20190314 - HB786 JUD Amendments

dblas · Mar 18, 2019

Bertfish said:
I'm glad you're optimistic. Seriously I am. Lot of doom and gloom around myself included. Seems like no matter how logical an argument we produce they hate us and that's all the reason they need to hose us. And smile all the while.

I enjoy being the under dog, and so long as they have not made 3rd reader in the Senate, we still have a chance, no matter how slim it is.

My optimism is born out of what I saw in 2013 as the outcome. We made the Democratic leadership threaten members of their own party to get a bill passed. The Democrats on the joint committee voted in favor of the amended bill back in 2013 under protest and absolutely none of them could look us in the eye after the committee vote.

Hang around long enough and if we can get people to work that hard again, we can have greater success, since currently Maryland House is not occupied by a Democrat (Yes, I know there is some debate on his allegiance, but he won't come across the street and team up with Miller and Bush to threaten members of the Democratic party to pass bills like O'Malley did in 2013).

BTW, the more face to face interaction we have with our Delegates and Senators, the harder it is for those on the fence to lean to the left on a bill.

And finally, when you (or anyone else reading this) hits them with facts, make those facts as personal to you as possible, in how the bill will affect you and your family and the safety thereof.

PowPow · Mar 18, 2019

dblas said:
If the Senate amends the bill in any way, the House will either have to accept the amendments or it goes to joint committee to hammer out the details, and then both houses vote on it one last time.

So, no, not easier. If anything, we have cut into it on the first house, now we have to work to get the Senate to cut into it even more. We need to hit the Senate JPR with all of the facts that we have presented and more, and then hammer our respective Senators to oppose it.

This isn't over by a long shot, we still have day light.

I spoke with Senator West tonight just before they went into session. He seemed to indicate the SB737(LGQL) and SB882(3D/"Ghost) haven't had any work done and was uncertain they would move out of judiciary. I had the honor of telling him to expect the incoming house versions. It sounded like he wasn't all that enthused about the California bill (~like sb882) anymore.

Malleovic · Mar 19, 2019

PowPow said:
He seemed to indicate the SB737(LGQL) and SB882(3D/"Ghost) haven't had any work done and was uncertain they would move out of judiciary

Interesting

Allen65 · Mar 19, 2019

PowPow said:
I spoke with Senator West tonight just before they went into session. He seemed to indicate the SB737(LGQL) and SB882(3D/"Ghost) haven't had any work done and was uncertain they would move out of judiciary. I had the honor of telling him to expect the incoming house versions. It sounded like he wasn't all that enthused about the California bill (~like sb882) anymore.

That raises the question: What happens to a crossfiled bill that passes one house but gets an unfavorable rating from the committee in the other? Is there automatically a floor vote on the crossfile, or, in this case, will it be entirely up to Miller as to whether either bill is voted on?

danb · Mar 19, 2019

Allen65 said:
That raises the question: What happens to a crossfiled bill that passes one house but gets an unfavorable rating from the committee in the other? Is there automatically a floor vote on the crossfile, or, in this case, will it be entirely up to Miller as to whether either bill is voted on?

The Senate versions were not reported unfavorably. Even so, Senate does dot have to send HB786 etc to the judiciary. They can send it to the rules or some other committee to get it to the floor. They will do what it takes to make Bloomberg happy.

They have been able to get bills through the chamber in one day on sine die under the radar. It's not over until over.

jefflac02 · Mar 19, 2019

dblas said:
I enjoy being the under dog, and so long as they have not made 3rd reader in the Senate, we still have a chance, no matter how slim it is.

My optimism is born out of what I saw in 2013 as the outcome. We made the Democratic leadership threaten members of their own party to get a bill passed. The Democrats on the joint committee voted in favor of the amended bill back in 2013 under protest and absolutely none of them could look us in the eye after the committee vote.

Hang around long enough and if we can get people to work that hard again, we can have greater success, since currently Maryland House is not occupied by a Democrat (Yes, I know there is some debate on his allegiance, but he won't come across the street and team up with Miller and Bush to threaten members of the Democratic party to pass bills like O'Malley did in 2013).

BTW, the more face to face interaction we have with our Delegates and Senators, the harder it is for those on the fence to lean to the left on a bill.

And finally, when you (or anyone else reading this) hits them with facts, make those facts as personal to you as possible, in how the bill will affect you and your family and the safety thereof.

Are there specific senators we should be focusing on? Any first term Dems that would be more prone to doubt, than the other died in the wool long termers?

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ironpony · Mar 19, 2019

I want to file a lawsuit against "Schoolhouse Rock"! This is not as simple as they make it seem!

mcbruzdzinski · Mar 19, 2019

Hopefully this version will not pass. It has serious implications for juniors programs operated by several gun clubs. Those programs have firearms that are owned by the club and loaned out to the participating juniors so they can practice. From what I can read in the proposed legislation, this would be forbidden or at a minimum, subject to approval for a 'temporary' transfer.

Malleovic · Mar 19, 2019

danb said:
Even so, Senate does dot have to send HB786 etc to the judiciary.

In this case, both bills (HB740 and HB786) have indeed been referred to Judicial Proceedings on the senate side.

eruby · Mar 19, 2019

ironpony said:
I want to file a lawsuit against "Schoolhouse Rock"! This is not as simple as they make it seem!

Snickering

danb · Mar 19, 2019

mcbruzdzinski said:
Hopefully this version will not pass. It has serious implications for juniors programs operated by several gun clubs. Those programs have firearms that are owned by the club and loaned out to the participating juniors so they can practice. From what I can read in the proposed legislation, this would be forbidden or at a minimum, subject to approval for a 'temporary' transfer.

I don't think that's true. 9(I) exempts clubs etc from the check.

PowPow · Mar 19, 2019

danb said:
I don't think that's true. 9(I) exempts clubs etc from the check.

The club amendment only allows the temporary transfer at the club location (or its range). The transferee could not take the rifle or shotgun home with them and bring it back to the club (or its range). This is something that does impact shooting programs.

mac1_131 · Mar 19, 2019

Malleovic said:
In this case, both bills (HB740 and HB786) have indeed been referred to Judicial Proceedings on the senate side.

Yup they both show in the Senate now so they are moving the house version. Time to start contacting the Senate judiciary members.

Malleovic · Mar 19, 2019

mac1_131 said:
Yup they both show in the Senate now so they are moving the house version. Time to start contacting the Senate judiciary members.

At the very least we need to get it amended in Judicial Proceedings, so that were it to pass in the senate with amendments, it would take another whole vote in the house or a conference committee (I think) since the two versions of the bill would be different. More hurdles=good.

mcbruzdzinski · Mar 19, 2019

PowPow said:
The club amendment only allows the temporary transfer at the club location (or its range). The transferee could not take the rifle or shotgun home with them and bring it back to the club (or its range). This is something that does impact shooting programs.

That is what I thought.

danb · Mar 19, 2019

PowPow said:
The club amendment only allows the temporary transfer at the club location (or its range). The transferee could not take the rifle or shotgun home with them and bring it back to the club (or its range). This is something that does impact shooting programs.

I see. Yes, allowing people to take home rifles or shotguns is a problem.

PowPow · Mar 19, 2019

danb said:
I see. Yes, allowing people to take home rifles or shotguns is a problem.

This must absolutely be an amendment in Senate Judiciary.

fidelity · Mar 19, 2019

PowPow said:
The club amendment only allows the temporary transfer at the club location (or its range). The transferee could not take the rifle or shotgun home with them and bring it back to the club (or its range). This is something that does impact shooting programs.

Any provision for when the team travels for competitions? Temporary transfers at competition sites are allowed too?

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mac1_131 · Mar 19, 2019

PowPow said:
This must absolutely be an amendment in Senate Judiciary.

The whole loan thing needs toning down. The amended language for HB96 for loaning a regulated firearm wasn't too bad. But they don't seem to be moving that bill.

If this passes as is, it will be easier to loan a handgun than a rifle. That may be so you can get your HQL.

Look at the HB96 loan language and put that in this bill.

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mac1_131 · Mar 19, 2019

fidelity said:
Any provision for when the team travels for competitions? Temporary transfers at competition sites are allowed too?

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I don't think there is any such thing as a temporary transfer in the FFL world, so this bill won't work.

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20190314 - HB786 JUD Amendments

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