Wrenn PI Granted (DC Shall Issue)

LostinNJ · Jul 26, 2017

Best Hope

Considering my extreme pessimism on this issue, I'm assuming the Circuit will indeed hear it en banc and reverse. I'm just hoping this takes over a year and that Kennedy will retire at the end of next term. (He has reportedly told clerk applicants that he may retire then. Hurry, please.) And then the USSC finally grants cert with a Gorsuch-like replacement for Kennedy.

DC-W · Jul 26, 2017

LostinNJ said:
Considering my extreme pessimism on this issue, I'm assuming the Circuit will indeed hear it en banc and reverse. I'm just hoping this takes over a year and that Kennedy will retire at the end of next term. (He has reportedly told clerk applicants that he may retire then. Hurry, please.) And then the USSC finally grants cert with a Gorsuch-like replacement for Kennedy.

I highly doubt this will be swift. We waited nearly a year for this ruling. Legal fun started 2 years ago now.

fightinbluhen51 · Jul 26, 2017

esqappellate said:
No, D.C. Has 30 days to file, plus more if extended. Then it is 7 days after that if they don't file. If they file then 7 days after final disposition of the rehearing petition

:tailbetweenlegs:

I completely misread the up thread stuff (gladly defer).

danb · Jul 26, 2017

press1280 said:
I believe Volokh also said as much. Seems the issue of public carry just scares the crap out of the progressives and they will do whatever they can to stop it.

And also, certain Justices appointed by republicans.

Mike OTDP · Jul 26, 2017

LostinNJ said:
Considering my extreme pessimism on this issue, I'm assuming the Circuit will indeed hear it en banc and reverse. I'm just hoping this takes over a year and that Kennedy will retire at the end of next term. (He has reportedly told clerk applicants that he may retire then. Hurry, please.) And then the USSC finally grants cert with a Gorsuch-like replacement for Kennedy.

That's not pessimism, that's realism. The courts are bleeding credibility like a stuck pig...and don't seem to realize it.

yellowfin · Jul 26, 2017

press1280 said:
I believe Volokh also said as much. Seems the issue of public carry just scares the crap out of the progressives and they will do whatever they can to stop it.

It kills their entire worldview: completely opposite of dependence on government, makes imperative individual responsibility and morality, reinforces the traditional value of protecting one's family (i.e. strong parental duty and role model) and property, insistence on Constitutional rights, firearms use emphasizes individual virtue (diligence, self control, self reliance, discipline) and so on. Being a regularly armed citizen virtually immunizes a person against all of the utterly worthless bull**** the communists that call themselves "progressives" claim to believe and attempt to foist upon us. We have no need of a nanny state or police state.

Precisely why we need to win this completely and permanently. It is an essential step so we can wipe their idiocy completely off the ideological and political landscape.

shacklefordbanks · Jul 26, 2017

I'm wondering if the other may-issue states are lobbying DC not to appeal. Chicago and others lobbied DC not to appeal Heller because they where worried how SCOTUS would rule and effect them. The stakes are high. If this winds up before SCOTUS with or without another Trump appointee, anything could happen and I'm sure many of the other may-issue states don't want to take that chance. It's an amazingly strong opinion that doesn't leave a lot of wiggle room and could set a very strong precedent.

Note: DC ignored all the other states concerns about Heller and appealed to SCOTUS. And the rest was history.

kcbrown · Jul 26, 2017

Mike OTDP said:
That's not pessimism, that's realism. The courts are bleeding credibility like a stuck pig...and don't seem to realize it.

That's because they don't have to care, and they know it. As long as the government wields life and death power over the citizenry (see what happens when you go the distance in resisting arrest if you don't believe me), they can do anything they want.

The point in time where the government believes itself to be superior to the people under whose consent it governs is, particularly when it has stopped respecting the right of the people to keep and bear arms, is the time that the need for exercise of said right is imminent.

wolfwood · Jul 27, 2017

kcbrown said:
That's because they don't have to care, and they know it. As long as the government wields life and death power over the citizenry (see what happens when you go the distance in resisting arrest if you don't believe me), they can do anything they want.

The point in time where the government believes itself to be superior to the people under whose consent it governs is, particularly when it has stopped respecting the right of the people to keep and bear arms, is the time that the need for exercise of said right is imminent.

That is why patriots need to prepared to take up arms against the government at all times. I believe within our lifetimes we will need to take up arms as a people again or left are society fall a part like France Sweden and Germany are as part of a globalist plot to destroy our culture to create a new ebed people. Private firearm ownership is the only reason America has yet to go the way of Europe.

press1280 · Jul 27, 2017

shacklefordbanks said:
I'm wondering if the other may-issue states are lobbying DC not to appeal. Chicago and others lobbied DC not to appeal Heller because they where worried how SCOTUS would rule and effect them. The stakes are high. If this winds up before SCOTUS with or without another Trump appointee, anything could happen and I'm sure many of the other may-issue states don't want to take that chance. It's an amazingly strong opinion that doesn't leave a lot of wiggle room and could set a very strong precedent.

Note: DC ignored all the other states concerns about Heller and appealed to SCOTUS. And the rest was history.

They might just do that (en banc is a free shot for DC so no reason not to appeal other than taxpayer waste, which they don't care about anyway).
At the same time though, the may-issue question would be decided in all circuits that have may-issue except CA1, so the issue should be decided at SCOTUS sooner or later. I just don't see this as a split that's tenable for very long.

Peaceful John · Jul 27, 2017

wolfwood said:
That is why patriots need to prepared to take up arms against the government at all times. I believe within our lifetimes we will need to take up arms as a people again or left are society fall a part like France Sweden and Germany are as part of a globalist plot to destroy our culture to create a new ebed people. Private firearm ownership is the only reason America has yet to go the way of Europe.

With respect, most of my gun-friends in non-permissive states take the position "I can't legally carry, so I won't!"

A man that won't carry in violation of the law will be very slow to revolt in violation of the law.

If that's the case, we are left in the curious situation of requiring legal carry to (hypothetically) commit an illegal act.

That irony, Wolfwood, is one reason I very much appreciate what you and others like you are doing in court.

Maestro Pistolero · Jul 27, 2017

Your points are well taken, Wolfwood, but I would quibble a bit that "Private firearm ownership is the only reason America has yet to go the way of Europe." (emphasis mine)

It is a powerful deterrent. . . a tyranny antidote, to be sure. But the constitution, even to the diminishing degree to which courts may adhere to it; the three-tiered system of checks and balances; America's revolutionary heritage continuing with the fiercely independent Western pioneers all contribute to America's sense of itself as the torch bearer for liberty, independence and self-reliance. We are a different breed and the world knows it. Ask any NATO soldier who (besides one of his own countrymen) he/she would most like to be fighting alongside when the SHTF.

Natural selection and the attraction of like-minded souls during the last 300 years or so has left a unique and diverse group and culture in its wake. Despite the tortured, desperate attempts by the far left to repaint the masterpiece, I don't believe we are a people readily adaptable to European ideas of government.

jbrown50 · Jul 27, 2017

Peaceful John said:
With respect, most of my gun-friends in non-permissive states take the position "I can't legally carry, so I won't!"

Why would you think that they would admit doing so even if they did?

Schipperke · Jul 27, 2017

swinokur said:
why? this is far from over. gloating is bad ju ju.

Approves of message..

yellowfin · Jul 27, 2017

motorcoachdoug said:
Say that DC does not file for En Banc or Cert and lets it become law of the land. Is their any way we can then use this here in MD for a court case?

It doesn't become law of the land in its entirety, it still only applies to DC.

yellowfin · Jul 27, 2017

GlocksAndPatriots said:
It's rare in all circuits, but you're assuming a certain level of good faith. The left has shown it's willing to act in bad faith on this particular issue.

And it's about damned time we stop letting what the left wants and are willing to do determine this issue or anything. Their blight upon our legal system and the minds and souls of our people has gone on far too long--ten minutes being too long let alone any span of years--and it is beneath us to even tolerate it let alone bow to it as so many have.

HaveBlue · Aug 1, 2017

Have there been any filings yet? 30 day extension?

I have a link for the Wren case on Archive.org. It's not showing any of the filings from the appeal.

DC-W · Aug 1, 2017

HaveBlue said:
Have there been any filings yet? 30 day extension?

I have a link for the Wren case on Archive.org. It's not showing any of the filings from the appeal.

If my math is correct, they have another 22 days to figure out what they want to do.

press1280 · Aug 1, 2017

DC-W said:
If my math is correct, they have another 22 days to figure out what they want to do.

Expect them to take the entire time left and submit for en banc 1 minute before the courthouse closes on the last possible day (and may even ask for an extension!)

motorcoachdoug · Aug 1, 2017

ah so when is the 7 days up then we can submit paperwork to MPD and has anyone done so yet?

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