AR Pistol Questions

jmike1487 · Jul 18, 2014

Coffee said:
So, let's say I:

-buy a lower from one of our Industry Partners

-complete the lower, including a sig brace

-purchase a 14" or shorter upper/barrel

Do I now have what is basically an SBR, with no wait/taxes beyond the wait for the lower?

Is the sig brace adjustable? How's it feel when firing shouldered?

Sorry for the noob questions, I didn't think I'd have the option to give this any thought.

I'm not mistaking you have a ar pistol with the sig brace. If you put a regular stock on it You would have un registered sbr

OrbitalEllipses · Jul 18, 2014

Coffee said:
So, let's say I:

-buy a lower from one of our Industry Partners

-complete the lower, including a sig brace

-purchase a 14" or shorter upper/barrel

Do I now have what is basically an SBR, with no wait/taxes beyond the wait for the lower?

Is the sig brace adjustable? How's it feel when firing shouldered?

Sorry for the noob questions, I didn't think I'd have the option to give this any thought.

Let's try and not call them SBRs...because it's a pistol. The Sig brace is NOT adjustable. KAK makes spacers for the Sig brace so that you can set a different static length of pull if you need to. As far as how it feels? It's got a GREAT cheek weld, but could benefit from a buttpad for shouldering.

Silverlode · Jul 19, 2014

OrbitalEllipses said:
Let's try and not call them SBRs...because it's a pistol. The Sig brace is NOT adjustable. KAK makes spacers for the Sig brace so that you can set a different static length of pull if you need to. As far as how it feels? It's got a GREAT cheek weld, but could benefit from a buttpad for shouldering.

This. You will likely need to create or buy some sort of spacer with the KAK, or just go with the new Phase5 mentioned earlier in the thread. However, if you are wearing armor you may want the adjustability available due to spacer use. I am tall/long arms (6'4") and I can shoulder the KAK with some types of armor w/out spacer. Definitely need a couple inches with normal clothing.

nomade · Jul 19, 2014

Are there any 9mm ar pistol Maryland legal?

Rob Jones · Jul 23, 2014

Coffee said:
So, let's say I:

-buy a lower from one of our Industry Partners

-complete the lower, including a sig brace

-purchase a 14" or shorter upper/barrel

Sorry for the noob questions, I didn't think I'd have the option to give this any thought.

Does the barrel have to be less than 14"?

Are there any caliber restrictions?

What about barrel profiles?

eruby · Jul 23, 2014

Rob Jones said:
Does the barrel have to be less than 14"?

Are there any caliber restrictions?

What about barrel profiles?

Experts should chime in, but if you are talking about a pistol, I don't believe anything you wrote is of concern.

The pistol buffer tube is what comes into play in re the 'Pistol'. IANAL

Brad · Jul 23, 2014

nomade said:
Are there any 9mm ar pistol Maryland legal?

All 9mm AR rifles are legal. you still need to comply with the barrel length etc. but 9mm dedicated lowers are cash and carry. Get yourself a lower and build away!

ten0glock · Jul 23, 2014

I would also like to no if barrel profile is a concern when building a pistol does it have to be an hbar?

foodpoison · Jul 23, 2014

ten0glock said:
I would also like to no if barrel profile is a concern when building a pistol does it have to be an hbar?

no

Rob Jones · Jul 23, 2014

Does everybody have copies of the 4473 how would you know how if your lower was transferred as rifle, pistol, or other? Are all lowers transferred as other? My 77 says "receiver" but I don't have my 4473. Should I be requesting a copy because one was never offered to me.

OrbitalEllipses · Jul 24, 2014

Rob Jones said:
Does everybody have copies of the 4473 how would you know how if your lower was transferred as rifle, pistol, or other? Are all lowers transferred as other? My 77 says "receiver" but I don't have my 4473. Should I be requesting a copy because one was never offered to me.

If your 77R says receiver (aka "O" aka "other") you should be okay.

Dialtone · Jul 24, 2014

Boats said:
I am running a Doublestar upper and 10.5" barrel. Good stuff so far. Everything I have read says that 10.5 is the minimum reliable length for DI. Any shorter and piston is the way to go for reliability. I am running a heavy barrel and a Troy medieval muzzle brake. The weapon barely moves when I fire it, and is quite comfortable to shoot.

A couple pointers:
If you are going DI drop the extra coin and get a chromed or Boron coated BCG. Waaaaaayyyyy easier to clean

Do yourself a favor and get a chromed barrel esp if you will be shooting steel core rounds.

A heavy barrel is heavy. It will make the weapon very nose heavy. I am thinking about replacing mine with a lightweight barrel because the balance is so off.

Any chance you're willing to share the details of this build?

rico903 · Jul 24, 2014

RoboRay said:
Checks or cash are the only paper involved.

Just make sure the lower was transferred either as a Pistol or Other. If it's ever been transferred as a Rifle, you can SBR it but it can never be a Pistol.

Just learned this tonite. Totally bummed me out. I guess I'd have to see if my dealer would dig back a few years and see what what checked on the form. Have a feeling I'm screwed. Is this a Fed or MD law?
I have never had a dealer offer me a copy of a 4473 so if my dealer won't dig thru his records what are my options?

Pinecone · Jul 24, 2014

Lower should have been on a 77R, unless a dedicated pistol caliber or .308.

You should have a copy of the 77R, and while you may not be able to read it, the number is enough to figure how it was transfered.

It is Federal law. Once a rifle, always a rifle. So if you ever put a rifle stock on that lower, you cannot legally make it into a pistol, no matter how it was transferred. You can make it into an SBR (Short Barreled Rifle) by filing a Form 1 and paying your $200 tax.

Trumpet · Jul 24, 2014

Rob Jones said:
Does everybody have copies of the 4473 how would you know how if your lower was transferred as rifle, pistol, or other? Are all lowers transferred as other? My 77 says "receiver" but I don't have my 4473. Should I be requesting a copy because one was never offered to me.

I don't have either the 4473's or 77r's.....a good reason to get a couple new lowers. You know, for the purpose of record keeping :innocent0

dtmeyers · Jul 24, 2014

I think I'm over-reacting and paranoid

I think I know the answer to this but I rely on the wisdom of mdshooters...

I have lower and the 4473 is marked as 'other' - I bought it in Virginia before I moved.

If I remember correctly, Virginia has a form as well but there is no 'other' - only pistol, rifle, or shotgun - and I have no idea what the lower was transferred as. Does it matter what the VA form had my lower listed as? Should I even try to track it down?

I would think the VA form doesn't matter so long as the 4473 lists as 'other' but I always second guess myself with firearm laws.

Boats · Jul 24, 2014

Silverlode said:
Move your light to the side rail and put your AFG further out? I have a number of 16" HBARs and they really don't seem unbalanced to me at all.

Adding to the problem is the short ACE pistol buffer tube. I dont wanna move the light because I am recalcitrant like that. Just looking to keep the same setup but remove weight with a lighter barrel. Thanks for the idea though. If (after the new barrel) it still feels weird I may try moving the light.

Dialtone said:
Any chance you're willing to share the details of this build?

Sure:

Lucid Optics red dot (I am really impressed with these, definitely great bang for the buck)
Del-Ton forged mil-spec lower receiver
Doublestar mil-spec flat top upper rec
Doublestar heavy barrel, 10.5", chrome lined
Yankee Hill Machine diamond quad rail, Mid length
Troy Industries medieval muzzle brake
Ace Inc pistol buffer tube
Colt mil spec fire control
Magpul rail covers and AFG
Stark Equipment grip (ugly but super comfortable)
CAA cheek rest.
Magpul BUIS (not in this picture)
Stramlight TLR2-HL with pressure pad (this is an older picture showing a TLR-1 HL)
Magpul Gen 2 mags with ranger plates
Viltor BCM Gunfighter charging handle
Badger Ordinance gen 2 tac latch
Doublestar Chrome BCG

eruby · Jul 24, 2014

dtmeyers said:
I think I know the answer to this but I rely on the wisdom of mdshooters...

I have lower and the 4473 is marked as 'other' - I bought it in Virginia before I moved.

If I remember correctly, Virginia has a form as well but there is no 'other' - only pistol, rifle, or shotgun - and I have no idea what the lower was transferred as. Does it matter what the VA form had my lower listed as? Should I even try to track it down?

I would think the VA form doesn't matter so long as the 4473 lists as 'other' but I always second guess myself with firearm laws.

4473 (Federal) trumps Va (state) form in this case. :thumbsup:

jmike1487 · Jul 24, 2014

Well since md is allowing the sale of lowers again. I was wondering if you could now go into VA or Pa and buy a lower without filling out the 77r and instead filling out 4473? Any thoughts on this? I'm planning to buy a few lowers for future builds.

eruby · Jul 24, 2014

jmike1487 said:
Well since md is allowing the sale of lowers again. I was wondering if you could now go into VA or Pa and buy a lower without filling out the 77r and instead filling out 4473? Any thoughts on this? I'm planning to buy a few lowers for future builds.

Wouldn't this be like going to Virginia and buying an AK from a dealer who would sell it to you? Nix.

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