Proposal to allow Straight Wall Pistol Cartridges

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  • ironhead7544

    Active Member
    Oct 27, 2018
    188
    Will the power levels be the same? I did not see anything about that.
     

    John from MD

    American Patriot
    MDS Supporter
    May 12, 2005
    22,726
    Socialist State of Maryland
    The shorter the barrel the less sight radius for cripples/loss and the quicker you can turn the muzzle on yourself or another in an area with close confinement like a cut over or dense brushy areas.


    I think the six inch was an arbitrary figure. The reason I say this follows. If you wanted to ensure less cripples, they could have specified that you must use optics or adjustable sights. Under the law, I can hunt with my 1858 Remington revolver as I can meet the power requirements and the barrel is over six inches. However, it has basic sights which are worse than using my five inch S&W 45 Colt Mountain Gun.

    As for turning a gun on someone, Dick Cheney did it with a 30 inch shotgun. :lol:
     

    danb

    dont be a dumbass
    Feb 24, 2013
    22,704
    google is your friend, I am not.
    Page 9. Straight walled cartridges in rifles and handguns statewide.


    https://dnr.maryland.gov/wildlife/Documents/2020-2022_ProposedHuntingRegs.pdf

    I could be wrong, but I believe the proposal included handgun use in SG zones too. They took it down so I can’t verify.

    so, yeah, it does say pistols. I glossed over that. see link above

    Allow the use of straight-walled cartridges in centerfire rifles and handguns in firearms deer season statewide
     

    Doco Overboard

    Ultimate Member
    I don't exactly remember how popular optics were or what product availability was when I remember starting with a handgun becuase I never paid attention. I do recall alot of rifles still being used with iron sights. I do however remember being instructed for this very same thing from a guy who was shot in the gut by his brother.
    Field experience while handgun hunting in the conditions I just described has proven this to be true in my area.
    Ive also killed a few deer with an 1860 army type revolver. With a full monte load they are less than adequate with a round ball however and I was never really satisfied unless I had those buffalo ball-ets and even they will ricochet off trees and bone loaded till you have to manually turn the cylinder to ensure reliable rotation.
    Never killed any with a OA or Remington which I always wanted to do.
    Nothing will ruin this opportunity faster than injuries reported from the field involving hand guns or the amount of cripples that are observed by homeowners, anti's or other assorted do -gooders where a high frequency exists for public observation of the effect.
    If they knew the same thing regarding archery they would cry foul. Every year I pick up dead heads from that sort of thing and every known shot from the archer or gun hunter for that matter says nearly the same thing. He put his head down and I hit him right in the vitals.
     

    dist1646

    Ultimate Member
    May 1, 2012
    8,758
    Eldersburg
    Hopefully it goes through. In Tennessee, you can use any centerfire handgun so, you could legally use a Colt pocket pistol in .25ACP. Not that I agree with using such a small round. I would like to see the barrel length restriction changed also. The fastest I ever put a deer on the ground was with a 45LC from a Ruger with a 4 5/8" barrel. Dropped like a stone, right in it's tracks.
     

    balttigger

    Ultimate Member
    Oct 15, 2008
    3,051
    Middle River, MD
    I could get on board with this. Already have a PCC in 10mm and 460 Rowland, a Thompson in 460 Mag (45LC, 454 & 460) and am looking at a wildcat in testing that takes a 6.8SPC and necks it straight wall to 10mm (pushing 180gr XTP at 2350 fps+)
     

    Biggfoot44

    Ultimate Member
    Aug 2, 2009
    32,877
    Because when Md first allowed handgun hunting circa 1974 ( yes , I attended a public seminar back when this was first introduced ) there was NOT a different energy requirement for handguns .

    There was a specific exemption for .44magnum with 6 inch or longer . ( The factory ballistics charts of the day listed the standard .44mag factory load at 1100 & something ft lb from " 6in test bbls )

    So essentially " because we've always done it that way " .
     

    Archeryrob

    Undecided on a great many things
    Mar 7, 2013
    3,063
    Washington Co. - Fairplay
    Under the law, I can hunt with my 1858 Remington revolver as I can meet the power requirements and the barrel is over six inches.

    Are you loading it with 40 or more grains of powder as the guide book calls for? From all my shooting that seems like a rather hot load for the revolver cylinder to me. I'm sure 25 grains would seal the deal fine, it is just not legal in MD with a pistol.
     

    Biggfoot44

    Ultimate Member
    Aug 2, 2009
    32,877
    If it comes to that, my Walker holds plenty . But in general I do my handgun hunting in Va
     

    John from MD

    American Patriot
    MDS Supporter
    May 12, 2005
    22,726
    Socialist State of Maryland
    Are you loading it with 40 or more grains of powder as the guide book calls for? From all my shooting that seems like a rather hot load for the revolver cylinder to me. I'm sure 25 grains would seal the deal fine, it is just not legal in MD with a pistol.

    I load with 35 gns of Triple Seven which exceeds the 40 gn blackpowder equivalent requirement.

    Current Uberti 1858 cylinder steel is the same as used in cartridge revolvers.
     

    6Den

    Active Member
    Feb 10, 2013
    835
    Howard County
    I think the six inch was an arbitrary figure. The reason I say this follows. If you wanted to ensure less cripples, they could have specified that you must use optics or adjustable sights. Under the law, I can hunt with my 1858 Remington revolver as I can meet the power requirements and the barrel is over six inches. However, it has basic sights which are worse than using my five inch S&W 45 Colt Mountain Gun.

    As for turning a gun on someone, Dick Cheney did it with a 30 inch shotgun. :lol:
    I’m in total agreement! I would sooner accept a proficiency qualification like they do in Europe, than have these baseless regs to try to save us from ourselves. It’s like the “blood in streets” hysteria with concealed carry. Many states have no minimum barrel length requirements (and CC) without regular reports of people accidentally shooting themselves or others.

    I see this as an opportunity to do away with archaic regs that have little statistical basis. I would dare bet that treestands account for more accidents than short barreled handguns in the field. My 5.5” SBH is hardly a snubbie or “midnight special”. Ironically, it is deemed safe enough to use for bear protection in western MD currently.
     

    Doco Overboard

    Ultimate Member
    Maybe, but more than likely not. Stand right next to them when you do it. Experience is the best teacher. As close to 40 grain equivalency as you can get and a ball -et or conical will seal the deal inside 35yds. Something around 190+g weight. 25 g or less with a rb is a starter load for developing a load chain.

    I'm sure 25 grains would seal the deal fine, it is just not legal in MD with a pistol.
     

    Doco Overboard

    Ultimate Member
    I’m in total agreement! I would sooner accept a proficiency qualification like they do in Europe, than have these baseless regs to try to save us from ourselves. It’s like the “blood in streets” hysteria with concealed carry. Many states have no minimum barrel length requirements (and CC) without regular reports of people accidentally shooting themselves or others.

    I see this as an opportunity to do away with archaic regs that have little statistical basis. I would dare bet that trees tands account for more accidents than short barreled handguns in the field. My 5.5” SBH is hardly a snubbie or “midnight special”. Ironically, it is deemed safe enough to use for bear protection in western MD currently.

    I agree with your analysis regarding tree-stands. Two people fell to their. death near me this year. They're kind of like the smart people who take children out in the bay without a pfd.
    As far as archaic stats I don't know because I do not follow them but one injury or event is enough. I could also care less what they do in Europe because I do not hunt there.

    What I do know is years of practical experience in the field on the eastern shore of MD. If you have to come to ask I would consider all the information presented during an initial query or learning opportunity not by deducing stats to formulate a strategy or a workaround.

    A lot of people buy 4 wheel drive trucks so they don't get stuck but actually only use it less than 1 half of a percent during the entire ownership of the vehicles period. Many times they need pulled out because they got stuck while hunting but had tons of hours driving exposure on dry pavement.
     

    6Den

    Active Member
    Feb 10, 2013
    835
    Howard County
    I agree with your analysis regarding tree-stands. Two people fell to their. death near me this year. They're kind of like the smart people who take children out in the bay without a pfd.
    As far as archaic stats I don't know because I do not follow them but one injury or event is enough. I could also care less what they do in Europe because I do not hunt there.

    What I do know is years of practical experience in the field on the eastern shore of MD. If you have to come to ask I would consider all the information presented during an initial query or learning opportunity not by deducing stats to formulate a strategy or a workaround.

    A lot of people buy 4 wheel drive trucks so they don't get stuck but actually only use it less than 1 half of a percent during the entire ownership of the vehicles period. Many times they need pulled out because they got stuck while hunting but had tons of hours driving exposure on dry pavement.
    I’m not sure if you’re implying I don’t have much field experience, but I have over 40 years of hunting experience that includes handgun hunting in states without these restrictions. I only mentioned Europe’s requirements to address your concerns about crippling due to poor marksmanship. I’m pretty sure hunters can cripple game with handguns with scopes and barrel lengths over 6”, especially in the large calibers that are typically used. Your 4WD truck example points to this.
     

    kalister1

    R.I.P.
    May 16, 2008
    4,814
    Pasadena Maryland
    I’m not sure if you’re implying I don’t have much field experience, but I have over 40 years of hunting experience that includes handgun hunting in states without these restrictions. I only mentioned Europe’s requirements to address your concerns about crippling due to poor marksmanship. I’m pretty sure hunters can cripple game with handguns with scopes and barrel lengths over 6”, especially in the large calibers that are typically used. Your 4WD truck example points to this.

    Barrel length and power, how many deer are taken wit a 22LR by poachers? You can wound and not harvest a deer with 300 Win Mag if you don't hit it right.
     

    platoonDaddy

    Ultimate Member
    Jun 30, 2011
    4,123
    SouthOfBalto
    I’m not sure if you’re implying I don’t have much field experience, but I have over 40 years of hunting experience that includes handgun hunting in states without these restrictions. I only mentioned Europe’s requirements to address your concerns about crippling due to poor marksmanship. I’m pretty sure hunters can cripple game with handguns with scopes and barrel lengths over 6”, especially in the large calibers that are typically used. Your 4WD truck example points to this.

    You are a PUP!
     

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