FOPA changes bill introduced

swinokur · Mar 21, 2017

S 618 by Senator Orrin Hatch of UT.

Big change is it will allow stops for food, restrooom and overnight lodging.

Also provides legal protection from wrongful arrest and prosecutions and recovery of damages.

Loaded magazines are also ok, as long as locked up.

Will post House Version when introduced.

Allen65 · Mar 21, 2017

This would have no problem passing the House, so the fact it's being introduced in the Senate by a senior member is a big deal.

swinokur · Mar 21, 2017

5 cosponsors so far. only a week in.

kohburn · Mar 21, 2017

nedsurf · Mar 21, 2017

Recovery of damages should cool the heels of NJ, NY et. al.

DC-W · Mar 21, 2017

Thanks for posting this!

swinokur · Mar 21, 2017

nedsurf said:
Recovery of damages should cool the heels of NJ, NY et. al.

They will only learn after a few expensive lawsuits with punitive damages attached.

swinokur · Mar 21, 2017

Remember FOPA does not apply to trips whose origin and destination are both in MD. Statute 4-203 still applies.

marko12 · Mar 21, 2017

If this passes I will be so Happy I will Scream

iH8DemLibz · Mar 21, 2017

Perhaps an amendment to 4-203 for stopping at Royal Farms for fried chicken, moon pies, and purchaser's choice of a classic American soda is in order.

BigSteve57 · Mar 21, 2017

It's sad we need a bill to amend & clarify a law (FOPA) which shouldn't even need to exist!

iH8DemLibz · Mar 21, 2017

BigSteve57 said:
It's sad we need a bill to amend & clarify a law (FOPA) which shouldn't even need to exist!

True.

But it's great to see some level headed folks taking a second look at this.

Many head/wallet aches will be prevented if this takes place.

swinokur · Mar 21, 2017

a gun bill with little or no ambiguity?

who'd thunk it?

GlocksAndPatriots · Mar 21, 2017

Intresting. My reading of this is that if I was traveling by bus or train (interstate of course) I could carry it unloaded, in a holster, provided that the trigger was locked. I'm not suggesting this would be a good idea, but it seems to fit within the definition.

On the other hand, this doesn't go far enough:

"includes staying in temporary lodging overnight, stopping for food, fuel, vehicle maintenance, an emergency, medical treatment, or any other activity incidental to the transport; and"

These of course should be included, but it's ridiculous that if I was driving from Virginia to New Hampshire, that I couldn't stop at the Christiana Mall in Delaware and buy something that's not food or fuel because I want to take advantage of no sales tax. As long as the gun remains locked in the truck, it shouldn't matter what you do along the way or for how long.

Also, what does this mean?

7 ‘‘(B) with knowledge, or reasonable cause
8 to believe, that such a crime is to be committed
9 in the course of, or arising from, the transpor-
10 tation.

Since the possession of say, high capacity magazines, would constitute a crime and such crime would be "in the course of" or "arising" from such transportation in several states, that would appear to negate the first half. This needs to be clarified, or removed.

ken792 · Mar 21, 2017

Where does FOPA not allow loaded mags?

https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/USCODE-2011-title18/html/USCODE-2011-title18-partI-chap44-sec926A.htm

§926A. Interstate transportation of firearms
Notwithstanding any other provision of any law or any rule or regulation of a State or any political subdivision thereof, any person who is not otherwise prohibited by this chapter from transporting, shipping, or receiving a firearm shall be entitled to transport a firearm for any lawful purpose from any place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm to any other place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm if, during such transportation the firearm is unloaded, and neither the firearm nor any ammunition being transported is readily accessible or is directly accessible from the passenger compartment of such transporting vehicle: Provided, That in the case of a vehicle without a compartment separate from the driver's compartment the firearm or ammunition shall be contained in a locked container other than the glove compartment or console.
(Added Pub. L. 99–360, §1(a), July 8, 1986, 100 Stat. 766.)

jonnyl · Mar 21, 2017

ken792 said:
Where does FOPA not allow loaded mags?

https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/USCODE-2011-title18/html/USCODE-2011-title18-partI-chap44-sec926A.htm

Fopa doesn't prohibit it, but it currently doesn't give protection in states that do.

This version seems to protect you, BUT, by not distinguishing between loaded and unloaded mags it also seems to say no unloaded mags can be inserted into a firearm and even unloaded mags need to be in the trunk or locked up. In most states, that's not a problem anyway, but the whole point of this law are the DC's, NJ's, etc. of the country...

ken792 · Mar 21, 2017

jonnyl said:
Fopa doesn't prohibit it, but it currently doesn't give protection in states that do.

This version seems to protect you, BUT, by not distinguishing between loaded and unloaded mags it also seems to say no unloaded mags can be inserted into a firearm and even unloaded mags need to be in the trunk or locked up. In most states, that's not a problem anyway, but the whole point of this law are the DC's, NJ's, etc. of the country...

I literally never go to DC, NJ, or NY, so I wouldn't know.

The no unloaded mag part could be annoying with stuff that have mags not meant to be removed, like a Lee Enfield or K31. It probably would not occur to the owner of one to take it out. I even leave the 20rd mag in my National Match AR since I almost never shoot from the mag and it's simply there to lock the bolt open for single loading.

jonnyl · Mar 21, 2017

It also fixes the ambiguity of the phrase "...from any place where he may lawfully possess and carry to any other place..."

Some interpret that as not allowing those without a md carry permit to use fopa to get out of MD for a reason not on our approved list of activities. For example leaving for VA to concealed carry.

GlocksAndPatriots · Mar 21, 2017

I wonder if the GOP is considering using these to bait the Democrats. If the Democrats filibuster or otherwise throw a tantrum, they can then ram through the reciprocity bill (whether by nuclear option or attaching it to something else) after they realize the Democrats won't support anything that isn't onerous toward guns.

swinokur · Mar 21, 2017

jonnyl said:
It also fixes the ambiguity of the phrase "...from any place where he may lawfully possess and carry to any other place..."

Some interpret that as not allowing those without a md carry permit to use fopa to get out of MD for a reason not on our approved list of activities. For example leaving for VA to concealed carry.

In MD you may possess and carry on your own property. I don't see a problem. I think Esqappellate has said the same thing but it wasn't legal advice

The AG opinion on FOPA carry states that FOPA "has no bearing on trips whose origin and destination ar4e both in MD."

I take that to mean FOPA would apply if the origin OR destination ARE NOT in MD.
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FOPA changes bill introduced

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