585 HE -- Cases In Production --

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  • hubel585

    Active Member
    Nov 28, 2011
    181
    We've put some of the 585HE bolt guns in composite and Hogue
    stocks, and they are rugged for extreme weather. And they
    don't break under heavy loads. Prices are nice and they have
    aluminum pillars and/or aluminum bedding blocks.
    And with their hollow butts very easy to add weight to take up
    recoil. If lead and epoxy added to a complete fill of the hollow,
    too much weight, so I found a nice cheap substitute.
    We now using rubber coated mouse balls that we have bunch of.
    They are steel with rubber coating, and the right weight.
    They add just the right weight and and wedge in good.
    And won't rattle with coating, and we hold them in tight with
    a piece of dense foam under butt pad.

    hoguebbk.jpg


    We get asked about how much speed potential we have. And
    we start by mentioning cases can hold 190-200 gr of ball powder
    with the bullets loaded out longer. And we have those heavy
    powder loads with 650 gr jacketed bullets, in the Enfield
    pictured I use as one of my test guns.

    585enth.jpg


    And more fun shooting, using a pistol grip on one of the
    585HE falling block test guns. Real heavy loads try to spin us
    around like a weathervane.. Ed

    585tact.jpg
     

    hubel585

    Active Member
    Nov 28, 2011
    181
    A related case to our 585 is the 24ga FH that has 3" chamber and
    brass cases reworked 577NE cases, that we reduce the rim down
    to .720"... the 24ga size rim...We make minimum chamber so that 24ga
    plastic cases, 2.5" long just fit. And min chamber cuts down on a lot
    of brass case expansion, which the wears cases out.

    The barrels are same bore barrels as our 585 and the hollowbase minie
    bullets work great in it, the ones that are .585", 440gr to 540gr.
    Makes hairy 24ga gun for deer, etc. Be useful in shotgun only areas.
    Guys on GB sells the .585" minies. And the brass cases, we don't have
    to wait for them to be made.

    24galoads.jpg


    Here is what 585HE barrel and its monoblock look like before
    screwing the barrel in.This one was 585HE, but process same if
    monoblocking in 24ga FH...Ed

    monostub.jpg
     

    hubel585

    Active Member
    Nov 28, 2011
    181
    Here is picture of 585HE with 24ga FH ...585 the longer one.
    Both use same bullets/slugs, same caliber rifled barrels.
    Different easy usages, 24ga FH is an easy setup in break
    actions and 585HE in bolt actions and falling blocks.

    585-24.jpg


    Picture of non-discarding 585/24ga sabot cup I found that holds
    458 bullets and slugs tight. It had hammerhead type slug in it that
    someone pulled out, and they wouldn't stay in tight after pulled.
    Supposed to be for 20ga, But this sabot was a real loose fit
    in 20ga, though made for 20ga, so I shrunk diameter of bottom rib,
    fits perfect, super tight, in 24ga and 585HE brass cases. A press
    in tight fit gives good resistance for good ignition. real tight fit.

    458sabot24.jpg


    Here is a 24ga/585 discarding sabot that holds .452" 45cal pistol
    bullets. Made by Hornady for 58cal Muzzle loaders..
    With 250 gr bullet in 585HE, hopped up load will go about mach 4.

    452sabot24.jpg


    For ease of getting actions in stocks, I like composites.They are
    strong. come colors, many can be painted with tough finish paints.
    Usually need weight added for big bore use. But not too miuch..
    An easy way to weight plastic stocks with hollow butts, use rubber
    coated computer mouse balls, weight comes out perfect, without being
    too heavy if using that much lead. And coating keeps them quiet, and
    we hold them in, with piece dense foam under butt pad....Ed

    mouse.jpg
     

    hubel585

    Active Member
    Nov 28, 2011
    181
    First AUS buffalo killed by 585HE. By Tankhunter with his Ruger #1.

    If you use closeup on picture, you see loaded round on the buffs hide

    next to the 585HE Ruger #1.... A nice heavy barreled gun..Ed

    tankbuff.jpg



    I put the 585 in a Savage 112, lots of room lengthwise, figuring out an
    extractor is a problem, but then got a look at the savage 212, the 12 ga
    one with big diameter bolt and locking lugs. Its locking lugs are bigger
    than the lugs in a big PH bolt action. So one day will do one
    on a Savage 212, and adjusting extractor to fit no problem...Ed

    ph212lugs.jpg
     

    hubel585

    Active Member
    Nov 28, 2011
    181
    Here is picture of 100 cases loaded with CEB solid nose bullets
    and hollowpoints. This bullet is a turned solid with wide meplat
    or wide hollowpoint. .

    100ceb.jpg


    Here is pic of a Enfield with a jeweled and polished bolt, going
    to be 585HE. In the back, Bolt jeweling and polishing done by the
    great craftsmen, Bob Snapp, years ago.

    585enjewel.jpg


    Picture comparing unfired and fired cases showing our tough cases
    One on the left fired with 650gr at 2400 and base above belt
    didn't hardly expand, Sized the top and reloaded/shot again.
    And AHC will make guns now with our 585HE for any wanting
    super top quality guns.They have some cases to give to guys
    as a sample to show guys the case. Ed

    baseexp585.jpg
     

    hubel585

    Active Member
    Nov 28, 2011
    181
    Bolt actions, falling blocks, break actions.

    Another application for our 585 HE is for guys with the 14.5mm
    PTRDs, to use our case with chamber insert. In many places 14.5
    cases are scarce, real expensive, as well as most 14.5mm cases
    being steel are not the easiest to resize/reload. Our case sizes
    like regular cases and can be easily reloaded many times.

    And in a PTRD with almost a 5 foot long barrel can get 650gr
    spitzer bullet to the same speed the 14.5mm gets a 900 gr using
    3 times as much powder. 3300 fps. Or get a 900gr at 2800.
    Great possibilities for fun shooting. And tactical use in a place
    where it would be useful to reload in the operations field, where
    steel cases are scarce. A 100 cases do over 2000 reloads.

    585-14,5mm.jpg


    I like Enfields to put our 585HEs in, for reasonable cost guns. .
    Here is inexpensive way to fancy up the Enfield Bolt handle by
    cutting the dogleg part of the old handle off and welding on
    inexpensive contoured handles I found, one of which is like
    Ruger 77 handle, one on the right . Something even a novice
    like me can do.....

    enhandle.jpg


    A lot of guys are crazy about CEB bullets. Here are light 450gr
    ones in our 24ga FH. The hollowpoint can range in weight 450gr
    to 700gr.. The 24ga FH is nice complement to our
    585HE for the shotgun only deer hunters... Ed

    24liteceb.jpg
     

    hubel585

    Active Member
    Nov 28, 2011
    181
    Our 585 caliber is modern bolt action continuance of the 577 Nitro Express
    rimmed case, that many big game hunters like. Usuallyset up in double
    rifles. It has an interesting history, from the old 24gasize to 577NE, to
    the 585 Nyati with the picture of Ross Seyfreidshooting one in a Ruger #1
    under recoil knocking his shooting glassesoff, to the Trex of internet fame
    knocking guys over,to our 585HE the strongest yet.The 577NE is an
    offshoot of the 24 gauge caliber, only they went<BR>eventially to brass cases.
    Back in the 1860-70s, starting first with short cases and black powder,
    cases built like shotgun cases, called the 577 Snider, then going to coiled
    brass cases, still with black powder, then on to drawn brass cases, called
    577 BP Express. then to 3" and other longer cases with smokeless. The Snider
    started out with a bulletof .570" diameter and through the progression to
    the 577NE bulletdiameter ended up at .585". This general bore diameter of
    cartridge gunsand muzzle loaders, it is really interesting on how they
    developedand were used by military and then hunters over the years. The
    Snider was necked down to make the 577-450 , a military round used
    all<BR>over the British Empire, by the tens of millions.Bases of both
    24ga and 577NE are about the same.

    Now we have made a 24ga FH, a slight backwards
    regression to earlier times, by taking 577NE brass, and reducing rim diameter
    to 24ga specs. Two minute job. Andstamp the caseheads 24 ga. For
    shotgun upgrading in power and range, It is all about increasing <BR>the power
    in easy to find brass cases, stronger actions, and finding<BR>reasonable price
    rifled barrels. Same barrels we found for 585, work for 24ga. The 577NE brass
    we make 24ga drawn cases from, for example are about a third the cost of
    600NE brass, or getting turned 24ga cases made. We could use 24ga thin cases
    but they are a pain, expand way too much,with slug loads which makes
    resizing without crumpling cases a problem.Info about the power in types
    of guns normally set up with 24ga FH,break actions, bolt shotguns,etc. In
    thin brass 24ga case, 440gr slug goes 1500, with about 2000 ft lbs, that's
    in a 2.5" Magtech brass case.Now using the better, heavier 3" brass we got,
    we can increase speed to 1750 fps increasing energy 50%, going to 2000 fps
    about doubles energy. And going to 2300 which good brass holds ok, in heavy
    barrel gun, gets us near 2 1/2 times the energy. About 37-40,000 psi which
    theactions hold in this smaller diameter case, compared to 12 gauge
    size.So makes relatively smaller bore shotgun, 24ga, with 458WIN
    power..Perfect with Minie bullets. Perfect for deer and hogs, bear,
    etc.Great for slug hunting in shotgun only areas. We mark barrels
    24ga<BR>and cases 24. A decent case that is complimentary to our 585HE....Ed
     

    hubel585

    Active Member
    Nov 28, 2011
    181
    For lightweight plinking, deer hunting, etc, in 585HE as well as 24ga FH
    here is picture of 58cal Hornady sabot that holds .451/.452" light
    bullets 225 to 300 gr. A way to shoot targets economically. Low recoil
    but a big bang and satisfaction. That sabot is one made for ML, but
    with .452" bullet in it is a real tight fit in brass cases, to stay
    in place and give good ignition. A 250 gr bullet would go about
    mach 4 with a top load..

    58hornadyjkt.jpg


    Here is what 585 bull barrel, target blank looks like, 1 5/8" OD and 32" long.
    It'll go in heavy action of some kind. 4th one from the left. The one in yellow
    sleave on top, is a heavy contoured one with muzzle of .980" ..The 5th, 6th,
    7th blanks on bottom are straight 1.375" 585 regular twist blanks.
    One in paper wrapper is slow twist 585 barrel...Ed

    585bull.jpg
     

    hubel585

    Active Member
    Nov 28, 2011
    181
    Mount it on a turret on your pickups light bar.

    Here is picture, nice cast bullet I like for the 585HE and 24ga FH.
    It is .585" diameter and 650 gr and these particular ones are a
    hard lead alloy, plus they've been heatreated. They are about as
    hard as copper jacketed softs. These have a flat base, and
    fairly streamlined..

    585castbul.jpg


    But to penetrate good and do great damage to game or target they
    can be soft lead and hollowbase like Minie Bullets. Here is picture
    of timber drilled through with .585 soft lead Minie from 585HE.
    Picture is the back of 6x6 timbers where Minie bullets came out. Ed

    58calpen.jpg
     

    hubel585

    Active Member
    Nov 28, 2011
    181
    THey have package of a chambered barrel , 100 cases, die set,

    for $750. Here the charge is 200 to put barrel in action, headspace,

    profile. Stock and mag work and sights extra. Need a long action

    and the guys here have a couple extra enfields.

    In Canada there are 3 guys there now setting up 585HEs,
    and one setting up 24ga FH. Another friend setting up a 585HE
    handed out a bunch of cases and info sheets at the SCI convention.
    We are getting some more reamers made. Some more dies sent
    here. Another pallet load of cases coming.

    Here is picture of a light spitzer bullet in the 24ga FH case,
    will work in 585 also. Good for hunting and medium range
    target work.

    24litebarnes.jpg


    Here is picture of 585HE we did in the FBW with regular two
    piece stock.We put a tenon on the forearm to wedge into the
    front of the action below the barrel and a tight barrel band
    on the front. Ed

    fbw2pc.jpg
     

    hubel585

    Active Member
    Nov 28, 2011
    181
    You can get everything from us, no site ready yet, email us

    gunowner@journey.com or PM us on here, either way works.



    Here is comparison of our 585HE and Trex case, and while
    we have barrels of cases and more coming and many available
    in stock in AUS, many are finding Trex cases scarce...

    heandt.jpg


    Here is picture of a neat falling block that could work for our
    585HE with little work, the Wickcliff.


    wic.jpg


    Here is picture of the singlestack mag box we built for Enfields
    fitted to the bottom of BBK action.Very little changing and
    it fits a lot of different actions, as a fixed magazine, with its
    own feed lips,and we load from the top.Ed

    585bbkmag.jpg
     

    embermage

    Active Member
    Sep 20, 2013
    747
    Rising Sun
    So I have a question. Will this barrel work on a Enfield (Savage) No4, Mark 1 receiver?
    If so, I have the action (sporterized before I got the rifle, original barrel was cut down) already. Wondering if anyone has tried one of these adapters http://www.specialinterestarms.com/index.php?page=enfield_accessories along with a Mako recoil reducing stock to tame the recoil? I've ran those stocks on a .50 Beowulf, .458 SOCOM, and a 12 Gauge shotgun, works quite well at taming those recoils down to more comfortable levels. (laugh if you want, .458 SOCOM with a non recoil reducing stock gives me a splitting headache from the recoil)
     

    hubel585

    Active Member
    Nov 28, 2011
    181
    No the Enfields for this is not the SMLEs, they are not long
    enough or big enough diameter bolt,

    But we use the M17 and P14 Enfields with the conventional
    front locking bolt lugs and a real long action ..One is
    pictured in post 21 above, with case in action.Ed

    PS- Nn, as for artillery you could mount it on your pickups light bar.
    Make it into a safari truck.
     

    Jmorrismetal

    Active Member
    Sep 27, 2014
    468
    A 650 at 3000 fps is pretty impressive that's 50 BMG levels of power in rifles that don't weigh much or have muzzle devices to reduce recoil.
     

    embermage

    Active Member
    Sep 20, 2013
    747
    Rising Sun
    No the Enfields for this is not the SMLEs, they are not long
    enough or big enough diameter bolt,

    But we use the M17 and P14 Enfields with the conventional
    front locking bolt lugs and a real long action ..One is
    pictured in post 21 above, with case in action.Ed

    PS- Nn, as for artillery you could mount it on your pickups light bar.
    Make it into a safari truck.

    Guess I am going to have hunt down an M17/P14 then that someone sporterized.
     

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