struck.

A reblue does kill the collectors value but $1500 is not a bad price for a "Black Army" 1911. Sounds like a shooter to me! Have fun with it!

It's not marked at all in the area that you can see with the gun assembled. I had to remove the barrel to find any markings but it is very clearly marked with a S and a P on the side of the feed ramp.

It is a shame that it was reblued but I have no idea what the guns condition was before it was worked.

somd_mustangs · Jun 2, 2017

hairba111 said:
Are you sure the barrel is marked "SP"? 1918 models had High Point barrels, it may be correct if you mistook the "H" for an "S". Mine looks like "IP" because the H was off center when struck.

A reblue does kill the collectors value but $1500 is not a bad price for a "Black Army" 1911. Sounds like a shooter to me! Have fun with it!

The "H P" on barrel hood is a proof and inspection mark for a WW1-era Colt barrel, not for High Point

The "IP" might be the "intertwined" HP used in the 1918 era - check to see if it has an "&" on bottom of barrel in front of lug too.

High Standard made barrels in WW2 with "H S" on the lug.

OP's referenced 1911:
S P on the left barrel lug would be for a Springfield post-WW1 replacement barrel.
Since the gun was refinished it stands to reason the barrel (and who knows what else) was replaced.
BTW - S on one side, P on the other would be for a pretty rare WW1 Springfield.

$1500 is too much for it by far as a refinish with non-original parts.
A few more dollars and you're in the range of a nice original WW2 Remington Rand which will always be in demand in the future.

somd_mustangs · Jun 2, 2017

GolfR said:
It's not marked at all in the area that you can see with the gun assembled. I had to remove the barrel to find any markings but it is very clearly marked with a S and a P on the side of the feed ramp.

That confirms it is Springfield replacement barrel.

GolfR · Jun 2, 2017

Bummer that it's not a good deal because it would be an easy way to pick up a piece of history. I do like the idea of an original finish gun. It would go well with my all original Luger and Sauer 38H. I'm thinking I will let this one go and spend my money on the Wilson Combat Beretta that I keep hesitating on!

I greatly appreciate all the info and advice.

bpm32 · Jun 2, 2017

Apparently a lot of these 1918-1919 M1911s had to be reblued anyway. The surface prep was almost non-existent due to wartime production speeds and for whatever reason the rough surfaces didn't hold bluing very well. I think I read somewhere where it was hard to remove the cleaning solvent from the unpolished parts before going into the bluing tanks, resulting in a bunch of finish problems and corrosion. I guess I can believe that, based on my limited experience with bluing prep.

The irony is that the term "Black Army" is really cool sounding and has inflated costs, even though these are, in essence, wartime exigency pistols and far less likely to have been used in WWI than older, nicer finished guns.

hairba111 · Jun 2, 2017

Here's my 1918 Black Army original finish. It ain't pretty and never was due to the government telling Colt to bypass some clean-up and polish stages to increase production. I'm just happy it has most of it's finish without much wear. The initials stand for Frank Norman Houston (Jr.), the US Calvary engineer it was issued to. More than one so called "experts" have told me the gun has never been fired. I also have the Mills canvas holster it lived most of it's life in.

GolfR · Jun 2, 2017

hairba111 said:
Here's my 1918 Black Army original finish. It ain't pretty and never was due to the government telling Colt to bypass some clean-up and polish stages to increase production. I'm just happy it has most of it's finish without much wear.

Very nice piece! The one that I have the opportunity to pick up has a much higher gloss and smoother blued finish so you have confirmed that it is reblued.

mawkie · Jun 3, 2017

Nice Black Army, doesn't get much better than that! Thanks for sharing.

boothdoc · Jun 4, 2017

Mine is a 225 number. It is original with the blue worn in many places.

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