The Trained & Experienced vs. Gun Owners

Boats · Jan 6, 2020

funny thing about rights. training is not required to excercise them.

case in point, the OP excercising his right to free speech despite not having any apparent training to do so.

Rights also have consequences

case in point the OP being flame-sprayed by the forum for his comments.

Alea Jacta Est · Jan 6, 2020

...or quals sufficient to give sh1t to the members who do...and who are very likely to have a lot more than the OP.

Salty is salty. Saying or suggesting you’re salty doesn’t often correlate with actually being salty. Know what I mean?

Could we please speed this up a bit, I’m on the clock for under and I’m fresh out of popcorn and beer. FN salty thing again...

copasetic · Jan 6, 2020

Training is very important to me - as an individual. However, there is no training requirements when one exercises one’s natural rights to speech, self defense, etc. Do I think people should train - absolutely. However, I think one should be able to do exactly what you said (“just buy, load and carrying a firearm”) without the crown’s permission.

Lev928 said:
So training is unimportant to you? You can just buy, load and carrying a firearm to protect yourself and others?

4rcefedmkiv · Jan 6, 2020

Lev928 said:
How does a legal requirement contradict training? No offense intended. Just reiterating my point.

My mistake, i had to re-read the definition of shall issue.

welder516 · Jan 6, 2020

I still am stuck on what the OP really wants , he seems to be beating around my bush . He wants training , but how much training do I need to exercise my God given right . How much training do I need to speak my opinion . Rights I have when I am born .
He really has done a poor job at expressing what he would like to see.

Rich1911 · Jan 6, 2020

Lev928 said:
BTW I still carry one under HR218 (LEOSA). For life. Again, training included. Not being a d*ck ... just a fact.

Just be sure to keep the bullet in your pocket until you absolutely need it...

Lev928 · Jan 6, 2020

Stoveman said:
Dblas was right, this guy is a BUTTER.

I believe in the second amendment BUT....

Maryland should be shall issue BUT......

I believe the average joe should be able to carry a gun BUT he's not like me so he needs more training.

For the love of all that is holy the mods will ban this troll, delete this thread and salt the digital space it occupied.

Then you have no idea of what the responsibility of owning, carrying and using a firearm means. I'm not saying you shouldn't do any of them ... just KNOW what your doing and prove it before you get behind a trigger.

Czechnologist · Jan 6, 2020

Lev928 said:
I'm no puppet. Just nearly lifelong experienced and trained in shooting and carrying. How about you? Pretty sure I've made it clear that I'm a pro-2A and CCW. What's YOUR training and experience with firearms. Tell us all.

Do you really think you're the only one here with those qualifications? LOL You're not.

Your anger and frustration is completely misdirected. Furthermore, I have no idea WTF your point is, scolding us like this? What set you off?

Lev928 · Jan 6, 2020

Rich1911 said:
Just be sure to keep the bullet in your pocket until you absolutely need it...

I do. Both of them. Sometimes two extra mags.

Lev928 · Jan 6, 2020

welder516 said:
I still am stuck on what the OP really wants , he seems to be beating around my bush . He wants training , but how much training do I need to exercise my God given right . How much training do I need to speak my opinion . Rights I have when I am born .
He really has done a poor job at expressing what he would like to see.

A right to speak your opinion won't matter in a court of law. Even God can't help you there.

Occam · Jan 6, 2020

I’ve concluded that there is a significant amount of alcohol involved here.

Rich1911 · Jan 6, 2020

I have a feeling ol' Lev might be thinking about opening up a training center...or was...lol

george g. · Jan 6, 2020

Sounds like Andy took Barneys bullet and now he's mad at us all.

pbharvey · Jan 6, 2020

welder516 said:
He really has done a poor job at expressing what he would like to see.

Lev928 · Jan 6, 2020

copasetic said:
Training is very important to me - as an individual. However, there is no training requirements when one exercises one’s natural rights to speech, self defense, etc. Do I think people should train - absolutely. However, I think one should be able to do exactly what you said (“just buy, load and carrying a firearm”) without the crown’s permission.

I understand what you mean, and I agree to an extent. Do you want someone without comprehensive training (and related laws) to be your backup? To protect you? Your family? Society?

Lev928 · Jan 6, 2020

george g. said:
Sounds like Andy took Barneys bullet and now he's mad at us all.

Andy still has my bullet in the property locker. MDShitters saw to that.

teratos · Jan 6, 2020

Lev928 said:
Then you have no idea of what the responsibility of owning, carrying and using a firearm means. I'm not saying you shouldn't do any of them ... just KNOW what your doing and prove it before you get behind a trigger.

That is not supporting a Right. “Look at meeeee!!! I’m so trained!!!! I’m LEO!!!! Carry for life!!!”

You in your smugness wish to prevent huge swaths of the population from defending themselves. The single mother, or lower middle class father who don’t have the money to buy more than a HiPoint, and certainly don’t have the money for all your prescribed training. Don’t they deserve to defend themselves and their families.

Do me a favor, don’t EVER tell another soul you support the 2A because you don’t. You support guns in the hands of people who have the time and money for some nebulous training regimen and skills testing. It’s a poll tax.

Blow it out your well trained ass.

welder516 · Jan 6, 2020

Lev928 said:
A right to speak your opinion won't matter in a court of law. Even God can't help you there.

God is everywhere , no doubt .

Problem is you assume others as well a I have no clue what is going on . When you make an assumption about a group here at MDS you look foolish .

I don't think you are foolish , just looking that way at the moment .

Many folks here are very knowledgeable on CC and firearms in general , we/I want responsible gun ownership , but I don't own some dumb thugs problem in the City of Balto.
No more then you are a spokesman for me .

Park ranger · Jan 6, 2020

Wondering how many medals the OP has? Distinguished Rifleman or Pistol, shoot in any national matches, international? Every taken small arm firing school from the Army Marksmanship Unit? Marine Corps advanced junior clinic? .....I know someone that's done all of those things.

erwos · Jan 6, 2020

I think it's a very reasonable position to say that you should not carry without training, even if you are legally allowed to do so. There are some reasons that makes sense.

It's when you cross the line into "what training must you have to carry?" that you get epic threads like this, I guess. I am sympathetic to the OP's position, but the following make me ultimately move away from it:
1. Constitutional issues. The right to bear is a thing. It seems clear that the courts have upheld some sort of minimum training requirement, but this is not the same as upholding more extensive training qualifications.
2. The potential to abuse a minimum training and qualification requirement by increasing it to make it de facto impossible for even decent shooters to obtain a license.
3. The fact that we don't really know what the right level of training and qualification even is. If you watch ASP, there's a lot of guys who come out on top in armed conflicts who have had no training at all, and, frankly, do not have very good gun handling skills. Yes, luck is a thing, but I'm hesitant to prevent a bunch of people from carrying over standards which are not really necessary for survival or public safety.

Your heart is in the right place, OP. Competence and skill are things all concealed carriers should want more of, and strive for. But I'm not sure this is the cause I'd spend my time fighting for at this stage of the game.

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