New to reloading .45 Auto...need recommendations on powder & primers

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  • rico903

    Ultimate Member
    May 2, 2011
    8,802
    Titegroup is the popular powder in 45acp. I use 5.0 gr under a 200 LSWC, soft shooting and accurate.
    W231 is also good but hard to find

    I have the Titegroup and primers, but 200gr RN. Had any experience with these?
    Finding powder was pure hell but found Titegroup, Unique and Trail Boss all in one week with a lot of driving. Figure one of those will work for me.
     

    rico903

    Ultimate Member
    May 2, 2011
    8,802
    Continental Arms has a lot of rifle but NO pistol powders. Or small or large pistol primers other than magnum. They are a mile from my house so I stop in a few times a week to check. When buying .45 ammo, be aware that Federal has been using small primers for some time now. WWB is large primers.
     

    Pinecone

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 4, 2013
    28,175
    The ONLY advantage I see to .45 ACP Small Primer brass is if .45 is the ONLY pistol caliber you reload that uses Large primers. With small primer .45 brass you can stock only one size primer for all your needs.
     

    Pinecone

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 4, 2013
    28,175
    45 ACP started as LPP and at some point they started SPP in this caliber too.

    Given that you are looking to load just one pistol caliber, you have more flexibility as you don't need to find a powder which works for multiple calibers.

    Buddy of mine turned me on to these:

    ygype5u8.jpg


    Inside, by bullet Manf, and specific bullet, you get a table:

    datuhadu.jpg


    I keep these in the car and take them in when I go shopping so I can find the match between the bullets I have (or am purchasing) and the available powder.

    I bought my copies at cabelas but you can find them at www.loadbooks.com

    One thing to watch with those books is, how often are they updated? I have the same books from over 20 years ago. Are the ones you buy today updated from the latest manuals?
     

    ITAdam

    Member
    Aug 30, 2014
    21
    Carrol County
    So is this powder shortage a result of all the ammo shortages from last year?

    For those of you that have powder, do you normally order it online or find it in stores locally?
     

    Shamr0ck

    Ultimate Member
    Aug 6, 2011
    2,505
    Frederick
    So is this powder shortage a result of all the ammo shortages from last year?

    For those of you that have powder, do you normally order it online or find it in stores locally?


    I pay cash and purchase in-person out of state.

    In part because I hate to pay hazmat and experience has shown out of state sources have better supply.

    If an IP has powder, I'll purchase it even if it is marginally more expensive
     

    trickg

    Guns 'n Drums
    MDS Supporter
    Jul 22, 2008
    14,596
    Glen Burnie
    Longshot is an often overlooked powder for .45 ACP, but I've recently done some reloading with it where I'm pretty pleased with the results. I used 7.3 gr of Longshot under a 200 gr plated round nose, and wound up with a load that's a bit warmer than your average .45 ACP load, but still well within limits, and it burned a lot cleaner than I expected.

    Another favorite of mine is Bullseye. Some people really prefer W231, or HP38, and I'm sure they produce fine reloads, but I like Bullseye a bit more for basic run of the mill target loads.
     

    ihriec

    Active Member
    Aug 10, 2013
    493
    My favorite target load for 45acp is 4.0 gr of Hodgdon Clays, Rainier 230 gr CRN, Federal large primers and either Federal or Winchester brass. This is a very soft, smooth, clean and accurate load. For buying powder, I find I usually have pretty good success at the various gun shows.
     

    trickg

    Guns 'n Drums
    MDS Supporter
    Jul 22, 2008
    14,596
    Glen Burnie
    A friend of mine tried Clays, but he said he didn't like it any better than Bullseye, so he went back to Bullseye. Let it be said though that he's a WW II re-enactor, and I think he likes the idea that Bullseye is supposedly the powder that was originally used in .45 ACP Ball.

    I forgot to mention primers - I've only ever used CCI and Winchester, and have had good luck with both of them.
     

    Shamr0ck

    Ultimate Member
    Aug 6, 2011
    2,505
    Frederick
    One thing to watch with those books is, how often are they updated? I have the same books from over 20 years ago. Are the ones you buy today updated from the latest manuals?


    That's a great point! The copyright date on the book pictured is 2011 and the page photocopied is for sierras 230gr RN. My 5thEd Sierra manual looks like it hasn't been updated in a while (2003) which caught me a bit surprised.

    The big advantage (for me at least) is that the one book/one caliber books makes it far easier to find a single powder which may work across multiple calibers.

    The one book one caliber books help me build a shopping list and I use the latest published data from the bullet Manf to work up the load.
     

    trickg

    Guns 'n Drums
    MDS Supporter
    Jul 22, 2008
    14,596
    Glen Burnie
    So here's point to ponder. Everyone always says to make sure you get the latest reloading manuals, and I think that there is a lot of wisdom to that. With that in mind, if you have successfully loaded with tried and true recipes that have been around for decades, and you only reload a few calibers, is there any true benefit to getting the latest manuals?
     

    Uncle Duke

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 2, 2013
    11,665
    Not Far Enough from the City
    So here's point to ponder. Everyone always says to make sure you get the latest reloading manuals, and I think that there is a lot of wisdom to that. With that in mind, if you have successfully loaded with tried and true recipes that have been around for decades, and you only reload a few calibers, is there any true benefit to getting the latest manuals?

    To me, that answer is yes. For others, perhaps not, and I can see both schools of thought.

    If you have a few tried and true loads that have been around forever, and they work well in your firearms and they fill your needs, then you may well have everything you need. But the more I deviate from that scenario, and typically and most recently because of component availability issues, the more I feel better having the most up to date information.

    As but one example, my first brand new reloading manual was Speer's Volume 10, published in 1979. Take a look at 44 Remington Magnum as but one example. If you compare that manual's data to today's Volume 14, you'll see load data that is identical, and you'll see load data that I see as being sufficiently different to curl my hair. There is much in print regarding why the deviation, and regarding Speer's perceived tendency to list loads yesterday that were deemed to be hot, and potentially too hot. Testing methods, changes in pressure testing technology, powder lot to lot variations, bullet construction variations from then to now are all possible explanations, with any or all potentially playing a part. Some would say that lawyering may come into play as well. But whatever one may decide regarding the reasons why, the numbers are indeed different in any number of instances. Sometimes dramatically so.

    To me personally, keeping my data library up to date, and having the ability to cross reference load information from multiple sources represents a tangible cost that's insignificant when compared to the money I spend on my firearms hobby generally. It also represents a sense of security for me that tells me that new loads I may be developing for the numerous cartridges I load are within industry consensus across multiple sources. I have deviated from more of my tried and true standard loads in the past 2 years than ever before. I haven't really wanted to. I've had to if I want to keep shooting. For that reason, my data library has been more valuable more recently than it has ever been to me.
     

    lkenefic

    Ultimate Member
    Aug 19, 2011
    3,778
    That's a really great question. I just dug through my reloading literature and came up with a the "Complete Reloading Manual for the 45 ACP" dated 1993. Back in the day, we had "36 various bullet designs" and "31 different powders". I see from the front cover of the 2011 manual that there are significantly more choices. Getting to tricg's question... I'm curious to find out what the current listing is for a Lyman Bullet #452630; 200 gr. (#2 alloy) with a 1.235 OAL using 5.5 gr of WW231. I've been consistently shooting the equivalent of this bullet/load for target shooting for the last 30 or so years. According to my manual that's now very old: the starting load for 231 is 5.2 gr to give 739 fps and a CUP of 12,300. Max load is: 6.5 gr for 923 fps and a CUP of 17,400... I wonder if the powder has changed significantly over the last 20 years.
     

    Uncle Duke

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 2, 2013
    11,665
    Not Far Enough from the City
    That's a really great question. I just dug through my reloading literature and came up with a the "Complete Reloading Manual for the 45 ACP" dated 1993. Back in the day, we had "36 various bullet designs" and "31 different powders". I see from the front cover of the 2011 manual that there are significantly more choices. Getting to tricg's question... I'm curious to find out what the current listing is for a Lyman Bullet #452630; 200 gr. (#2 alloy) with a 1.235 OAL using 5.5 gr of WW231. I've been consistently shooting the equivalent of this bullet/load for target shooting for the last 30 or so years. According to my manual that's now very old: the starting load for 231 is 5.2 gr to give 739 fps and a CUP of 12,300. Max load is: 6.5 gr for 923 fps and a CUP of 17,400... I wonder if the powder has changed significantly over the last 20 years.

    Per Lyman 49th

    #452630 200 grain #2 alloy 1.235" OAL.
    W231 powder

    Start: 5.4 grains 727 fps. 11,900 c.u.p.

    Maximum: 6.1 grains 885 fps. 16,300 c.u.p.
     

    lkenefic

    Ultimate Member
    Aug 19, 2011
    3,778
    Per Lyman 49th

    #452630 200 grain #2 alloy 1.235" OAL.
    W231 powder

    Start: 5.4 grains 727 fps. 11,900 c.u.p.

    Maximum: 6.1 grains 885 fps. 16,300 c.u.p.

    There you go... even the "old standbys" appear to have changed somewhat over the last few years. My load is still within spec, but probably isn't delivering the same performance that it was when I first started reloading this caliber so very many years ago. Thanks!
     

    byf43

    SCSC Life/NRA Patron Life
    That's a really great question. I just dug through my reloading literature and came up with a the "Complete Reloading Manual for the 45 ACP" dated 1993. Back in the day, we had "36 various bullet designs" and "31 different powders". I see from the front cover of the 2011 manual that there are significantly more choices. Getting to tricg's question... I'm curious to find out what the current listing is for a Lyman Bullet #452630; 200 gr. (#2 alloy) with a 1.235 OAL using 5.5 gr of WW231. I've been consistently shooting the equivalent of this bullet/load for target shooting for the last 30 or so years. According to my manual that's now very old: the starting load for 231 is 5.2 gr to give 739 fps and a CUP of 12,300. Max load is: 6.5 gr for 923 fps and a CUP of 17,400... I wonder if the powder has changed significantly over the last 20 years.


    I've loaded 5.7 gr. of W-231 under a 200 gr LSWC hardcast boolit for more years than I can recount.
    Out of my Gold Cup NM, it runs 907 fps with 11 SD, and will shoot the X-ring out of the target at 25 yards.

    I am going to have to go back to "square 1" when I run out of W-231 and work up the charge, again.
     

    Pinecone

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 4, 2013
    28,175
    My favorite target load for 45acp is 4.0 gr of Hodgdon Clays, Rainier 230 gr CRN, Federal large primers and either Federal or Winchester brass. This is a very soft, smooth, clean and accurate load. For buying powder, I find I usually have pretty good success at the various gun shows.

    Where have you found Clays in the last year?

    There was a fire in the plant and no Clays and other pistol/shotgun powders from ADI in Australia.
     

    Pinecone

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 4, 2013
    28,175
    That's a great point! The copyright date on the book pictured is 2011 and the page photocopied is for sierras 230gr RN. My 5thEd Sierra manual looks like it hasn't been updated in a while (2003) which caught me a bit surprised.

    The big advantage (for me at least) is that the one book/one caliber books makes it far easier to find a single powder which may work across multiple calibers.

    The one book one caliber books help me build a shopping list and I use the latest published data from the bullet Manf to work up the load.

    One would have to cross check all the data.

    BUT I wonder how they print copyrighted material (reloading manuals) and then copyright it themselves. :)
     

    Pinecone

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 4, 2013
    28,175
    Per Lyman 49th

    #452630 200 grain #2 alloy 1.235" OAL.
    W231 powder

    Start: 5.4 grains 727 fps. 11,900 c.u.p.

    Maximum: 6.1 grains 885 fps. 16,300 c.u.p.

    Hmm, I just chrono'd a new lower power USPSA load (newer power factor requirements) and 5.4 - 5.5 grains gave me a around 850 fps.

    I used to shoot 5.9 grains for the old power factor.
     

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