Suppressor noob Qs - last minute urgency!

I'm looking at scraping together a big wad of cash to get a trust set up and then get some cans before July 12 - how's availability around our IPs (and pricing if possible) for a set of three?

I'd want to get something for .22, one for .45 (/.40/9mm) and one for .223 (or maybe .30, even though the only rifles I'd want to suppress are .22s and a 5.56 AR).

I need to learn everything from how to get my trust set up (see the current special from another IP for a $49 NFA trust special) up to what paperwork and fees go with what devices, and which suppressors can work on what different calibers - so school me on everything!

Thanks, gun buds!

You can shoot .22 out of a .45. And just get a .30 Can if you wanna shoot .223. It will be quieter plus you can shoot 300 blkout thur a 30 can.

Lucky you Engage just posted this for in stock cans which you will need to beat the deadline.

https://www.mdshooters.com/showthread.php?t=194480

Get .30 cal can for .308, .300blk, .223, .22. Get a .45 cal can for .45, 9mm. The difference between a caliber specific can and a .30/45 can is usually 3-5db. If your are only shooting semi/single action most any can will work fine, if you are shooting full auto make sure the can is rated for it. Buy a can with QD mount so you can easily swap between guns.

Ok, I'm going to answer your questions a little out of order.

echo6mike said:

I need to learn everything from how to get my trust set up (see the current special from another IP for a $49 NFA trust special) up to what paperwork and fees go with what devices, and which suppressors can work on what different calibers - so school me on everything!

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For the trust - any of the major online services will work, or you can go to a local lawyer. I have one from 199trust.com that currently sells for $79. (I paid less on sale.) As to how to get it set up, pay them, fill out the forms, and then they'll usually email you the trust documents. Then you take them and get them witnessed and notarized, and you're in business.

For paperwork: if you're talking suppressors that you're buying, you've got the Form 3 and the Form 4. A form 4 is what you use to transfer an NFA item to a consumer. When you buy the suppressor from a dealer, they transfer it to you on a Form 4. There is a $200 transfer tax on the Form 4 for a suppressor. If your dealer has to get the item from a distributor or a manufacturer or another dealer, they have it transferred to them on a Form 3. A Form 3 is tax free, but lately they've been taking 2 or 3 months to approve, which is WAY longer than normal.

So if you're buying from someone who has the item physically in stock, you go to them, do the Form 4, pay the $200, and wait. If they don't have it in stock, they do a Form 3, they wait for that, and then they do a Form 4 to you.

As to what suppressors work where....
Basically, to work on a given host gun, a suppressor needs three things: 1) the bore has to be large enough for that caliber, 2) the suppressor needs to be built to withstand the pressure of that caliber, and 3) the suppressor needs to be rated for the barrel length you want to run it on.

So, you can shoot 9mm or .40 through a .45 pistol suppressor (because the bore is large enough and there aren't any pressure issues) but you wouldn't want to shoot 5.56 through it because a pistol suppressor will generally not be built to withstand the pressure of a rifle round. If you have a .30cal rifle suppressor you can shoot .308 or 5.56 through it, because the bore will be large enough and it can withstand the pressure.

Most people don't like to shoot rimfire through anything but a dedicated rimfire suppressor because rimfire is dirty and will typically deposit a lot of lead residue in the suppressor.

I'm looking at scraping together a big wad of cash to get a trust set up and then get some cans before July 12 - how's availability around our IPs (and pricing if possible) for a set of three?

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You'll likely have to call around, or shop the IP section here. At this point, you basically have two options if you want to get them bought before 41F in July: 1) but locally from someone who has them in stock, or 2) buy from Silencershop.com. This is because Silencershop will file the Form 4 for you before the Form 3 is approved. While this is totally legal, not all dealers are comfortable doing stuff like that so many local dealers won't do it. Silencershop currently has a deal going where if they miss the 41F date for you you get $100.

I'd want to get something for .22, one for .45 (/.40/9mm) and one for .223 (or maybe .30, even though the only rifles I'd want to suppress are .22s and a 5.56 AR).

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For .22, the big two right now are the SilencerCo Spectre II and the Dead Air Mask HD.

For pistols, I would go with a Rugged Obsidian or a SilencerCo Octane .45.

For rifles, do .30 cal. My first choice is the Rugged Surge 7.62, and after that a SilencerCo Omega or Saker 7.62.

Spectre 2, Tirant 45, Phantom 30

Semper Noctem said:

Spectre 2, Tirant 45, Phantom 30

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what he said

Semper Noctem said:

Spectre 2, Tirant 45, Phantom 762 LTA 30

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It's the only one you want IMHO. Zero POI shift so far in two different rifles.

outrider58 said:

It's the only one you want IMHO. Zero POI shift so far in two different rifles.

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Isn't the lta basically the same as the lt but with the spikey end cap?

protegeV said:

Isn't the lta basically the same as the lt but with the spikey end cap?

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They have 8 different "Phantom" 30 cal suppressors. Yes, the one I mention does have the "persuader" end on it. It is the one I am familiar with.

I have 3 questions to determine if I should make the jump now before 41F goes into effect.

If I setup a trust now and use it to initiate a purchase before the July 13 deadline does that mean that I can use the trust to make future purchases without having to meet the 41F requirement of submitting photos and fingerprints?

To simplify the trust setup process now can I just name myself and add others at a later date (after July 13) without them having to submit photos or prints?

Does MD require that a trust be registered or filed with the state?

Thanks for the info.

Go to Duffys. They just posted a large list of cans for sale that are in stock plus their process with a trust is super easy.


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Biff_N said:

If I setup a trust now and use it to initiate a purchase before the July 13 deadline does that mean that I can use the trust to make future purchases without having to meet the 41F requirement of submitting photos and fingerprints?

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No. You can still use the trust, but any transactions where the forms are submitted after July 13th will be processed under the new rules, and require the fingerprint / photo / CLEO Notification.

To simplify the trust setup process now can I just name myself and add others at a later date (after July 13) without them having to submit photos or prints?

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Yes. As long as they are not "responsible persons" when you submit the paperwork (form 1 or form 4 as appropriate) then the ATF has nothing to say about it.

Does MD require that a trust be registered or filed with the state?

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No.


What you can do, if you really want to get in under the old rules, would be to buy a trust from an online source that delivers right away, and list only yourself as both Settlor and Trustee. Then go buy whatever (at this point, either in stock locally or on Silencershop.com ) and later on you can add other people to the trust.

Frak. There's just no way I can spend 2 grand+ on suppressors. Not gonna happen.

Maybe I should set up a trust for the firearms anyway, for ownership and estate planning - $49 from our one IP there, Potomac Gun Trusts, for a "beat the deadline" special, that's hard to beat.

Worth it for general principles? Even if I never get any NFA items to put in it?

Tx...

Get your trust, see an IP an pray what you want is in stock. Or go here:
http://www.silencershop.com/
Type in your zip code an see what "powered" dealers are near you. Buy a can, e-mail, fax or scan your trust. Silencershop starts the form 3 an form 4. This cuts the time down. Plus, they send you the serial number of your new can

I am in the same boat as the OP. For what its worth, I am going with the Octane 45. I can shoot 9mm, 40, 45, as well as subsonic 300 Blk out of it.

USAFRavenR6 said:

I am in the same boat as the OP. For what its worth, I am going with the Octane 45. I can shoot 9mm, 40, 45, as well as subsonic 300 Blk out of it.

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Good idea. I went with a tirant9 for my first pistol can. Now I want a 45. Tried to pull the trigger on a rugged obsidian, but it went out of stock by the time my cc payment cleared

Question: Talking about Phantom's, can a YHM Phantom 5.56 QD flash hider (12X28) be used with a Phantom 30 LT suppressor?
Thanks.

OnTarget said:

Question: Talking about Phantom's, can a YHM Phantom 5.56 QD flash hider (12X28) be used with a Phantom 30 LT suppressor?
Thanks.

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They make one for that- YHM-4302-MB-28A is the common part number. Just be sure what can and thread pitch you are ordering for(ask me how I know). It has a .30 cal aperture and works great on my 5.56. Still, no POI shift.

rbird7282 said:

Go to Duffys. They just posted a large list of cans for sale that are in stock plus their process with a trust is super easy.


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This!

protegeV said:

Good idea. I went with a tirant9 for my first pistol can. Now I want a 45. Tried to pull the trigger on a rugged obsidian, but it went out of stock by the time my cc payment cleared

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I really lucked out. I called Engage this afternoon to see if they have a Octane 45 on hand. Turns out they did, under the SilencerCo SPEQ program, which I qualify for. $639 for a new Octane 45! I am pretty pumped, I didnt think I was going to find the can I wanted in time to get the paperwork in but I lucked out. Now I just need to break the good news to my wife..............