.357 defense round choice?

Kagetsu · Aug 22, 2016

My guns fire bonded 180gr that by all my research show really good expansion.

Pending the "Hillary ammo prevention effort". I would like to gather some rounds for a .357 6" barrel. I'll not be able to test fire it, it's complicated. I was thinking 158gr but it seems, like the 9mm. heavy may not be best. 125, is the other bullet most tested. I'll probably be looking up the old info for the Vietnam tunnel rats. But anything modern would be helpful.

AssMan · Aug 22, 2016

I think Remington still loads the 125gr SJHP.

mopar92 · Aug 22, 2016

.357 125 grain is the "gold standard". Apparently it has the record for most "one shot stops". It was good enough in the early 90's SIG and Federal combined forces to replicate it's performance in a semi auto hence the creation of .357 SIG. Adopted by Secret Service and the Fed Air Marshals for duty use and a scattering of other police agencies.

So long story short go with 125 grain or for a wee bit cheaper go with .38 special +p with a 158 grain LRN the vaunted "FBI Load"

iH8DemLibz · Aug 22, 2016

I'm a firm believer in a slower, heavier, bullet.

More wallop.

ohen cepel · Aug 22, 2016

125 SJHP is the one I go with until I see a lot of data showing it is no longer the best option. That is what SIG created the .357SIG to be and has real world shootings to show it's a 97% or so one shot stopping round.

Not that good 158's or others won't work well. The .357 is putting out a lot of power, challenge is keeping it in the target and not over penetrating.

fidelity · Aug 22, 2016

mopar92 said:
.357 125 grain is the "gold standard". Apparently it has the record for most "one shot stops". ...

Something phenomenal like 96% stopped with one shot. Beat bigger 40 S&W and 45 ACP rounds.

With a 6-inch barrel, the OP is going to get tremendous utility out of a 357 Mag round.

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk

HordesOfKailas · Aug 22, 2016

I have two go-to rounds:
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1...n-hornady-xtp-jacketed-hollow-point-box-of-50

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/8...grain-lead-wide-flat-nose-gas-check-box-of-20

I have a 6" 686+ and these guys are both killer. Obviously harder on the hand than light loads, but the terminal effectiveness can't be overstated and follow up shots are far from impossible. They're dead accurate too. The HPR is the hottest 357Mag load I've ever seen and I love the Hornady XTP. If you like heavier bullets for the caliber, the grizzly are solid too.

alucard0822 · Aug 22, 2016

Heavier bullets tend to cut down on muzzle blast while increasing terminal ballistics, a very good thing in 357mag, the Gold dot loads have a good reputation. Thing is, if you are planning on betting your life on a particular load from a particular gun, you must test it out first, might have some undesireable attribute like excessive blast or poor accuracy, might stick or jam up in your revolver, might just shoot like crap, either way, if you ever have to use it defensively, you need to know what to expect.

jimbobborg · Aug 23, 2016

Here you go https://www.midwayusa.com/product/3...ition-357-magnum-135-grain-flexlock-box-of-25 On sale, too.

Bisleyfan44 · Aug 24, 2016

Check your local WalMarts too. The Salisbury store recently had the Rem 125gr SJHP 100 ct. boxes of 357s marked on clearance for $30. Yes, $30/100 !! Needless to say, I bought all they had. Loud load, but very accurate.

Bluemax · Aug 24, 2016

The best part about the .357 in the 125gr load at around 1450fps is it causes damage similar to a rifle round. it exceeds the elastic property of most skin and meaty parts unlike big and slow bullets. I love my .45's but trust my .357!

jimbobborg · Aug 24, 2016

Bluemax said:
The best part about the .357 in the 125gr load at around 1450fps is it causes damage similar to a rifle round. it exceeds the elastic property of most skin and meaty parts unlike big and slow bullets. I love my .45's but trust my .357!

So a 135gr JHP going 1608 fps would be even better? https://www.underwoodammo.com/10mm-auto-135-grain-jacketed-hollow-point/ Not quite as fast, but with a 165gr JHP at 1400 fps https://www.underwoodammo.com/10mm-auto-165-grain-bonded-jacketed-hollow-point/

Kman · Aug 24, 2016

I haven't thought about my .357's for defense in a while.

Seems to me I liked Winchester Silvertips for that role. Can't remember if they were 125 or 145.

Don't even know if they are still produced.

alucard0822 · Aug 24, 2016

Bluemax said:
The best part about the .357 in the 125gr load at around 1450fps is it causes damage similar to a rifle round. it exceeds the elastic property of most skin and meaty parts unlike big and slow bullets. I love my .45's but trust my .357!

No, as with most any handgun round tearing from hydrostatic shock is supremely over-rated in most tissues. Around 15% greater velocity than 9MM doesn't bestow magical properties, although with proper design is can allow more force to expand or penetrate greater, increasing the volume of damaged tissue. Big difference compared to service rifle rounds twice as fast with several times the energy, and even then many tissues are tough enough to spring back with surprisingly little damage from a temporary cavity stretch. It takes that much power to maintain sufficient velocity all the way to vital organs that can be damaged easier than muscle and fat. The fact that service caliber autos have a few times the capacity pretty much ended much of the ballistic development of revolvers, so there are very few modern loads tailored to it, most either use hunting bullets that expand little and penetrate far more than necessary, or bullets desinged for slower calibers that tend to over-expand or fragment, then there are relatively ancient designs like the "FBI load" and SWCHP that have been obsolete for decades.

Bluemax · Aug 24, 2016

I concur that no handgun is a good fight stopper, the coroner relayed when he examined those shot with the .357 it was similar to damage caused buy rifle rounds, most other pistol hits didn't cause as much tearing. My personal choice is 7.62x51!

POP57 · Aug 24, 2016

Found this to be interesting reading touting the 38 special as a SD round with less recoil.

http://www.activeresponsetraining.net/the-best-38-special-defensive-ammunition

Blacksmith101 · Aug 25, 2016

There are a lot of choices so I looked in Ammo & Ballistics 4 by Bob Forker to see what the possibilities are. The book lists 64 different commercial loads for the .357 Magnum so here is a summery, the Velocity in Feet Per Second and Energy in Foot Pounds are measured at the muzzle and the KO number is the Taylor Knock Out Index.

Of all listed, not necessarily in the same round:

The maximum velocity was 1600 FPS.
The lowest velocity was 800 FPS.

The maximum energy was 835 FP.
The lowest energy listed was 225 FP.

The highest KO was 12.4.
The lowest listed 5.5.

As has been pointed out the most common loads are the 125 gr and the 158 gr so the numbers for those are:

For 125 gr
The "standard" or most common loads were.
Velocity 1450 FPS
Energy 583 FP
KO 9.2

The lowest power 125 gr load was. Remington 125 gr Golden Saber (GS357MA)
Velocity 1220 FPS
Energy 413 FP
KO 7.8

Two loads tied for most powerful were.
Black Hills 125 gr JHP Gold Dot (9M357N2)
Hornady 125 gr JHP/XTP (90502)
Velocity 1500 FPS
Energy 625 FP
KO 9.5

For 158 gr
The "standard" or most common loads were.
Velocity 1235 FPS
Energy 535 FP
KO 9.9

The lowest power 158 gr load was. Magtech 158 gr LFN (357L)
Velocity 1085 FPS
Energy 413 FP
KO 8.7

The most powerful 158 gr load was.
Aguila 158 gr Semi Jacketed HP (1E572821)
Velocity 1545 FPS
Energy 835 FP
KO 12.4

Of course the most important factor is always bullet placement so choose the most effective round you can accurately shoot in your gun. Always try it yourself in your equipment and practice practice practice.

The numbers for Cor-Bon 180 gr Bonded-Core SP (HT357180BC/20) for comparison.
Velocity 1200 FPS
Energy 576 FP
KO 11.0

Cold Steel · Aug 26, 2016

Heavier bullets are better if you're defending yourself against bears or other large, heavy predators. For humans, the 125gr JHP has the best reputation and Massad Ayoob says it's better that most specialized ammo. If it connects, it has a tendency to rip asunder with extreme enthusiasm, but its noise and recoil are equally enthusiastic. The 110gr JHP also is vicious, but tends to come apart in thick clothing. Some people like the 140gr JHP, but the 158gr JHP just doesn't tend to stop humans very well. It penetrates excessively and the recoil makes recovery very difficult. Years ago, I read of a case where a guy with a .45 was able to take out two cops who were shooting 158gr JHPs. Although recoil is sharp with 125gr bullets, recovery is more rapid, but flash can exacerbate things. But the round may well outclass even the .44 Magnum in stopping power in humans, as most of its energy is dumped outside of the body. The 125gr JHP tends to stay in the body and dumps all of its considerable energy even in extremities.

pop-gunner · Aug 27, 2016

mopar92 said:
So long story short go with 125 grain or for a wee bit cheaper go with .38 special +p with a 158 grain LRN the vaunted "FBI Load"

I think you mean LSWCHP.
LRN would not do much more than punch a .357 hole.
LSWCHP in a +P was used for years by the FBI and is a proven cartridge.

Biggfoot44 · Aug 27, 2016

To put post #17 into context, in the case of the .357 mag , fastest or most energy doesn't necessarily indicate a more desireable loading.

For many shooters, and particularly we ith small frame guns, controlablity is very important and desireable . A "weak" .357 is still plenty powerful compared to other defensive cals.

That Golden Sabre 125 fills an important niche in the * what is better than a .38 +P, but not much more recoil* catagory.

For the OP's inquiry for somthing cheap enough to stack deep just in case : Either the bulk pack Rem 125 , or WWB 110 , depending on recoil preferences.

And for the people with religous - like belief in heavy for cal bullets in every cal, no matter what - The Win Silvertip 145 .Actually a decent choice on purpose, if your threat profile includes equal likelyhood of large angry animals as 2 legged predators.

.357 defense round choice?

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