What is the strongest locking mechanism for a folder?

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    MachtSchnell

    Member
    Jul 30, 2012
    56
    Carroll County
    Any of the Axis, Compression, Caged Ball Bearing locks (or any similar iteration) are amongst the strongest lock designs. Then again, I've never found back locks, or liner locks to be weak either.

    If the need arises a fixed blade cant be beat.
     
    alucard0822

    alucard0822

    For great Justice
    Oct 29, 2007
    17,692
    PA
    MachtSchnell said:
    Any of the Axis, Compression, Caged Ball Bearing locks (or any similar iteration) are amongst the strongest lock designs. Then again, I've never found back locks, or liner locks to be weak either.

    If the need arises a fixed blade cant be beat.
    Click to expand...

    Outside of cheap junk most locks are probably "strong" enough to stick into something and stand on the handle. In many cases the often overlookedstop pin, that keeps the blade from opening too far is smaller than the lock or pivot, and should receive more force than a lock would. On ZTs it is a massive thumb stud that locks up against the front of the frame, other designs might have a pin held with a screw, a piece friction fit into the liners, the front of the backspacer, or in the case of backlocks the actual front of the lock. In most cases it's shock or inadvertently hitting the lock with your grip that ends up closing a knife when you don't want it to. In that case a firm grip on a lockback or framelock helps hold the lock engaged, where the same can inadvertently release a liner, compression or axis/BB lock, with a linerlock being far easier to accidentally release than the other 2. Between the deep engagement, heavy spring, and separate stop pin, The Demco/CS triad is probably the strongest, and least likely to release IMO. It is really slow to work though, and really tough with 1 hand, so the Axis/BB are probably the best mix of strength and ease of use, with the BB being a bit more secure and the Axis being a little easier to work, both are probably about as strong. I do love my framelocks, not because I love that type of lock, but because I love KAI flippers and AO, and can live with the lock, even if it messes up the grip shape and can close on you if the flipper wasn't there to stop it.
     
    Minuteman

    Minuteman

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    Dec 13, 2009
    21,393
    Maryland, let's make it a better place.
    ponypeddler87 said:
    Knife HQ Lock Strength Test II good spyderco lock test. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ERxHUXAFVs4
    Click to expand...

    Thanks.

    That was very inconclusive, but appreciated. Any data is better than no data. Usually. :)


    Since I started this thread I've been passively doing my own independent testing. So far, the only thing I'm comfortable saying is - good guys should have no law against them carrying a fixed blade,and training + mindset are supreme.
     
    alucard0822

    alucard0822

    For great Justice
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    ponypeddler87 said:
    Knife HQ Lock Strength Test II good spyderco lock test. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ERxHUXAFVs4
    Click to expand...

    Pretty cool, knew the bolt lock and BB lock would be impressive, but wow. Both use a spring to force the locking peice in, and the more pressure on the lock, the tighter it gets, and the less chance there is for it to slip out, so Also doesn't have the deep cutout of a lockback/triad lock in the tang, so less chance of the blade snapping like the test showed, and FAR easier to operate with one hand. Spyderco does make good stuff.
     
    fidelity

    fidelity

    piled higher and deeper
    MDS Supporter
    Aug 15, 2012
    22,400
    Frederick County
    Having trouble playing YouTube right now. Liner lock was the worst, I'm guessing. What was the relative ranking? Were frame locks acceptable? Benchmade axis locks near the top?

    To confess, I like my frame lock ZTs (models 562 and 566) more than my axis lock Benchmade folders (just the options I have, which are clearly well built), and they seem very stable when deployed even with the frame lock.

    Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk
     
    alucard0822

    alucard0822

    For great Justice
    Oct 29, 2007
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    Minuteman said:
    Bolt lock. I wonder if its stronger than the Triad lock?

    Click to expand...


    The weak link for the Triad and most lockbacks is the blade, not the lock due to the large cutout, would have liked to see the weight where it failed, likely less than the weight it took to kill the BB or bolt locks. The Bolt and BB lock has a stronger blade with less cutout needed, but the pins holding the backspacer in place, or the bolt lock anvil can shear with enough force. Cold Steel tends to use tough and soft AUS8 steel, so the lock and blade will probably get gouged, bent and damaged before it breaks, where most of Spyderco's "better" steel will probably not bend or gouge as easy, before it breaks. The Spyderco locks also don't need as large a pivot, and work in EDC sized knives without wasting an inch or so of handle space. All in all the Cold steel design gives up a lot in the name of strength, the other 2, and even the slimmer standard mid/back lock are much better locks in use.

    triad lock.jpg

    bolt_action_lock.jpg

    bb lock.jpg
     
    Minuteman

    Minuteman

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    alucard0822 said:
    The weak link for the Triad and most lockbacks is the blade, not the lock due to the large cutout, would have liked to see the weight where it failed, likely less than the weight it took to kill the BB or bolt locks. The Bolt and BB lock has a stronger blade with less cutout needed, but the pins holding the backspacer in place, or the bolt lock anvil can shear with enough force. Cold Steel tends to use tough and soft AUS8 steel, so the lock and blade will probably get gouged, bent and damaged before it breaks, where most of Spyderco's "better" steel will probably not bend or gouge as easy, before it breaks. The Spyderco locks also don't need as large a pivot, and work in EDC sized knives without wasting an inch or so of handle space. All in all the Cold steel design gives up a lot in the name of strength, the other 2, and even the slimmer standard mid/back lock are much better locks in use.

    View attachment 183625

    View attachment 183626

    View attachment 183627
    Click to expand...

    Wow, thanks for the explanation, that pretty much wraps up the current state of the art locks.

    -

    -

    What about lateral forces.... (another topic maybe for another day). :)
     
    alucard0822

    alucard0822

    For great Justice
    Oct 29, 2007
    17,692
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    Minuteman said:
    Wow, thanks for the explanation, that pretty much wraps up the current state of the art locks.

    -

    -

    What about lateral forces.... (another topic maybe for another day). :)
    Click to expand...

    There is also a big difference in the design of the actual knife, not just lock type. My ZT300 has a short, thick and stubby Ti framelock with a hinderer stabilizer, coupled with the massively wide blade and huge pivot, it is probably stronger than the axis lock nested in shortened sub-liners in my Griptilian. Been having fun with a new BM 51 Morpho, first Zen pin balisong I've owned and love it. Seems MUCH stronger and more resistant to wear than my tang pin models, locks open and closed, but a squeeze pops open the spring latch, and flipping to deploy while more complicated and slower than a flipper or axis is just cool.

    As far as side load, would take a lot of force till the pivot or blade breaks, but the big question is when the pivot would be damaged to the point the blade would rub when closing or opening, or affect lockup. Have had that happen with plastic washers, although outside of Emerson, most decent blades use something better. Between ball and roller bearings and PB washers, have damaged ball bearings from tough use, ZT replaced them in my 561for free, never had a PB washer fail, but the pivot has to be adjusted from time to time. Also a handy feature of Benchmade and ZTs is the awesome warranty, if a lock fails, or the blade breaks or wears out, you can send them back and get it fixed for around $20 if they charge you at all
     
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