What guns would you take on an expedition to Alaska?

photoracer · Aug 23, 2017

Like we used to say in Alaska, what do you call a human that tries to kill a brown bear with a handgun, and the answer is lunch. Not only does the handgun have to throw big lead, but you have to be able to hit something with it under fight or flight fear reflex. Its not going to put the bear down instantly no matter what. If I still had one of my .41 Mag guns I would take that loaded with the heaviest bullet available. Otherwise I'd pick something like a Ruger in .480 Ruger. As for a .22 I would not take my 15-22 as they are not accurate enough. Probably my rimfire silhouette Rem 597. As for a rifle something between .300 Win Mag and 375 H&H Magnum would be plenty although my dad shot everything there was to shoot with a 30.06 up there. A shotgun for anything in season like ptarmigan. I carried a .410 for that as a kid but I would prefer something that had decent magnum or express slugs available for it as backup defense gun like a 12ga or 20ga. Bear spray for sure but don't count on it working in all cases.

swinokur · Aug 23, 2017

usa259 · Sep 25, 2017

I've seen some reference to .357 in these post, would .357 Sig cut it or be enough?

lazarus · Sep 25, 2017

I mean, people have killed bears with 9mm. The ideal bear gun is probably a semi auto 12ga with extended mag tube and bernulli slugs or federal copper plated slugs.

If you are talking a handgun, I’d worry .357 sig would get the job done...to ensure my next of kin was getting the bear skull mounted over my coffin.

Watch a few bear attack videos. A grizzly can get up over 30mph and do that in less than 2 seconds. That is over 44 feet per second. Grizzly walks out from behind a tree and it decides to immediately charge, it is tearing you apart in less than 10 seconds. Unless you’ve got something in hand, that gives you 10 seconds to identify the threat, draw, fire as much as you can and also sound the bear enough to stop it. Or better kill it.

The only deer I’ve shot that dropped on the spot was a spine hit. Even with a 12ga slug through the front shoulder a had a button buck manage to hop about 10 yards over 5 or 6 seconds before it dropped and was dead seconds later (fist sized entry “splash” hole, silver dollars exit would).

The others even with double lung hits managed to go anything from 30-75 yards (granted that last one was an arrow).

One thing if you are taking a placid or alerted bear, but one mid charge? I’d want the heaviest thing I could get. Preferably that could fire fast. 10mm would be my starting cartridge. A larger magnum might be preferred. Again, a shotgun to me would be ideal.

Anything is not necessarily better than nothing. A 22lr is probably is likely to piss it off unless you put one square between the eyes. A human you want a minimum of 12” or penetration. A bear you probably more want 24” penetration.

K31 · Sep 25, 2017

The only bear kill I read about with a 9mm was a guide who all but emptied his carry pistol at close range into a bear attacking his customers. I read of a home owner who killed a bear with a 410 shotgun. By basically shoving it up the bears nose before firing it. I've also read about a bear in a National Park who killed a park visitor and when he was hunted and put down had I-forget-how-many slugs embedded in his skull and they believe he was responsible for many more attacks than just that one. Yeah, I want the biggest controllable thing I can carry if I'm going to encounter a bear.

Magnumite · Sep 25, 2017

^^ great post. I don't believe some of the handgun caliber suggestions for bears in this and other threads.

My approach would be a 44 Magnum double action revolver simply because I have one and can shoot fast and proficiently one and two handed. Ammunition would be 240 grain minimum weight soft points or full jacketed silhouette bullets. For bear I would test 275 to 300 grain deep penetrators. To be honest, I would consider purchasing a 454 or 480 caliber Ruger handgun and use very warm loads/handloads.

Rifle would be a Marlin 45-70 lever loaded with warmed up loads.

sailskidrive · Sep 25, 2017

My grand parents were home steaders up there in the 1950s, they had a permanent summer tent camp many miles up river.

My grandfather only carried a Win 270 and a 38 Special revolver. He dropped just about everything Alaska had to offer with that 270.

Magnumite · Sep 25, 2017

^^^ a post to think about. Maybe the '06 Ruger would be adequate after all. More to think about.

730waters · Sep 25, 2017

I would take a 44 mag and a 338 win mag plus pepper spray

eruby · Sep 25, 2017

What guns would Alex Wubbels take on an Alaskan expedition?

Doitsouthstyle · Sep 25, 2017

She could grab anything she wanted from the Salt Like City PD Armoury.

Minuteman · Sep 25, 2017

I'm sticking with 'just' a FN 5.7 and a 20 round magazine, and two 30 round magazines.

The spirit of the question, is not a hunting trip, its covering a lot of ground (in Alaska) in a hurry, so light weight does matter.

Also, the FN 5.7 was developed for the military, in all weather conditions. I know it will function in freezing conditions. In the research I've seen, the best 5.7 bullet is roughly equivalent to the best .45ACP bullet. One uses mass and the other uses speed to achieve essentially the same effectiveness, but the results are very similar. I also like that the 5.7 has a very flat trajectory, you can be very accurate with it out to ~50 yards, and at 100 yards its still screaming fast.

smokey · Sep 25, 2017

Benelli M4 loaded out with brenneke slugs and a converted g21 to .460 rowland loaded heavy and hot. In case of a bear, I'd want to put as many deep penetrating 12 ga slugs on it as I could in a hurry. If I had to use a handgun, a .460 with 13 255 gr hard casts at 1,300 fps would be nice to have.

An alternative to the shotgun would be an ar10 in 6.5 creedmore. Still lots of power, but more capacity and better ability to reach out for game. It would depend on the duration and If the long gun was more geared for defense from bears/moose or for getting of food. If I was there for a long time, the 6.5 creedmore would get the nod, under a month... then the shotgun.

fidelity · Sep 25, 2017

Have a friend in Wisconsin who is an experienced deer hunter and was black bear hunting for the first time earlier this month. He took his 30-06 rifle despite some of the local area black bear hunting guides suggesting a 12 gauge with slugs.

He got one shot at this really big bear (that he'd taken pictures of in the past with game cameras and on that day with his cell - I've seen the pics - shoulder of the bear would reach a kitchen countertop). I wouldn't be surprised if it was in the 400 lb range. He shot at the bear when it was about 30 yards away from his tree stand. He hit him (he saw the hit and there was blood on the ground after the hit), and the beer took off. He and 7 other guys searched for the bear for 8 hrs. He also returned the next day. They couldn't find the bear.

He now regrets not taking the 12-gauge or his compound bow. Obviously a hit on the vitals by a 30-06 (or even a 30-30) would have taken the bear down in time. He said the guides recommended the shotgun because with a high powered rifle at close distances, the shots zip through and don't expand. The slug, on the other hand, in addition to making a bigger hole will stay in and causes a lot of internal destruction.

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traveller · Sep 25, 2017

Minuteman said:
I'm sticking with 'just' a FN 5.7 and a 20 round magazine, and two 30 round magazines.

The spirit of the question, is not a hunting trip, its covering a lot of ground (in Alaska) in a hurry, so light weight does matter.

Also, the FN 5.7 was developed for the military, in all weather conditions. I know it will function in freezing conditions. In the research I've seen, the best 5.7 bullet is roughly equivalent to the best .45ACP bullet. One uses mass and the other uses speed to achieve essentially the same effectiveness, but the results are very similar. I also like that the 5.7 has a very flat trajectory, you can be very accurate with it out to ~50 yards, and at 100 yards its still screaming fast.

Broken record here: Has the effectiveness of this round on brown bears been tested by anyone ?

lazarus · Sep 25, 2017

fidelity said:
Have a friend in Wisconsin who is an experienced deer hunter and was black bear hunting for the first time earlier this month. He took his 30-06 rifle despite some of the local area black bear hunting guides suggesting a 12 gauge with slugs.

He got one shot at this really big bear (that he'd taken pictures of in the past with game cameras and on that day with his cell - I've seen the pics - shoulder of the bear would reach a kitchen countertop). I wouldn't be surprised if it was in the 400 lb range. He shot at the bear when it was about 30 yards away from his tree stand. He hit him (he saw the hit and there was blood on the ground after the hit), and the beer took off. He and 7 other guys searched for the bear for 8 hrs. He also returned the next day. They couldn't find the bear.

He now regrets not taking the 12-gauge or his compound bow. Obviously a hit on the vitals by a 30-06 (or even a 30-30) would have taken the bear down in time. He said the guides recommended the shotgun because with a high powered rifle at close distances, the shots zip through and don't expand. The slug, on the other hand, in addition to making a bigger hole will stay in and causes a lot of internal destruction.

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No. It was just a bad shot. The higher the velocity, the more likely the bullet is to fragment and penetrate too shallowly. Low velocity is likely to result in poor expansion and over penetration.

So either your friend just missed hitting anything vital by a lot or he hit the vital area, but he had a lightly constructed bullet that fragmented upon impact and only penetrated a few inches.

30yds, or even 10, with a .30-06 would be pretty unlikely to cause the bullet to fragment and penetrate too shallowly unless it was a very light bullet construction. So more likely just a bad shot.

fidelity · Sep 25, 2017

The guy also says he missed the vitals and thinks his shot was a little high. I didn't ask what specific round he used, or if he or others he was with saw an impact on the other side of the bear, but I'm assuming they did because it was their description and they're seasoned hunters. I did ask how did he know it wasn't a miss altogether (he felt awful wounding the bear and I was trying to point out maybe it wasn't hit), and he reminded me that there was blood on the ground.

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crolfe1984 · Sep 25, 2017

Holstered a 4" S&W 500 loaded with 500 grain XTP bullets on my recent trip through Glacier National Park. Never needed it, but felt equipped to handle a bad situation. I did practice with this rig a lot through before trekking out. 500 grain rounds aren't cheap to send down range, but well worth it to get accustomed to my wilderness carry gun.

usa259 · Mar 20, 2018

How about the Underwood extreme bullet? Appropriate choice? Other to consider?

CombatAK · Mar 20, 2018

.375 Ruger Guide gun, 10-22 take down, and a Taurus RAGING JUDGE M513.

What guns would you take on an expedition to Alaska?

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