Crushing on the M1 Carbine

Major03 · May 17, 2018

I've gotten some renewed love for the M1 Carbine

I dug my Korean War vintage CMP Inland out from the depths of the upstairs safe to step my son up from .22 LR to centerfire the other day.

I'd totally forgotten how fun that little rifle is to shoot!!! Almost zero recoil, very easy to keep on target for follow up shots and pretty darn accurate out to 150 yds. Inside of 100 yds it's downright deadly.

Both the boy and I were grinning from ear to ear.

Started to reload for it, and that little rifle with a soft point round has the potential to be a great PDW.

Anyone else feeling the love?

Doctor_M · May 17, 2018

I'm with you... love me some M1 carbines. They often get dissed for being "under-powered", but they have sent many a man to meet his maker.

Recently picked up a Chiappa M1-9. Looks and handles like a standard M1 car, but takes double stack 9mm mags. Cheaper to shoot and I don't worry about banging around my vintage rifles.

kyserthehun · May 17, 2018

Major03 said:
Started to reload for it, and that little rifle with a soft point round has the potential to be a great PDW.

Anyone else feeling the love?

And you can attach a bayonet if you run out of ammo. That'll teach any home invaders!

TheOriginalMexicanBob · May 17, 2018

Some will put down the .30 Carbine 110 grain bullet at 1900 fps but extoll the 9mm 115 grain at 1300 fps. Use a hollow point in the Carbine and it should perform just fine in a self-defense scenario.

Full disclosure...my uncle hit Omaha Beach in the first wave. He developed a severe dislike for the Carbine. He said he shot a German soldier and his exact words were "I hit the sumbitch three times and I bet he's still running!" My uncle said as soon as he could he dumped the Carbine and picked up a 1903 Springfield and carried that until a mortar round outside of St. Lo took him out. Everyone had a different experience with the M1 Carbine...many loved it and many didn't. Audie Murphy loved it...he carried what he called his "Lucky Carbine" and when its stock was damaged he wired and bolted it back together. His experience was positive.

The Carbine was intended to replace a pistol, not be a primary combat weapon but it sure found its way into front-line service.

Wongler · May 17, 2018

I recently picked up a carbine a few months ago and ran it Saturday at the PNTC Kahles 2 gun. A few magazine related issues, but I think people were fairly impressed with it's performance. The groups inside 100 were really good, over 100 it got hard to see the small plates they were using. A fun rifle.

trailtoy · May 17, 2018

My now 11 year old nephew likes shooting the 'mini garand' as well. It's an old CMP National Postal Meter that my father and a friend split years ago. I guess they couldn't come up with $40 each to buy two!

Rebel59 · May 17, 2018

I acquired a few when the CMP had the Italian returns for sale. Fun rifle with a lot of history.

Major03 · May 17, 2018

Wongler said:
A few magazine related issues, but I think people were fairly impressed with it's performance.

Yes, a lot of folks have problems with the magazine feeding reliably and stove piping issues. Most of those problems are related to the feed lips being damaged.

The feed lips on the magazine bend very easily. This is uaually caused by folks giving the magazine a slap once it is already seated. Not a terrible habit for an AR...really bad habit for a M1 carbine.

Luckily it's a pretty easy issue to fix with a screwdriver with a long heavy shaft and a rubber mallet.

Major03 · May 17, 2018

TheOriginalMexicanBob said:
Some will put down the .30 Carbine 110 grain bullet at 1900 fps but extoll the 9mm 115 grain at 1300 fps. Use a hollow point in the Carbine and it should perform just fine in a self-defense scenario.

Full disclosure...my uncle hit Omaha Beach in the first wave. He developed a severe dislike for the Carbine. He said he shot a German soldier and his exact words were "I hit the sumbitch three times and I bet he's still running!" My uncle said as soon as he could he dumped the Carbine and picked up a 1903 Springfield and carried that until a mortar round outside of St. Lo took him out. Everyone had a different experience with the M1 Carbine...many loved it and many didn't. Audie Murphy loved it...he carried what he called his "Lucky Carbine" and when its stock was damaged he wired and bolted it back together. His experience was positive.

The Carbine was intended to replace a pistol, not be a primary combat weapon but it sure found its way into front-line service.

Wow, I bet you're uncle had some stories to tell...what I wouldn't give to sit with him for an evening sipping some whisky together and listening...although my GrandDad's generation typically didn't like to talk about it / relive it.

Yep, a full battle rifle it ain't...and never was supposed to be. More powerful than a pistol, but lighter than a rifle is the niche it fills...and I think it fills it pretty darn well.

The ball ammo has some pretty impressive penetration, but zips through soft tissue without dumping a lot of energy. My bet is that German soldier died from blood loss eventually.

Loading with hollow points or soft points solves a lot of the over penetration issues, although apparently can cause feeding issues if you're not careful with your choice.

Jim Cirillo of the New York Stakeout Squad in the 60's sang the little carbine's praises.

Indiana Jones · May 17, 2018

I desperately need to get one.

lazarus · May 17, 2018

Speaking of, interview in Forgotten Weapons with Ken Hackathorn about the M1 carbine.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=FF0qH_zvfdU

Summary, first PDW. Most guys loved them. Inland was by far the highest quality manufacturer of the GIs. Most of the guys at the time treat the mags as dispossable and they were the weakest link. The new Korean mags are good (I can attest to this, better build quality on the KCI than the original GI mags). Many people with current issues are using mags with 70yr old springs. Spend $10 and get 3 new springs. Also get a new recoil spring for your carbine.

End of the day, reliability then isn’t what it is today. Even the Garand has serious issues compared to a modern battle rifle for dust, dirt and mud ingress and reliability.

All that said I love mine. My KCI 30rnd mags have feed with no problems in a couple of hundred rounds of wolf steel and about 100rnds of armscor and herters brass. 2 or my 3 15rnd GI Mags have a stoppage or two per mag. The other one runs fine. I just replaced the springs (and one mag was rusty inside, not the good mag) and cleaned them up. I’ll see how they do now. Probably better.

Rifle is fun as hell. I wish I had a walk around shooting course I could take it on. Hell a few dozen acres I could call my own to walk around and blast some toadstools and crap would be fun.

MilsurpDan · May 17, 2018

My M1 Carbine is probably my favorite rifle to shoot.

My Great-Uncle was in the 7th Cavalry during the Korean War. He carried an M2 Carbine and still talks about how much he loved it. He said he knows first hand that the stories about rounds not going through Chinese Winter Coats are BS.

TheOriginalMexicanBob · May 17, 2018

Major03 said:
Wow, I bet you're uncle had some stories to tell...what I wouldn't give to sit with him for an evening sipping some whisky together and listening...although my GrandDad's generation typically didn't like to talk about it / relive it.

Jim Cirillo of the New York Stakeout Squad in the 60's sang the little carbine's praises.

My uncle never really talked about combat until the last time I visited him before he passed away at 95. By then all he had were long-term memories. He talked about the Normandy hedgerows and such.

Prior to that he would only talk about the more humorous experiences of Army life. He had taken ROTC in high school and after he enlisted the Army wanted him to apply for officer's school. He said he had already seen the stats on the life expectancy of junior officers in combat so he declined. He said about midnight that night when he was cleaning latrines with a toothbrush he decided to rethink that decision.

Once I asked him if he had seen "Saving Private Ryan" and he looked at me and said "That's just Hollywood" and said nothing more. After my parents were gone I found some letters to them from my uncle from during the war. There I discovered why he was in the first wave...his platoon was assigned to work with the combat engineers destroying beach obstacles for following boats. He said he hit the beach with forty men and only had ten left by day's end. He was in the 29th Division, 116th Infantry Regiment, 2nd Battalion.

I met Jim Cirillo once when I was at FLETC...the Federal Law Enforcement Training Center. He was a legend among old timers. Pretty nice guy as well.

jessebogan · May 17, 2018

I had a customer that landed at Omaha that had a similar experience. He said he was a brand new 2nd Lieutenant, and he and a German had each other pinned down.He said he shot the German with his carbine a time or two, and he kept popping up and shooting back. He crawled back to the first dead GI he found with a Garand, and when he shot the German with that, he stayed dead. That said, a carbine is on my short list.

lazarus · May 17, 2018

I sort of wish I had great carbine stories to tell other than loving it. Only relative I have who served in WWII was in the navy. Destroyer radio operator. My uncle fought in Korea, but he was REMF :-). The one time I asked him about it he said the closest he ever got was fighting a type writer and a slide rule in divisional headquarters in Seoul in ‘52 (he was an accountant).

One of my great grandfathers was a Sgt and later SSGT in the Marines in WWI. He fought in Italy and I believe it was after the war served for a time in Panama. Hard to decipher his medals and ribbons as I can’t find much info on WWI ribbons and he died when my father was my oldest son’s age (10), it he left a hell of an impression on my dad. Taught him to swim. He as a coal miner foreman after he mustered out of the marines for about 30 years. As my dad put it “the nicest man I’ve ever met in my whole life who just cared about everyone”. Oh, but one of them is a rifle sharpshooter medal. No idea how those were awarded then versus now. I sort of assume they weren’t participation awards at the time.

Oh and I have a picture around her somewhere if him with an ‘03

CodeWarrior1241 · May 17, 2018

Always wanted the carbine... But the thought of adding yet another caliber and magazine type is obnoxious, haven't done it for that reason.

I had thought all of the Korean war etc stories with the M1's reputation for weak penetration were debunked by now though... Of course the old vets were actually there, it wasn't just theory for them.

OTOH, my grandfather saw some serious action during the war as well - carrying a PPS - which should tell you where that was. He had a medal for being part of the Koenigsberg operation which was given out to infantry that was involved in street fighting in the city. Spoke of the PPS as a real lifesaver, short with a folding stock that fit in his vehicles, and did the job against Germans... And it fired a pistol round! The M1 would have definitely been a step up.

Sent from my SHIELD Tablet K1 using Tapatalk

Biggfoot44 · May 17, 2018

My Uncle fought in the Bulge, but he used a BAR , not a Carbine .

JDH146 · May 18, 2018

Unissued bayonet sets on sale.

"It is extremely rare when the buyers at MidwayUSA come across an item that is close to five decades old and still in the original, unopened, military packaging. "

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1...s-m4-bayonet-with-m8a1-scabbard-collector-set

Redcobra · May 18, 2018

My M1 Carbine is my PDW.

lazarus · May 18, 2018

JDH146 said:
Unissued bayonet sets on sale.

"It is extremely rare when the buyers at MidwayUSA come across an item that is close to five decades old and still in the original, unopened, military packaging. "

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1...s-m4-bayonet-with-m8a1-scabbard-collector-set

If only. Mine is too early in the production run to have a bayonet lug (September of ‘42 manufacture).

Crushing on the M1 Carbine

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