MSP Question

Mooseman · Mar 29, 2014

I was curious about whether or not MSP knows about legal long gun purchases I have made out of state. I assume that they have no knowledge about these purchases, but I am not sure. Does anyone know for sure if the MSP has access to purchase records that I have made out of state? Thanks

frdfandc · Mar 29, 2014

Those records are held by the out of state FFL's and the FBI.

So unless the MSP has a way of infiltrating FBI's records or seizing the records from the out of state FFL, then no, they have no access to your purchases. The only way would be via a Judge's order.

coopermania · Mar 29, 2014

I can't see how MSP could get copy's of your 4473's from out of state.
They would need Md state search warrants and or subpoenas to each gun store in Pa, And then they would have to have those search warrant and or subpoenas validated in each jurisdiction by the Pa court. It would be a huge process for the State of Maryland to go through. IMHO

britishjohnhall · Mar 29, 2014

So does that mean that the FBI has a record of every firearm I have bought through the NICS system? (serial #'s etc?). Or does it mean the FBI would only have a record of the sale if they requested the information from the FFL?

aireyc · Mar 30, 2014

britishjohnhall said:
So does that mean that the FBI has a record of every firearm I have bought through the NICS system? (serial #'s etc?). Or does it mean the FBI would only have a record of the sale if they requested the information from the FFL?

Probably the former, legally should be the latter.

1time · Mar 30, 2014

As far as I know there is no way of finding out what an individual has purchased using their name. They can do a trace on a specific firearm to find out who purchased it from the end FFL.

swinokur · Mar 30, 2014

The only record should be the 4473.

yeah right.

dblas · Mar 30, 2014

frdfandc said:
Those records are held by the out of state FFL's and the BATFE.

So unless the MSP has a way of infiltrating BATFE's records or seizing the records from the out of state FFL, then no, they have no access to your purchases. The only way would be via a Judge's order.

Fixed it for you.

swinokur · Mar 30, 2014

I thought the 4473 stayed with the FFL until he goes out of business, then forms are sent to BATFE.

dblas · Mar 30, 2014

britishjohnhall said:
So does that mean that the FBI has a record of every firearm I have bought through the NICS system? (serial #'s etc?). Or does it mean the FBI would only have a record of the sale if they requested the information from the FFL?

The FBI has no records of any firearms sales. The NICS checks do not include any firearm information, they are a background check on a person.

So the 2nd would be the case, but they would need a search warrant to do so.

dblas · Mar 30, 2014

swinokur said:
I thought the 4473 stayed with the FFL until he goes out of business, then forms are sent to BATFE.

You are correct, I edited my comment.

frdfandc · Mar 30, 2014

dblas said:
Fixed it for you.

Thank you sir!!!!

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk

Blaster229 · Mar 30, 2014

But the FBI or anyone else would not know that you sold that rifle or lost it in a boating accident.

Mooseman · Mar 30, 2014

Thanks for the answers.

marte616 · Mar 30, 2014

BTW, doesn't BATFE gets notification from FFLs when a customer engages in multiple (more than one) firearms in the same transaction? Only then, BATFE would get the 4473's "real time", and not upon retirement / license forfeiture of the FFL.

And yes, I have heard the FFLs call NICS on multiple times when purchasing a weapon, and they say only "long gun or handgun" when asked by the operator doing the checks. But since the NICS check confirmation number is written on the 4473, which already has the S/N of the firearm you just purchased, it could be cross-referenced, correct, even if after the fact?

dblas · Mar 30, 2014

marte616 said:
BTW, doesn't BATFE gets notification from FFLs when a customer engages in multiple (more than one) firearms in the same transaction? Only then, BATFE would get the 4473's "real time", and not upon retirement / license forfeiture of the FFL.

And yes, I have heard the FFLs call NICS on multiple times when purchasing a weapon, and they say only "long gun or handgun" when asked by the operator doing the checks. But since the NICS check confirmation number is written on the 4473, which already has the S/N of the firearm you just purchased, it could be cross-referenced, correct, even if after the fact?

Multiple firearms purchases are done on a 3310.4 when to or more pistols or handguns, or a combination of pistols and handguns of two or more.

What could be cross referenced, the firearm purchase? All the NICS check has is Name and SSN, no firearms info, so how would the FBI use that for a cross reference?

NICS checks are only kept for 90 days I believe, and after that are scrubbed from the system unless they are part of an investigation.

John from MD · Mar 30, 2014

As far as I remember, NICS checks must be purged prior to the next starting business day.

This info may be found on the FBI FAQ page.

Regards,

John

Ab_Normal · Mar 30, 2014

There's no record... :lol2:

YEAH RIGHT!! :lol2:

Ab_Normal · Mar 30, 2014

John from MD said:
As far as I remember, NICS checks must be purged prior to the next starting business day.

This info may be found on the FBI FAQ page.

Regards,

John

Sure but who says they empty their trash folder/bin? :rolleyes:

Mark75H · Mar 30, 2014

John from MD said:
As far as I remember, NICS checks must be purged prior to the next starting business day.

This info may be found on the FBI FAQ page.

Regards,

John

Ab_Normal said:
Sure but who says they empty their trash folder/bin?

As if NSA isn't spying on FBI ... yeah, right ... bridge for sale in NYC - will post it in not firearms related

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