Detailed NFA Trust Information

quattroginger · Mar 15, 2016

i had a lawyer draw up some paperwork in Va for a nfa trust. i was under the impression he practiced in Md as well based of some info from a friend. well, he ended up not being able to help me but sent me the 13 page trust anyways. seems legit, very very detailed. how do i go about submitting myself? i think im missing something very simple out of all this reading. i have everything ready to go and get notarized just not sure if i need to something first about submitting for it.

Hawkeye · Mar 15, 2016

IANAL and all that, and I am certainly not admitted to the Maryland bar.

That said, I don't believe that Maryland has any specific legislation around trusts. You don't need to register them with the state or anything like that here.

If you have a legal trust document written up, you go ahead and either e-file your Form 1 using that Trust, or you go to a dealer and buy the item on a Form 4 using that Trust. It's that simple.

dontpanic · Mar 15, 2016

quattroginger said:
i had a lawyer draw up some paperwork in Va for a nfa trust. i was under the impression he practiced in Md as well based of some info from a friend. well, he ended up not being able to help me but sent me the 13 page trust anyways. seems legit, very very detailed. how do i go about submitting myself? i think im missing something very simple out of all this reading. i have everything ready to go and get notarized just not sure if i need to something first about submitting for it.

Just get it notarized and "fund it". To fund mine I just added a $1 bill to the sch A. And keep that bill with my trust.

You can then start using your trust to purchase NFA goodness.

Make sure to keep it with your other important papers, as it is not filed with the state.

quattroginger · Mar 16, 2016

thanks for the info guys.

GoufCustom · Aug 17, 2016

I recently set up my trust in preparation to buy a suppressor, but before my trust and prior to Oct 2013, I individually registered an AR-15 SBR. I now want to move my AR-15 SBR into my trust, I know I need to do a Form 4, $200 to pass go, fingerprints and photos again; my question is do I need a MD FFL or something else to move my SBR from myself to my trust in MD?

Thanks

Sharpeneddark · Sep 13, 2016

GoufCustom said:
I recently set up my trust in preparation to buy a suppressor, but before my trust and prior to Oct 2013, I individually registered an AR-15 SBR. I now want to move my AR-15 SBR into my trust, I know I need to do a Form 4, $200 to pass go, fingerprints and photos again; my question is do I need a MD FFL or something else to move my SBR from myself to my trust in MD?

Thanks

You shouldn't need an FFL. FFLs use form 3. It probably wouldn't hurt to call one up and ask.

OnTarget · Sep 13, 2016

I hope to pickup my first suppressor this week, since it has been approved by ATF. As far as my "Assignment" sheet at end of the Trust, it currently only has a dollar bill listed. Here is how I plan to proceed with the sheet: On new Assignment sheet I will NOT re-enter the one dollar bill, rather I will enter the make, model, serial and date on the first line for the new suppressor. I presume the date used on line is date picked up from FFL. Can the FFL and other personnel witness the form at pickup? Do I destroy first sheet showing dollar bill?

Any other helpers appreciated, if any. Thanks!

Sticky · Sep 13, 2016

With my trust, as I understand it, the assignment sheet is merely to assign property to the trust that will be used to build the NFA item that you are requesting to build. My first two form 1's for suppressors merely had the $1 that 'funded' the trust to make it legal. I plan on doing two more form 1's for suppressors and the $1 will be all that shows on my 'Assignment sheet'. They already know that I have two, no need to relist them.

I may be wrong, but that is my understanding. If I were to form 1 an SBR, for example, I would transfer the lower from me to the trust using the assignment sheet, list that lower on the sheet and file that with the SBR form 1.

ETA - I filed both my first form 1's close together, so I had not received the first stamp before submitting the second app, but it would not have changed how I filed the second, even if I had rec'd the first one... Also... my trust has no 'schedule A' as some do, which I believe is to list the items owned by the trust, but you don't need to tell them what you own, they already know, they issued the stamps to you...

outrider58 · Sep 13, 2016

OnTarget said:
I hope to pickup my first suppressor this week, since it has been approved by ATF. As far as my "Assignment" sheet at end of the Trust, it currently only has a dollar bill listed. Here is how I plan to proceed with the sheet: On new Assignment sheet I will NOT re-enter the one dollar bill, rather I will enter the make, model, serial and date on the first line for the new suppressor. I presume the date used on line is date picked up from FFL. Can the FFL and other personnel witness the form at pickup? Do I destroy first sheet showing dollar bill?

Any other helpers appreciated, if any. Thanks!

Why delete the dollar? I'd enter the can on the next line. Why cause conflict if you don't have to? You need that dollar that bad?

OnTarget · Sep 13, 2016

outrider58 said:
Why delete the dollar? I'd enter the can on the next line. Why cause conflict if you don't have to? You need that dollar that bad?

Outrider: Are you saying to use a new "Assignment" sheet, then putting the dollar bill back on line 1. On line 2 add the new suppressor with information. Lastly, have it signed/witnessed. This would be on the original Trust form?

The only problem I have with merely adding the new suppressor to the old (original) "Assignment" sheet is you would be using the sheet with the earlier signers/witnesses. Do you understand what I am saying?

Sticky · Sep 13, 2016

OnTarget said:
Outrider: Are you saying to use a new "Assignment" sheet, then putting the dollar bill back on line 1. On line 2 add the new suppressor with information. Lastly, have it signed/witnessed.

The only problem I have with merely adding the new suppressor to the old (original) "Assignment" sheet is you would be using the sheet with the earlier signers/witnesses. Do you understand what I am saying?

I was told to submit a new assignment sheet with each application, not to reuse the old one, but my first two apps were only weeks apart, so I used the same one for them. I will submit a new one when I do my next two form 1's soon... (with only the $1, same as on my first two apps.. )

Also, my assignment sheet just needs two witness sigs, no notary.. (they can be anyone.. )

Sticky · Sep 13, 2016

Hopefully this won't get me in trouble, but these are the guidelines I was given...

OnTarget · Sep 13, 2016

Sticky said:
I was told to submit a new assignment sheet with each application, not to reuse the old one, but my first two apps were only weeks apart, so I used the same one for them. I will submit a new one when I do my next two form 1's soon... (with only the $1, same as on my first two apps.. )

Also, my assignment sheet just needs two witness sigs, no notary.. (they can be anyone.. )

Sticky: That's why I wanted to make sure, because I heard that a new "Assignment" sheet is needed for every new suppressor purchase received. Even heard that the old one can get chucked (not sure). My only problem is that we will show several items on the "Assignment" sheet with different dates, signed by two new witnesses (who never really witnessed the earlier purchases - only the most recent one).

Sticky · Sep 13, 2016

The way I read it, the assignment sheet is only to assign an item from 'me' to the 'trust' that will be used to build the item that I am applying for, so if I am building a suppressor, I can assign money or an item to show the trust is funded, or a section of titanium tubing that would be used to build the suppressor. In the case of an SBR form 1, I would assign a lower that I built myself (all my lowers are from paperweights) to the trust on the form 1 and that would be used to build the SBR I am applying for. I don't need to list anything else, as it has no bearing on the item that I am applying for... make sense? (cause I'm still confused... LMAO)

Sticky · Sep 13, 2016

OnTarget said:
Sticky: That's why I wanted to make sure, because I heard that a new "Assignment" sheet is needed for every new suppressor purchase received. Even heard that the old one can get chucked (not sure). My only problem is that we will show several items on the "Assignment" sheet with different dates, signed by two new witnesses (who never really witnessed the earlier purchases - only the most recent one).

Essentially, you will have multiple assignment sheets. Not sure about not keeping the old ones, but the new ones don't have to list items that are already owned by the trust (items that you have already received stamps for as the grantor of the trust).

OnTarget · Sep 13, 2016

Sticky said:
The way I read it, the assignment sheet is only to assign an item from 'me' to the 'trust' that will be used to build the item that I am applying for, so if I am building a suppressor, I can assign money or an item to show the trust is funded, or a section of titanium tubing that would be used to build the suppressor. In the case of an SBR form 1, I would assign a lower that I built myself (all my lowers are from paperweights) to the trust on the form 1 and that would be used to build the SBR I am applying for. I don't need to list anything else, as it has no bearing on the item that I am applying for... make sense? (cause I'm still confused... LMAO)

Sticky: Our projects are different. You're doing a build and I am just taking delivery of a suppressor upon my Form 4 approval, so I'm not sure how to advise you. What you sauid seems to make sense, but I'm not the go to person for advise on Form 1's. Wish I could help you more, but I'm still trying to figure out my "Assignment" form information.

OnTarget · Sep 13, 2016

Sticky said:
Essentially, you will have multiple assignment sheets. Not sure about not keeping the old ones, but the new ones don't have to list items that are already owned by the trust (items that you have already received stamps for as the grantor of the trust).

Now this makes sense to me. That way, when one buys a new suppressor, they just send to the ATF the latest "Assignment" sheet showing the last suppressor received into the trust.

Pinecone · Sep 14, 2016

I have both put in multiple Form 4s and Form 1s at the same time with the same assignment form.

And I have forgotten to update teh assignment form.

All were approved without trouble.

rbird7282 · Sep 14, 2016

I have one schedule A that I saved as a pdf and I update that one page and then save a new version of the trust. Simple. No need for multiple schedule A's

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

ClutchyMcClutcherson · Sep 28, 2016

I've tried reading through this entire thread starting with the 4 pages of back and forth argument between a few. I jumped ahead because my brain started hurting. Rather than trying to understand all the legal procedures and forms, does anyone have an attorney they can recommend that writes up trusts at a reasonable price? And question 2 is if this is a Maryland NFA trust what happens when I move out of state?

Thanks

Detailed NFA Trust Information

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