Long distance shots

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    EL1227

    EL1227

    R.I.P.
    Patriot Picket
    Nov 14, 2010
    20,274

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    dontpanic

    dontpanic

    Ultimate Member
    Jul 7, 2013
    6,635
    Timonium
    That's 2.14 miles for those of us that are metrically challenged.

    The Canadians must have an incredible program to have 3 of the top 5 spots. I wonder if they are all the same guy?
     
    C

    Clif

    Member
    Dec 3, 2012
    56
    I would think they could take several Hail Mary shots. The target might not even notice.
     
    smokey

    smokey

    2A TEACHER
    Jan 31, 2008
    31,506
    :toothlessThey're just not as sneaky as our 'murican snipers, so they shoot from further out. ;-)
     
    1

    1time

    Ultimate Member
    Apr 26, 2009
    2,279
    Baltimore, Md
    Realistically, what good is that doing? If they are doing over watch and protecting troops on the ground, how many good guys could that bad guy shoot in the 10 seconds of flight time of the snipers bullet. Forget about the calculations where a measuring distance 1 meter short means the shot is in front of the target and a 1 long the impact is behind the target. Forget that the target is probably going to move in 10 seconds. From trigger press to impact that is 2 to 3 mags a target could unleash. It is impressive but being closer the the guys you are trying to protect or calling in artillery or an airstrike on an enemy position would seem to be more effective.
     
    1

    1time

    Ultimate Member
    Apr 26, 2009
    2,279
    Baltimore, Md
    I read it. They recognize an attack was happening on Iraqi soldiers and decide to shoot him from over 2 miles away, with a bullet flight time of over 8.5 seconds and account for 9811 inches of drop to hit a single bad guy with a bullet travelling around 880 fps. I'm pointing out that there are far more effective ways to fight a war or even provide cover for troops 2 miles away. If my rear needs a bail out I wouldn't feel very comfortable coming 2 miles away from a shoulder fired weapon.

    It reeks of trying to set a record instead of accomplishing a mission.
     
    Biggfoot44

    Biggfoot44

    Ultimate Member
    Aug 2, 2009
    33,159
    With laser rangefinder, and handheld ballistic computers , computing the trajectory is the "easy" part. At least with the BC carefully derived from actual measurement of the specific ammo.

    In terms of pure precision, 0.5 MOA at that distance would represent a target of 18-19 inches . That could represent the width of a well fed Afgan. Top level 1,000yd benchrest shooters sometimes do sub 5inch groups at 1,000yd . The TAC-50 is claimed to be 0.5moa with suitable ammo . And the Canadian issue Schmidt & Bender 5-25 would be capable .So conceeding the Canadian Forces solider to be world class bench shooter, with ideal shooting position, using handloaded ammo, and everything going just right in squeezing off the shot, the precision would be just possible, with zero margin of error.

    BUT at those distances external conditions are much bigger factors that the mechanical precision of gun and shooter. Even very modest cross winds, updrafts and downdrafts could cause 10's of yards of bullet drift. Reading conditions is an important skill of snipers, but 3,450m accross or into an Afgan valley will have multiple wind effects, with different vectors, and constantly changing. No matter how good at estimating conditions, they will change from second to second.

    And finally, the time of flight is an eternity in a combat situation. The intended target could well move or change positions in the meanwhile .

    I believe them the shot happened, and the sniper team is undoubtedly highly skilled. But the shot is inherently very low probability, and involves a lot of random luck. Not a slam on the Canadian Soldiers, but no amount of skill and professionalism can change the laws of physics.
     
    M

    Mr Bear

    Ultimate Member
    Jan 17, 2013
    1,077
    Maryland
    dontpanic said:
    That's 2.14 miles for those of us that are metrically challenged.

    The Canadians must have an incredible program to have 3 of the top 5 spots. I wonder if they are all the same guy?
    Click to expand...

    Nope. Last one was by Rob Furlong in 2009. Don't remember the name of the 3rd guy. Most recent sniper's name hasn't been released.
     
    P

    photoracer

    Competition Shooter
    Oct 22, 2010
    3,318
    West Virginia
    1time said:
    I read it. They recognize an attack was happening on Iraqi soldiers and decide to shoot him from over 2 miles away, with a bullet flight time of over 8.5 seconds and account for 9811 inches of drop to hit a single bad guy with a bullet travelling around 880 fps. I'm pointing out that there are far more effective ways to fight a war or even provide cover for troops 2 miles away. If my rear needs a bail out I wouldn't feel very comfortable coming 2 miles away from a shoulder fired weapon.

    It reeks of trying to set a record instead of accomplishing a mission.
    Click to expand...
    True but the part about collateral damage if they used an airstrike reeks of a a very limited choice with their ROE. Or possibly the Canadian leadership is keeping them so far away from the action to try to get zero casualties that they have to engage from distances their targets can't possibly respond to. I would hate to be the local forces they are supporting knowing they will have a delay of 10 seconds even for a single supporting round. That reeks of using them for cannon fodder and then claiming victory in the post analysis.
     
    B

    Benjamin

    Member
    May 30, 2017
    41
    Westminster
    1time said:
    I read it. They recognize an attack was happening on Iraqi soldiers and decide to shoot him from over 2 miles away, with a bullet flight time of over 8.5 seconds and account for 9811 inches of drop to hit a single bad guy with a bullet travelling around 880 fps. I'm pointing out that there are far more effective ways to fight a war or even provide cover for troops 2 miles away. If my rear needs a bail out I wouldn't feel very comfortable coming 2 miles away from a shoulder fired weapon.

    It reeks of trying to set a record instead of accomplishing a mission.
    Click to expand...

    Stop being an armchair commando, and possibly read the article a little more thoroughly. The article clearly states that they are there as an advisory element and are to avoid direct contact. That means they have to stay off the X, which is what they were doing. They were posted up in a position to observe and advise, they saw an opportunity to help the good guys out and they did it.
     
    j_h_smith

    j_h_smith

    Ultimate Member
    Jul 28, 2007
    28,516
    This thread got me to thinking a little bit. If there were a group of bad guys were sitting around having a meal, how difficult would it be for a sniper to take a shot and hit one of them? Doesn't matter which one, just as long as he hits one of them.

    Elevation would then be the only thing the sniper would have to consider. Having a 30 ft wide target is much easier to hit than a single person.

    I'm not saying this is how it went down, but it is a possibility.
     
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