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Old June 10th, 2021, 05:39 PM #21
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$2k is why it hasn’t sold. If that is the Professional model and in good condition, $2k is a grood price.
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Old June 11th, 2021, 12:46 AM #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seawalker View Post
The barrel fit and bushing are the most important in terms of accuracy right? I only handled one Springfield. It’s some kind of custom FBI edition (not TRP) with a basic look, parkerized finish. Free State was selling it used for over 2k. The slide was so tight it was almost impossible to rack. Probably why it hasnt sold!
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$2k is why it hasn’t sold. If that is the Professional model and in good condition, $2k is a grood price.
My Dan Wesson 1911s are rolling at $1800 MSRP and the slides are like butter. They are more accurate than I am, and eat anything I feed them. There’s no reason a $2000 pistol shouldn’t function properly.
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Old June 11th, 2021, 01:30 AM #23
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I've had nothing but amazing luck with my RIAs before that horrible, horrible boating accident. Three of them, NIB until about 300 rounds each to warm them up and see what "needed" what (and none did), went to Camp Perry and got LTIs done in case any of my guys needed to borrow a .45. Were they going to take the whole match? Probably not but a pistol that will hold 9 ring at 50 yards with my shaky arm and issued questionable ammo for a few hundred bucks is a winner in my book.

Another guy on my team dropped over $2K to BUY a pistol that he then sent out to CU$TOMI$E. He shot with one of my spares.
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Old June 11th, 2021, 09:58 AM #24
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seawalker, the most important aspect of accuracy is the barrel/bushing fit. A note though. As in the Springer you posted about, or a slide that is “Les Baer tight”...that is the barrel lockup creating most of that hard to rack nature. Les Baer uses a slight ramp on the lower lugs to lock the barrel up that tight. The shooter then shoots the new pistol, basically battering it into fit. Hence, the origin of the 500 round break-in for a reliabilty. That is $300 of 45 ball to do the builders’ work. When I build one, it gets 50 rounds to prove or its back to the bench. I’ll know in two mags if its right. I prefer to leave metal on so I will use the remainder of the 50 round ls to burnish contact surfaces, inspect and assess the pistol and perform any necessary fine tuning. Then I run a hundred rounds through it to prove it...and have fun shooting.

A well fitted barrel will have flat lower lugs and have the tiniest sensation of resistance when racking the slide.

A close (tight) slide to frame fit is needed for top level bullseye type competition. Many times a close slide/frame fit is expected in a custom gun. I measure my slide/frame clearances with a dial indicator, no oil, barrel or bushing. Front and rear, both lateral and vertical. I can lump them like this, you can discern overlaps.

under .0012” or a tad over = bullseye precision
.0013” - .0022” = almost as good
.0023” - .0032” = still capable of 3” groups or better at 50 yards
.0033” - .0042” = good accuracy. A good fitted barrel is worthwhile. I have two Rugers with stock barrels, this kind of slide/frame fit and they are 2” guns at 25 yards
.0044” - .0062” = Tolerable but can still be Steel Challenge useable with a good barrel
wider than .0062” and decisions are to be made. Drop-in barrel system will work in it but not optimal.

A real world example. I found the data sheet on the the previously mentioned Tisas SDS. I edited the post to indicate the true clearances. You can see the front of the slide and frame have proximity issues. But its still around a 25 yard 2” gun...a little flier here and there...but it works. I like accurate gins and feel confident with this one within its intended use.
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Old June 12th, 2021, 09:05 PM #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnumite View Post
seawalker, the most important aspect of accuracy is the barrel/bushing fit. A note though. As in the Springer you posted about, or a slide that is ďLes Baer tightĒ...that is the barrel lockup creating most of that hard to rack nature. Les Baer uses a slight ramp on the lower lugs to lock the barrel up that tight. The shooter then shoots the new pistol, basically battering it into fit. .
I just watched hickok review the Springfield HRT Pro and he basically said the same. In any case, thanks for the info. I was thinking the slide rail tolerances were the cause.
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Old June 12th, 2021, 11:53 PM #26
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How Accurate is Accurate to you ?
How Tight is Tight to you ?

Do you seek to make a seperate hobby of learning arcane old school gunsmith and machinist skills ?

Magnumite lays out slide tolerances in great detail . If I may presume to dumb that down , unless it rattles like a morraca , slide tolerance isn't a limiting factor if you're not shooting Bullseye at Camp Perry level .
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Old June 13th, 2021, 07:30 AM #27
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Yes, you can build a 1911. May take several years and a fair amount of learning/tools, failed range trips and ammo but it can be done. I have seen this done many times, guy usually ends up with a good education and a 5 gallon bucket of parts that didn't work out for him.

This used to be a more common path for people years ago as there were less options out there. However, now, I would research a lot and find the one that is as close to possible with your final desire. Then, change the few things about it that you want changed and be done with it.

Or, look at the true custom shops and spec out what you want it to be. Likely will be $3k or more but you'll have something from a known maker with reasonable re-sale if you ever opt to let it go. If no custom shop makes what you are thinking of doing there is likely a good reason for that (it doesn't work well).

If you go the build route the end product (if you opt to re-sale) value may well be less than the cost of the parts as no one knows who did what to it or if it works. That is another downside of building your own, while possibly rewarding the value at the end isn't high.
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Old June 13th, 2021, 07:38 AM #28
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Originally Posted by ohen cepel View Post
Yes, you can build a 1911. May take several years and a fair amount of learning/tools, failed range trips and ammo but it can be done. I have seen this done many times, guy usually ends up with a good education and a 5 gallon bucket of parts that didn't work out for him.

This used to be a more common path for people years ago as there were less options out there. However, now, I would research a lot and find the one that is as close to possible with your final desire. Then, change the few things about it that you want changed and be done with it.

Or, look at the true custom shops and spec out what you want it to be. Likely will be $3k or more but you'll have something from a known maker with reasonable re-sale if you ever opt to let it go. If no custom shop makes what you are thinking of doing there is likely a good reason for that (it doesn't work well).

If you go the build route the end product (if you opt to re-sale) value may well be less than the cost of the parts as no one knows who did what to it or if it works. That is another downside of building your own, while possibly rewarding the value at the end isn't high.
Iíve built a couple of 1911ís from 80%ís.

I have about $1200+ in jigs/tooling. Mine turned out great. Itís a game of patience. Probably 50-60 hours of work, plus many more researching and understanding what needs done. It ainít cheap. If you consider my tools, gun parts, things I screwed up the first and second (and third) time, and had to buy again, my first 1911 cost $2200 to build. I really enjoyed it, and the gun works very well.
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Old June 13th, 2021, 08:13 AM #29
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Before Build Your Own AR- 15 became the popular thing , Build Your Own ( from stripped frame) 1911 was the happening thing . Much the same talking points ; build it just the way you wish, don't have to pay for oem parts you don't care for , and subsequently discard ( or put into spare parts bin ) . Except that AR- 15 are much easier to properly fit together .
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Old June 13th, 2021, 09:08 AM #30
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One more piece of info. If you use good quality fit ‘em right new parts, you will spend $1200-$1500 in parts only.

That amount can be whittled down to under $1k. That technique woukd require patience to wait for real deals on parts. Some items bought by others who didn’t use the parts and didn’t use or some type of massive sales from vendors. And THAT requires experience to know what pieces you need complete THAT build. Bottom dollar, building a pistol of decent quality to include a good take off barrel and MIM parts you are looking at $600-$700 on a 100% frame. That is Springer and Ruger territory.
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