U.S. appeals court: Constitution gives right to carry gun in public

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  • MindTheGAP

    Active Member
    Jan 4, 2018
    574
    Maryland
    U.S. appeals court: Constitution gives right to carry gun in public

    Excerpt:

    A federal appeals court ruled on Tuesday that the U.S. Constitution’s Second Amendment protects a right to openly carry a gun in public for self-defense, rejecting a claim by Hawaii officials that the right only applies to guns kept at home.

    The extent of the right to gun ownership protected by the Second Amendment is one of the most hotly contested debates in the United States, where life has been punctuated by a steady stream of mass shootings.

    The ruling issued by a three-judge panel on the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals, based in San Francisco, came a year after the U.S. Supreme Court declined to rule either way on the carrying of guns in public.

    Two of the three 9th Circuit judges voted to reverse a decision by the U.S. District Court in Hawaii that state officials did not infringe on the rights of George Young, the plaintiff, in twice denying him a permit to carry a gun outside.

    //

    So, what do we all think this means in the grand scheme of things? This, coming from the 9th, is a highly, highly unexpected ruling, and I'm curious if the effects will be far-reaching or largely unnoticed / superseded by state laws.

    Would love someone more educated on these matters than myself (looking at you, MSI guys) to comment.
     

    pcfixer

    Ultimate Member
    May 24, 2009
    5,953
    Marylandstan
    Woollard v. Gallagher

    By the same logic, allowing Respondents to determine whether bearing arms “is necessary as a reasonable precaution against apprehended danger,
    ” Md. Code Ann., Pub. Safety § 5-306(a)(5)(ii), is not the same as allowing Woollard to decide whether to carry a handgun to advance his personal
    – constitutional – self-defense interest. Nor is limiting the “mode and manner” of bearing arms,



    http://www.scotusblog.com/case-files/cases/woollard-v-gallagher-2/

    https://www.marylandshallissue.org/jmain/counselor-s-corner Wear and Carry Permit lawsuit
     

    press1280

    Ultimate Member
    Jun 11, 2010
    7,911
    WV
    Chances this doesn't get reversed via En Banc? Can we go lower than 0?

    Tough to say. I'm sure the Libs on the 9th want to but it's going to be a big reach to say the Hawaii law is simply a regulation when they don't issue permits to anyone except security guards.
    The dissent here was pretty much destroyed by the majority opinion.
     

    rockstarr

    Major Deplorable
    Feb 25, 2013
    4,592
    The Bolshevik Lands
    this decision should have liberals worried for sure. Its either they bend over and take this one for Hawaii or they get ballsy and take a chance on the SCOTUS taking it on and making it law of the land.
     

    esqappellate

    President, MSI
    Feb 12, 2012
    7,408
    this decision should have liberals worried for sure. Its either they bend over and take this one for Hawaii or they get ballsy and take a chance on the SCOTUS taking it on and making it law of the land.

    That's what I like about Young. It calls the 9th Circuit's bluff after Peruta, where the court said en banc there is no right to concealed carry but pointedly said as well that they were not reaching open carry. Hawaii is stuck on the reality that they don't issue any sort of permits to anyone, thus imposing a complete ban ala the Illinois law struck down in Moore. So, given that, Hawaii has to take the tack they took in district court, viz, that there is no 2A right at all outside the home. That's a stark argument and an ideal case for the SCT on that narrow question. So, I am rooting for Hawaii to take this to the SCT. They will probably ask for en banc as well, and then the onus is on the 9th circuit on whether to rule that there is no right at all outside the home. That will make them uncomfortable. Maybe. Or maybe not. But it does put the question to them starkly of whether the 9th circuit have any intellectual honesty after Peruta. The cynics will say "NO!" emphatically. And they may well be right. We shall see.
     

    rockstarr

    Major Deplorable
    Feb 25, 2013
    4,592
    The Bolshevik Lands
    That's what I like about Young. It calls the 9th Circuit's bluff after Peruta, where the court said en banc there is no right to concealed carry but pointedly said as well that they were not reaching open carry. Hawaii is stuck on the reality that they don't issue any sort of permits to anyone, thus imposing a complete ban ala the Illinois law struck down in Moore. So, given that, Hawaii has to take the tack they took in district court, viz, that there is no 2A right at all outside the home. That's a stark argument and an ideal case for the SCT on that narrow question. So, I am rooting for Hawaii to take this to the SCT. They will probably ask for en banc as well, and then the onus is on the 9th circuit on whether to rule that there is no right at all outside the home. That will make them uncomfortable. Maybe. Or maybe not. But it does put the question to them starkly of whether the 9th circuit have any intellectual honesty after Peruta. The cynics will say "NO!" emphatically. And they may well be right. We shall see.

    yup, my question is how long will it take before we find out Hawaii's course of action. ( I wonder, not asking you )
     

    esqappellate

    President, MSI
    Feb 12, 2012
    7,408
    yup, my question is how long will it take before we find out Hawaii's course of action. ( I wonder, not asking you )

    They just requested an extension of 30 day time to file a petition for en banc review. That doesn't mean they will file, but clearly they are considering it.
     

    Peaceful John

    Active Member
    May 31, 2011
    239
    So, I am rooting for Hawaii to take this to the SCT. They will probably ask for en banc as well, and then the onus is on the 9th circuit on whether to rule that there is no right at all outside the home.

    If there is a way for the 9th to untwist their knickers on this one, I don't see it. If that is accurate, then their best remaining alternative is to deny en banc and passively watch the future unfold.
     
    Last edited:

    GlocksAndPatriots

    Banned
    BANNED!!!
    Aug 29, 2016
    763
    That's what I like about Young. It calls the 9th Circuit's bluff after Peruta, where the court said en banc there is no right to concealed carry but pointedly said as well that they were not reaching open carry. Hawaii is stuck on the reality that they don't issue any sort of permits to anyone, thus imposing a complete ban ala the Illinois law struck down in Moore. So, given that, Hawaii has to take the tack they took in district court, viz, that there is no 2A right at all outside the home. That's a stark argument and an ideal case for the SCT on that narrow question. So, I am rooting for Hawaii to take this to the SCT. They will probably ask for en banc as well, and then the onus is on the 9th circuit on whether to rule that there is no right at all outside the home. That will make them uncomfortable. Maybe. Or maybe not. But it does put the question to them starkly of whether the 9th circuit have any intellectual honesty after Peruta. The cynics will say "NO!" emphatically. And they may well be right. We shall see.

    Assuming they don't file an appeal, I assume a separate action would have to be brought in a District Court in California that the current regime doesn't comply with the new 9th Circuit decision, and start all over?
     

    krucam

    Ultimate Member
    Assuming they don't file an appeal, I assume a separate action would have to be brought in a District Court in California that the current regime doesn't comply with the new 9th Circuit decision, and start all over?

    The Nichols case in CA has been fully briefed at CA9. It is probably going stay that way while Young shakes out. Nichols is a pure open carry case.
     

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