Lever gun caliber?

Atrox88 · Feb 24, 2021

I have had 3 lever rifles in pistol calibers .357, .41, and .44 magnums. My favorite and the only one I still own is my .41 Magnum. When standard factory ammo is considered, the .41 delivers 25 percent more energy than the .357 Magnum with a wider, heavier bullet. It is true the .44 Remington Magnum produces more energy than the .41 if standard factory loads are compared (800 ft-lbs. vs. 700 ft-lbs.). The other truth is the terminal effect on either an animal or human doesn’t change much between those two numbers. A deer hit with a .41 and then a .44 is hard pressed to tell the difference. They make similar wound channels to similar depths. If the results are the same, why put up with the .44’s much heavier recoil? When it comes to self-defense use, the .41 Magnum is superior to the .44 Magnum. The .41 will do everything to an assailant the .44 will do, and it is the only big-bore magnum most shooters can manage with a one hand hold on the gun. This is more important than many people think. While a two-handed hold is the modern, preferred method, many times it is necessary to shoot one-handed. Your off hand might have to hold a flashlight, baton, etc. You might need it to hold your attacker or push them away from you. The .41 allows quicker, more accurate follow up shots either one or two-handed than the .44 ever will.

Biggfoot44 · Feb 24, 2021

Indeed , .30-30 ( and .35 Rem) are fine deer ctgs , but the OP specifically wanted straight wall .

FWIW , I would rate .45 Colt as closer to a tie with .44 .

cstone · Feb 24, 2021

I have a Browning in .357 Mag and a Winchester in .30-30. I would like something in .45 Colt, but would settle for a .45-70, right after I find a nice 1873 Springfield trapdoor carbine.

Harrys · Feb 24, 2021

My lever actions: 1920 Model 94 Winchester 30/30 one of the best deer guns ever, a Henry 30/30, a Henry 45/70, a Henry Military Tribute 22LR, L, S

Bolts Rock · Feb 24, 2021

Starline makes both .38-55 and .375 Winchester brass.

byf43 · Feb 24, 2021

Uncle Duke said:
How to boil this down to fewest words possible....

45-70: Buy this one only on purpose.

44 Mag: the one I'd choose if deer hunting is primary consideration.

45 Colt: I love this cartridge, but not if you don't handload currently.

357 Mag: Cartridge comes alive in rifle barrel. Can be Maryland legal for deer with correct loads. Will be... IMO....the most affordable and fun gun of the bunch overall.

Biggfoot44 said:
Depends on your priorities .

.44Mag - If your highest priority is hunting , with factory load ammunition . For light to medium loads , you need to handload .

.45Colt - Mainstream factory loads have you covered for light to medium . In sufficiently strong rifles ( think M92 clones, modern Henry , etc) capable of at least " Ruger Level " loads , handloads or boutique ammo will handle hunting nicely . ( In non- panic times , the Georgia Arms " Deer Stopper " .45 Colt is very reasonable $ compared to the Boutiques .)

.357/ .38 - Standard .38spl is very pleasant to shoot . For hunting the big issue is bullet performance @ 1700-1900 plus fps . Cast or JSP will penetrate like the dickens w/o expanding . Most JHP is designed for revolver velocities . The arbitrary Maryland 1200fps is a catch-22 , where lighter bullets more easily meet the requirement On Paper , but as a class 180gr will perform better . Yes , I have hunted with .357 levergun .

FWIW - Brian Pearce thinks .357 leverguns are just dandy for Mule Deer ..... With his 42K cup handloads , with 158 Gold Dot or XTP @ 2000-2100 fps .

.45-70 - It is what it is , with a cult of True Believers . If you want Really Big Bullets , .45-70 is your Huckleberry . To unlock the versatility , you need to handload . Specifically for deer , the mainstream 300gr JHP actually work well , and are fairly mild by .45-70 context .

Not mentioned - .41 Magum . My Late Shooting & Handloading Partner #1 was a .41 True Believer , and had .41 Marlin that I shot a fair bit , and it was Sweet .He worked up a 265 WFN @ 1100fps that gave good 100yd accuracy , and would completely penetrate anything that walked in North Carolina .

But it's a Niche within a Niche . Actual hunters and shooters would have to seriously battle Marlin Collectors to get one .

^^^^^^AWESOME responses, IMNSHO!

Get the .45-70........ "Just because".
Bought my first one in 2000. Bought the second one in 2001.
Bought the third one in 2009. Bought the fourth one in 2019.
(On top of that, my youngest son owns two, also! 1895CB and an 1895SBL.)

With the right powder (Reloader 7) and from 300 gr. to 'boulders', you can go from mild to wild (with NO reason to go 'wild'), this grand old "catridge" can take any game animal on the North American continent, and just about any other continent, too!
Seriously, there is no reason to 'hot rod' or 'magnumize' the .45-70 Gov't.
Easily, my favorite cartridge to load and shoot.

.44 Magnum - Got a couple of those, too.
The Winchester 94 Trapper really "Barks"!!!!!
"I" wouldn't hesitate to take the .44 magnum leverguns on deer and wild boar hunts, at all.
I watched a good friend anchor a 250+ lb wild hog at 25 yards, with one shot from a Ruger "Deerfield" (resembles an M1 Carbine) semi-auto and a 240 gr JSP bullet, pushed by W-296. Just incredible little carbine!
Some friend he is.......... he won't sell that carbine to me!!!!

He also has a Marlin 1894 in .41 Magnum, and it's a GORGEOUS rifle!!!!!! Very accurate.
He's sold off several firearms, including a Dan Wesson 741 VH-6 and he won't consider selling the Marlin!

Biggfoot44 · Feb 25, 2021

To put .45-70 ( and all the similar old school BP Ctgs) into perspective :

If heavy big bore cast bullets propelled by Actual BP will completely penetrate a Buffalo @ 1,000yds , and leave a significant wound channel behind, what are you seeking to gain by hot rodding the velocities ?

( Actual Answer - Somewhat flatter trajectory . Somewhat flatter by comparison , but never as flat as a .30-30 , much less modern hunting rifles . And the price in recoil is a steep trade off .

Actually for "only" deer sized game , the mainstream .45-70 "hunting load " of 300gr JHP @ actual 16- 1700 fps gives good balance of mild recoil , and modern- ish hunter acceptable trajectory out to 100yds or a bit more. )

454shooter · Feb 25, 2021

Love me some big bore lever guns! Having said that, you can really only fully appreciate the maximum potential from 45-70 if you load your own. Yes, you can buy the "boutique" stuff, but the choices are still limited and it is crazy expensive.

lowoncash · Feb 25, 2021

Unless I missed it I’m surprised no one mentioned 350 legend.

Mini14tac · Feb 25, 2021

lowoncash said:
Unless I missed it I’m surprised no one mentioned 350 legend.

I don’t believe the 350 Legend is designed for or available in a lever action.

I have never seen one.

Jimbob2.0 · Feb 25, 2021

Ive been jonesin for a Big Horn Armory .500 S&W.

boule · Feb 25, 2021

Jd2020 said:
I did all my deer hunting with a muzzleloader this season because I don’t own a straight-walled cartridge rifle. I ......

So what caliber to get? I want a cartridge I can deer hunt with. A cartridge that’s relatively simple to reload. As versatile a caliber as possible would be nice too, I suppose.

Well, if I go the last few pages right, you are in one of the "straight walled or shotgun" counties for hunting. Since you excluded bottleneck cartridges, I will not delve into the 30-30 or AI here, but they are great rounds and pretty much enough for deer.

The big question will be: How far are you going to go in handloading your ammo?

.357 mag - you need to limit your shooting distances and use heavy bullets for penetration. Those are usually the first boxes to be sold..... so yeah, you need to find some 180gr bullets for the 357 and a way to push them fast.

45 LC - place it somewhere between the two, it works.

.44 mag - more oomph than the ones mentioned before. Friend uses it to hunt roedeer with a simple 240gr bullet (we favor the Fiocci JSP since he is mooching of my revolver loads). The results tend to be a little bit of a splatter with proper shot placement but they stay down.

45-70 - oh yeah baby. Now this is what I call a rifle round. You want to shoot it, you want to feel it and you want to see the faces to your left and right on the range if you "accidentally" packed the 405gr lead rounds with triple compressed holey black under them and just smoked up everything for the next minute or two.
Honestly, the 45-70 has a temprament but can be tamed. If you use hard cast lead bullets and a moderate load it is still plenty deadly and more of a push in the shoulder than a kick. 350gr and 405gr lead or gas-checked lead rounds will take care of any animal north of Mexico. You should be more than OK with the number of rounds in the tube for hunting.

my personal recommendation:
45-70 for hunting, .357 for the range
if you want to compromise on one gun, either the 44mag or 45LC

Bountied · Feb 28, 2021

The answer is obvious. .44mag. Versatile, can kill a deer, easy to reload, can switch to a pistol... it meets all the criteria.

KIBarrister · Feb 28, 2021

Coincidentally I had the same decision to make recently (I historically hunt Carroll Co with bottlenecks, but I have a feeling that land will not be available much longer - I live in QAC). I picked up a 1894 Marlin in .44 Mag. The one I got was a “Remlin” but with manufacture date code of mid-2016 it was made after all the kinks were worked out by Remington. To the extent you go with a Marlin the reputation, if you aren’t aware, is that the last couple years before Rem took over are bad (Marlin was using decrepit tooling), and the first 3-4 years after are mostly far worse. Marlin’s SN work as a date code. Remington produced versions you have to base it on the date code on the barrel (opposite side of the “REP” proof mark is a two letter code).

Trigger Time · Feb 28, 2021

I'd like to add a 44 mag to my collection but the JM guns are way over priced IMO, and I've seen too many horror stories about the Remlins to take a chance on them. I'm holding out to see what Ruger does with them, hopefully they will make more stainless guns and do a real cut checkering, not the pressed in stuff Remington was doing.

Jd2020 · Feb 28, 2021

So many awesome guys here. Thanks for all the info and suggestions. I ended up feeling that there were no really wrong choices of cartridge in that list. And relative to semis, mag-fed, 80% guns, the commies in Annapolis and DC. Shouldn’t get around to hindering lever gun sales too soon. Calibers can be changed or added later.So just buy one, dam* it and enjoy!
A great MDS fellow here just sold me his Rossi 92 in .44 mag. Like the Marlins, there seem to be hit or miss stories on the world-wide google machine regarding Rossi. Many people seem to treat them as sort of almost complete kit guns. They stone and smooth the actions, delete safeties etc.
The original owner smoothed out the gun’s operation, refinished the stock (and steel!) added a skinner peep (I prefer aperture sights usually), removed the safety (so now I can go off half cocked...as they say) wrapped the lever in leather (like para cord wraps), etc. he also provided me a reloading set for .44 and some really helpful guidance.
Suffice it to say I’m very happy with it. Maybe it’s because I was limited to muzzleloaders and 12 ga. Slugs forever, but the recoil is fine. Even with the curved steel buttplate, which looks better than a rubber pad. Both the metal buttplate and short length of pull are assets in cold when shouldering the gun. I may get a leather lace up pad with cartridge holders though.
The 16.25” barrel and sub-5lbs is awesome. Recoil and accuracy might not be helped by it’s diminutive size but it’s not bad in the first department and the accuracy seems good. I’ve only shot a dozen rounds at 20 yards offhand but it was minute of soda can. It’s like a Red Ryder BB gun on steroids.
So thanks to the gentleman who sold it to me, and thanks to all those who took the time to write.

Trigger Time · Feb 28, 2021

As a matter of fact I'm working on my Christmas list now. Latest news from Ruger.

https://youtu.be/B2fcicJZp64

Harrys · Feb 28, 2021

boule said:
Well, if I go the last few pages right, you are in one of the "straight walled or shotgun" counties for hunting. Since you excluded bottleneck cartridges, I will not delve into the 30-30 or AI here, but they are great rounds and pretty much enough for deer.

The big question will be: How far are you going to go in handloading your ammo?

.357 mag - you need to limit your shooting distances and use heavy bullets for penetration. Those are usually the first boxes to be sold..... so yeah, you need to find some 180gr bullets for the 357 and a way to push them fast.

45 LC - place it somewhere between the two, it works.

.44 mag - more oomph than the ones mentioned before. Friend uses it to hunt roedeer with a simple 240gr bullet (we favor the Fiocci JSP since he is mooching of my revolver loads). The results tend to be a little bit of a splatter with proper shot placement but they stay down.

45-70 - oh yeah baby. Now this is what I call a rifle round. You want to shoot it, you want to feel it and you want to see the faces to your left and right on the range if you "accidentally" packed the 405gr lead rounds with triple compressed holey black under them and just smoked up everything for the next minute or two.
Honestly, the 45-70 has a temprament but can be tamed. If you use hard cast lead bullets and a moderate load it is still plenty deadly and more of a push in the shoulder than a kick. 350gr and 405gr lead or gas-checked lead rounds will take care of any animal north of Mexico. You should be more than OK with the number of rounds in the tube for hunting.

my personal recommendation:
45-70 for hunting, .357 for the range
if you want to compromise on one gun, either the 44mag or 45LC

45/70 is the ticket I have been shooting one for over 30 years. I have had 300 mag, 7mm mag and 30/06 and 30/30. Over all I like the 45/70 best for all around hunting. I still have my 30/30s but seldom use them now. I also recently picked up a 45/70 Magnum Research BFR revolver to go with my 50 caliber S&W BFR.

KIBarrister · Feb 28, 2021

Trigger Tuner said:
I'd like to add a 44 mag to my collection but the JM guns are way over priced IMO, and I've seen too many horror stories about the Remlins to take a chance on them. I'm holding out to see what Ruger does with them, hopefully they will make more stainless guns and do a real cut checkering, not the pressed in stuff Remington was doing.

Handle a Remlin before buying and you’re good to go. In some respects the late Remlins are better than 2000’s JM, with the exception of checkering. JM’s brag about hand-fitting is misplaced: they hand fit because they had to in light of the deplorable state of their tooling.

FWIW The sister rifle for the one I bought in 44 (a 45 LC) is I think still in the classifieds. The checkering being pressed is the only complaint on mine and if I understood JB2 correct that one should be a mid-‘16 production as well.

OP - glad to hear you found one you’re happy with!

Clifjr · Feb 28, 2021

Jd2020 said:
So many awesome guys here. Thanks for all the info and suggestions. I ended up feeling that there were no really wrong choices of cartridge in that list. And relative to semis, mag-fed, 80% guns, the commies in Annapolis and DC. Shouldn’t get around to hindering lever gun sales too soon. Calibers can be changed or added later.So just buy one, dam* it and enjoy!
A great MDS fellow here just sold me his Rossi 92 in .44 mag. Like the Marlins, there seem to be hit or miss stories on the world-wide google machine regarding Rossi. Many people seem to treat them as sort of almost complete kit guns. They stone and smooth the actions, delete safeties etc.
The original owner smoothed out the gun’s operation, refinished the stock (and steel!) added a skinner peep (I prefer aperture sights usually), removed the safety (so now I can go off half cocked...as they say) wrapped the lever in leather (like para cord wraps), etc. he also provided me a reloading set for .44 and some really helpful guidance.
Suffice it to say I’m very happy with it. Maybe it’s because I was limited to muzzleloaders and 12 ga. Slugs forever, but the recoil is fine. Even with the curved steel buttplate, which looks better than a rubber pad. Both the metal buttplate and short length of pull are assets in cold when shouldering the gun. I may get a leather lace up pad with cartridge holders though.
The 16.25” barrel and sub-5lbs is awesome. Recoil and accuracy might not be helped by it’s diminutive size but it’s not bad in the first department and the accuracy seems good. I’ve only shot a dozen rounds at 20 yards offhand but it was minute of soda can. It’s like a Red Ryder BB gun on steroids.
So thanks to the gentleman who sold it to me, and thanks to all those who took the time to write.

Congratulations on your pick! That will be a great gun for your needs! But a word of warning! Lever actions bread more lever actions! To me they are the most entertaining riffle to shoot! Enjoy it!

Lever gun caliber?

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