Can I import a stripped Colt lower?

fred333 · Apr 10, 2016

I reckon this'll likely have to be run by a qualified lawyer for a more definitive answer, but I thought I'd run this by the MDS members first in case it's been answered before (I was unable to locate anything via the search)...

Is it legal to import (via a Maryland FFL) an old, stripped (i.e., no internal components; just the receiver shell) Colt AR-15 select-fire lower from the EU into Maryland and Form 1 it as a semi-auto SBR?

I think this is actually a two-part question. The first part being whether it's legal to import a stripped AR lower; and the second part being whether it's legal to SBR a select-fire lower? Anyone have experience with either?

StantonCree · Apr 10, 2016

I think my partner attempted to do this with a stock but Engage ended up getting them.

I know I'm not gonna really be of ANY help here but it would probably behoove you to call Nate at Engage or go visit him for advice on this. I believe they have done this. I'm sorry that's the only real "advice" I can provide but at least I can point you to the guys that know their stuff.

5.56blaster · Apr 10, 2016

If it has a hole for the sear it may be a no go. But I will be the first to admit I have no clue as to how BAFTE thinks anymore.

mopar92 · Apr 10, 2016

If it's a former machine gun IE 3rd reciever hole it's a no-go. ATF considers it once a machine gun, always a machine gun and needs to be demilled. (Reciever cut in 3 places/pieces) with the money you'd spend paying a good smith to put it back together and remove the 3rd hole, plus refinishing it, you'd probably be looking way over cost of a repro lower (think 10x).

fred333 · Apr 10, 2016

I had a feeling the additional sear holes might be a problem and my next stop was Nate for the definitive answer, but I appreciate the input.

aquaman · Apr 10, 2016

Once a machine gun always a machine gun. Get an 80% and send it off to get the engravings you want and build away

zoostation · Apr 10, 2016

Once a machine gun always one as has been said. They've even gone so far as to ban AK's that were imported commercially as semi-auto but had receivers where the extra hole had been welded over before importation.

fred333 · Apr 10, 2016

aquaman said:
Once a machine gun always a machine gun.

Hmmm....I wonder....could I have the FFL import the stripped receiver and transfer it to me (via Form 4) as a "machine gun" and then I'd just kit it out with semi-auto internals as originally planned. That way, ATF can call it a "machine gun", I pay the same $200 for a tax stamp and we both go our merry ways.

Wait....yeah, I forgot we're prohibited from importing machine guns. Oh well....

Threeband · Apr 11, 2016

To be transferable a machine gun had to be registered before 1986.

By the way, did anyone mention "once a machine gun always a machine gun"?

jmike1487 · Apr 11, 2016

Threeband said:
To be transferable a machine gun had to be registered before 1986.

By the way, did anyone mention "once a machine gun always a machine gun"?

The pre 86 always wins!!

IMBLITZVT · Apr 11, 2016

"Once a machine gun, always a machine gun" has gone to court and was struck down.

Doing a quick search, I think this is the case, I pulled from the web. Its been a while since I had read it but it sounds like what I remember:

Vollmer v. Magaw, it appears the legal basis for their policy never even existed, indeed:

"Having examined the Bureau's arguments from text, structure, legislative history, and underlying policy, we find no reasonable basis for its once-a-machinegun-always-a-machinegun interpretation of the Firearms Act. Nor are we persuaded by the district court's own explanations of why the Bureau's position was nonetheless substantially justified. Although, as the district court observed, the Bureau had followed its interpretation of the Firearms Act since at least the early 1980s, we do not see how merely applying an unreasonable statutory interpretation for several years can transform it into a reasonable interpretation."

The ATF had a bunch of crap like this that got overturned. SBRs can be un-SBRed...etc.

Oh... did someone mention once a machine gun, always a machine gun

It really is amazing how saying like this will live on for ever!

That said, there is still no way in Hell you are getting a M16 receiver legally back into the country in one piece, as a semi or transferable.

zoostation · Apr 11, 2016

I wonder if it would help if he could get Curio and Relic status for the gun by submitting it to ATF. They will do it for individual guns. I somehow doubt they would do it for that one though. Being both a scary shaped piece of aluminum and not in its original, assembled configuration.

fred333 · Apr 11, 2016

zoostation said:
I wonder if it would help if he could get Curio and Relic status for the gun by submitting it to ATF. They will do it for individual guns. I somehow doubt they would do it for that one though. Being both a scary shaped piece of aluminum and not in its original, assembled configuration.

I'm ahead of you. I contacted ATF this morning to see about doing that (awaiting a call back). My thinking is that the only reason they might even consider an exception is because it IS a stripped receiver (and I'd immediately be registering it as an SBR) and NOT a scary working "assault weapon". But I could be wrong.

Boss94 · Apr 11, 2016

Unfortunately the fact you want to SBR it has nothing to do with the fact it's a machine gun ( stripped or fully assembled its a exported maching gun). Which atf would never approve for import. If they did every class 3 dealer in the land would be importing them by the truck load. Your best bet is to find a semi lower that looks like a colt unit and purchase that.

IMBLITZVT · Apr 12, 2016

I agree, C&R means nothing in this case. Its a Machine gun. You might be able to import as a post sample but the idea of an SBR, Transferable or any legal semi is just not going to work. Either way, they are not going to list an AR/15 or M16 on the list before its 50 years old anyway. I mean they still have not listed all Maxims and Brownings which were the first series of MGs. Actually the Tommy gun people did get them on there but you can bet M16s and Ak47s will be the last ever added. However if he had to modify the receiver to weld up the sear pin, it would not be a C&R anyway...

Look at it this way. If this receiver was in the US, you could not legally get it! So how you are going to add importing it to the list of impossible to do things... not going to happen. Better luck playing the lottery or getting struck my lightning, seriously.

Save yourself a boat load of time and forget this one. Nodak Spud makes cool retro receivers. http://www.nodakspud.com/AR Lowers.htm

Abacab · Apr 12, 2016

You can't import a machine gun and transfer it to a civilian. It has been that way since The Union Workers Protection Act of 1968. Pardon me, the Gun Control Act of 1968. The receiver was drilled for the auto sear. It's a machine gun. Not happening. End of story.

Can I import a stripped Colt lower?

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